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LyonLover Regular Member
Joined: 21 Aug 2018 Posts: 49
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:11 pm Post subject: Grunting and Valsalva maneuver |
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recently my teacher pointed out that i use the valsalva maneuver and grunt a lot. Especially during lip slurs. Sometimes it not on the way up, but on the way down. I try to not do it but it's seemingly impossible not to.
Any tips? |
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starkadder Heavyweight Member
Joined: 01 May 2008 Posts: 542
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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This exercise teaches you how to open your throat and what that feels like:
https://www.deniswickapp.com/buzz/c/0/i/24388677/practical-aid-beautiful-sound
Any practice mute will work, and even getting a straight mute to rattle will have the same effect.
Playing with ear plugs can help you build awareness when you're closing off your throat and making the sound. |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 1991 Location: USA
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zaferis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2011 Posts: 2310 Location: Beavercreek, OH
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Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2022 7:25 am Post subject: |
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I've seen and heard that ultimately there can be a number of reasons that this begins/happens. Resistance, Back pressure, breathing, clentching (diaphragm specifically), then habit & confidence.
One has to do with fighting the lack of resistance from the instrument.. try practicing with a cup mute (give it a fair amount of time) and see if this relieves the issue. And this may give you a reason why.
Then it becomes a confidence thing, you have doubts that the slur won't happen without a nudge, so you nudge it. Back up and work on slurs that you can execute without this happening - with a small almost inaudible crescendo before the slur and move at a moderate tempo (too slow will cause stagnation, too fast will mask proper sluring) Louis Davidson's "Trumpet Techniques" an outstanding text for this an other "issues" as well as an awesome approach to the trumpet.
I have and issue with grunting to "kick" notes at times.. I found that learning how to engage it, helps me stop it.. If I can make it happen on demand, I can then turn it off.. my simple exercise - while holding a long tone, add the grunt/growl in a slow rhythmical manner: on, off, on, off, on, off..
Identify the move, control it, don't do it. _________________ Freelance Performer/Educator
Adjunct Professor
Bach Trumpet Endorsing Artist
Retired Air Force Bandsman |
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Edwardsrk New Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2019 Posts: 5
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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2022 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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I want to second Steph Smith's beatVM as previously mentioned. I dealt with a hesitation that through talking with her I discovered was part of the valsalva maneuver. It was basically like my tongue froze when I went to articulate and I couldn't get a note out without breath attack. I had the same issues with grunting with my slurs too.
Going through her exercises over the past 2 months has been extremely transformative for my playing. I relearned how to breathe, how to articulate, how to release the air into the instrument as opposed to blow, and it addressed tension in your tongue and throat as well as posture(pelvis position especially).
I can't emphasize enough how much she has saved my career through her exercises, but I would definitely reach out to her before this tension eventually turns into something worse.
Best of luck, you will get through this! |
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Billy B Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 6126 Location: Des Moines
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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2022 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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Ex-lax _________________ Bill Bergren |
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Jaw04 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 31 Dec 2015 Posts: 898 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2022 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: Grunting and Valsalva maneuver |
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LyonLover wrote: | recently my teacher pointed out that i use the valsalva maneuver and grunt a lot. Especially during lip slurs. Sometimes it not on the way up, but on the way down. I try to not do it but it's seemingly impossible not to.
Any tips? | I have a student that started doing this. I struggled with helping him stop this grunting habit. Habits can creep in quickly and take a while to erase. Keep at it.
I myself did this when I was in middle or high school as well. You just have to relax your upper body (chest, neck, throat, shoulders) and get the release of air down to a correct, natural, function. It should be a relaxed sensation without clenching. Instead of creating resistance in your throat, use the resistance of the mouthpiece and horn, use the resistance of your chops and tongue. |
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Billy B Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 6126 Location: Des Moines
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 6:03 am Post subject: |
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Sing everything you play. _________________ Bill Bergren |
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Mike Sailors Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Oct 2012 Posts: 1838 Location: Austin/New York City
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 8:54 am Post subject: |
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I've heard GREAT players do this. I myself have heard it during some parts of my playing career.
I think it's a result of the tired ol "suck and blow" trumpet pedagogy that pervades so much of trumpet instruction these days. I'm not sure there's anything anyone can tell you, other than find a teacher who perhaps has a different approach. _________________ www.mikesailors.com |
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