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Tight slotting good or a hindrance?


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Vin DiBona
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have two very different yet outstanding horns. A Schilke B1 and a 50th anniversary Bach 190/37.

I've owned the Schilke since 2006 and it was hand picked between 3 of them. It was a difficult choice because they played virtually identically. The one I chose kinda picked me. I played that horn for everything for 16 years and it never let me down.

Last year, a friend of mine (who was a frequent section member/extra in the Chicago Symphony) asked if I would like to buy his hand picked 190/37. After trying it, I said yes.

The Schilke is much more open with looser slotting and with the 72ish bell, plays more spread but still gets out there.

The Bach is much tighter slotting and its 37 bell projects like mad.

Both are very, very outstanding instruments and let me sound like me, just with a slightly different quality. Surprisingly, the Schilke is easier to get up to the G above high C and beyond. (I am not a lead player, but it is nice to have that little bit extra range).

I use the same mouthpiece a GR e65M in both. I have two of them and the older one works a bit better in the Schilke as that what the mouthpiece I used in that horn for 12 years.

If I need something different in the Bach, a use an older 5C with a 25 throat.

To be honest, I never really cared for a 37 bell until this horn.

As long as one can take two different horns and play them with confidence, it shouildn't really make that much of a difference.
If it does, play the one you like the best.

R. Tomasek
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OldSchoolEuph
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Joined: 07 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vin DiBona wrote:
I have two very different yet outstanding horns. A Schilke B1 and a 50th anniversary Bach 190/37.

I've owned the Schilke since 2006 and it was hand picked between 3 of them. It was a difficult choice because they played virtually identically. The one I chose kinda picked me. I played that horn for everything for 16 years and it never let me down.

Last year, a friend of mine (who was a frequent section member/extra in the Chicago Symphony) asked if I would like to buy his hand picked 190/37. After trying it, I said yes.

The Schilke is much more open with looser slotting and with the 72ish bell, plays more spread but still gets out there.

The Bach is much tighter slotting and its 37 bell projects like mad.

Both are very, very outstanding instruments and let me sound like me, just with a slightly different quality. Surprisingly, the Schilke is easier to get up to the G above high C and beyond. (I am not a lead player, but it is nice to have that little bit extra range).

...

As long as one can take two different horns and play them with confidence, it shouildn't really make that much of a difference.
If it does, play the one you like the best.

R. Tomasek


Every so often TH sees a post that should be carved in stone. This is one.
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Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
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lipshurt
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Joined: 24 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A loose slotting horn would be:
Selmer B700 with big bell and 358 Venturi. Even that slots pretty nice and no sacrifice in accuracy.

Martin committee. Loose slots until you bet in the upper register and then the slots are way tighter than a Bach or Benge.

Benge 3 is pretty loose in the lower and middle registers, and tight slots start about G above the staff

Schilke B1 pretty loose, but not problematic.

The real loose slotting horns are horns with worn out valves, and horns like that can be VERY appealing to some players. I have worked on several “magic” Bach’s that people had that they said played so much better than other Bach’s that they were anxious about ever finding a horn as good. Those horns only held about a 5 second vacuum test. The only kind of play that can deal with that is someone with real good basic mechanics with their chops. Like they can pick up any horn cold and make an entrance at any volume. Most people need some help from the horn in those situations. And the more dangerous the situation, the more they gravitate to tight slots.

Tight slots would be your basic Bach and yamaha type horns, which include a lot of other brands as well that are going for the basic Bach security. A real nice slotting horn in the lower and mid and upper registers is the conn connstellation. Slots the same all over the horn, and an awful lot of amazing playing was recorded on those (Maynard at his best, Thad jones at his best, Chet baker at his best, Tom Harrell and on and on) and also the conn 22b is a tight secure slotting horn IF all is well with the valves and main slide.

Like someone said above, there is no horn that slots so hard that it’s an actual problem. It’s just a little extra security and sure footedness that people like and rely upon. Someone used to secure slotting can really be thrown off when playing something looser. Having said that, even the loosest horn isn’t really that loose unless the valves are not sealing up good. So a loose horn working. Right is just a bit smoother when playing fast, and maybe a little easier to negotiate interval jumps when you are getting fatigued.

Not that much difference. You could easily bounce between two horns on the extremes with no big issues, unless of course there is leaking somewhere. Keep in mind that sometimes loose valves can really feel great. They bite you though when you least expect it.
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OldSchoolEuph
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lipshurt wrote:
Not that much difference. You could easily bounce between two horns on the extremes with no big issues, unless of course there is leaking somewhere.


Maybe some players can, but lots of us cannot.

I wanted to use my 1938 Selmer once, which has an incredible rich tone while still preserving enough "pure trumpet" to work in an ensemble setting. It was too exhausting to bend to match the others (non K-mod, so ample bending required on a tight slotting horn).

Christmas 2020 I decided to use Byron's B2. I was not happy with my intonation (thankfully just me and organ due to covid), because I was just not a strong enough player to be 100% responsible for accuracy on every note through all the services. It requires a stronger player.

Sure, there are guys who can play anything. Most of us however are not in that category. We need what fits us best.
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Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
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