Most Accurate Cornet

jhatpro · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 2:30 am Post subject: Most Accurate Cornet

Which cornet regardless of make, model or vintage, is easiest to play in tune?
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:23 am Post subject: Re: Most Accurate Cornet

Craig Swartz · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:36 am Post subject:

"Which cornet regardless of make, model or vintage, is easiest to play in tune?"

Probably the one in the hands of the player with the "best" ear...

benlewis · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:41 am Post subject:

I have been very happy with my Schilke XA1...

HTH

Ben

Richard III · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 6:59 am Post subject:

Ah the quagmire of modern cornets. For your usage, don't go for shepherd's crook. Lack of projection and all that. Best intonation? Another quagmire. The desire for the best cornet can go on forever. See the process with Jim Cullum:

https://riverwalkjazz.stanford.edu/?q=bonus-content/lamps-and-cornets-jim-cullum-jr

Don't you still have a Conn 80A?
_________________
Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

jhatpro · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 7:03 am Post subject:

Yeah, the 1955 80A is still on my first team. But always scouting the field for something interesting. I just traded one of my vintage trumpets for a Conn 38A special, a kind of 80A with a .459 bore. I think it was made in 1941.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

Richard III · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 7:52 am Post subject:

There's a reason most current players play trumpets, I think. Ease of projection. It can't be just that most of them have never played a cornet? Or is it?

There is a certain sense to playing a trumpet with good intonation. With that solved, and the projection issue not a problem, the only thing left is the appropriate early jazz technique and style.

I say all of this because I am an admitted cornetaholic. I love the little buggers. But I struggle with the same issues playing vintage cornets.
_________________
Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

blbaumgarn · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Jul 2017 Posts: 705

I can only echo what Seymore said. I have played the Getzen Eterna extensively and think they are great. I played some on a Schilke long cornet, the 1A and that was heavenly. Also, the Bach long cornet is very nice, and doesn't have a shepherd's crook as one commenter mentions later. No major intonation issues on the Eterna or Schilke that I ever had to deal with.
_________________
"There are two sides to a trumpeter's personality,
there is one that lives to lay waste to woodwinds and strings, leaving them lie blue and lifeless along a swath of destruction that is a
trumpeter's fury-then there is the dark side!" Irving Bush

Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:20 am Post subject:

Richard III · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2021 6:51 am Post subject:

Yes, an interesting topic. We try to get an authentic sound. But really the style is what is authentic. People played what they had available at the time. A player who started in the 20's didn't stay with the same horn their entire life. They, like us, always looked for a better horn to play. Many played the Conn 80A early on. Most did not stay with it. Some went to trumpet. Most progressed to more modern to the times cornets.

We like to emulate our heroes. So we will buy that tired old cornet seeking the same sound. But what we are also emulating is that cornet when it was new recorded on systems of that time period. We are not hearing the live sound.

The OP got some advice which I'm trying to take to heart. Play the horn that gives you the best intonation, the ability to play the music the way you want and the sound will be yours. Doesn't matter what the instrument is, be it cornet or trumpet.
_________________
Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

Andy Del · Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2021 12:50 pm Post subject:

Having played in brass band, orchestras (esp opera) where not only pitch but tone quality is sort of important, I can say I have had 3 cornets I feel did the business, or at least came close.

1. Schilke XA7. Just great. Warm enough to cope in a brass band, projects brilliantly. Intonation is terrific.
2. Schilke AC2. Like the Bb, but a slightly warmer sound at times, and only a few odd intonation challenges, mostly fixed now.
3. Old recording. It’s my beach house house t is a wonderful free blowing, tune instrument. Far darker and ‘thick’ sound than the Schilkes. This I do a brass band!

Cheers

Andy
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so many horns, so few good notes...

oxleyk · Heavyweight Member Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 4180

Jim, you'd like my Bach long model. It just sits in its case and never makes a mistake. Then I pick it up, start playing, and ruin everything.

Kent

Richard III · Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:46 pm Post subject:

I wondered why people kept mentioning brass band. Then I realized the OP did not specify what he was going to use the cornet for. His intent is trad jazz in a traditional lineup of instruments.
_________________
Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

Danbassin · Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:34 pm Post subject:

Mine.

Sorry for the seemingly flippant answer, but I do happen to be incredibly spoiled with my main instrument, a CORNETTE, designed by Dave Monette. Mine was the second ever built, started shortly after Ron Miles’s prototype, but with some differences and upgrades that came along with changes Monette was making in their design process. Dave and the folks in the shop have described the response and intonation characteristics of these instruments as ‘like playing the piano’ and, much like my piano playing, this instrument is a heck of a lot better playing than I’ll ever be on it, but it keeps me coming back to make more and better music over and over.

That said, I’ve had the good fortune to play the first-ever Monette cornet, which legend has it was completed just slightly too late for Wynton to use on the “Carnival” album, as well as another Chicago-era cornet that was for sale at Dillon Music, which - while silver plated aftermarket, and therefore missing and messing with Dave’s final adjustments - was the finest cornet I’d played in my life up until that point. The 900 Series, heavier model Bb and C cornets I’ve also played in passing, both at the shop and for a few toots in lessons with teachers who owned ones.

Now, anticipating hater backlash, these cornets ARE truly exceptional, but I also recognize they’re far from conventional. To these ends, the endorsement of the 900 series models by the likes of Niles Eldridge and James Klages should be taken seriously - issues of consistency of response and intonation of cornets (all models) with Monette’s design innovations are practically in a different world from other conventional designs. All this said, I’ve played a Bach 238 C cornet which was absolutely lovely, I owned a prototype Edwards Eb which was pretty and sweet and nothing like problem Ebs people dread, and I’ve also truly enjoyed playing some Schilke and Getzen models in Bb and C. Mouthpiece design makes a big difference in all of this, too, and looking back on a brutally-fun 3 hour+ second line style gig I once played on a Conn Director, my Prana B1-1FLR6 mouthpiece helped make all that music possible.

Happy practicing - music, not just brass playing,
-DB
_________________
Daniel Bassin
Conductor/Composer/Trumpeter/Improviser/Educator
I play:
Monette - CORNETTE/PranaXLT-STC Bb/MC-35/Raja A Piccolo;
Kromat C-Piccolo; Thein G-Piccolo; Various antique horns
MPCs - Monette Unity 1-7D and DM4LD