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Rollin for higher pitch



 
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FRANCIS MAZIERS
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Joined: 04 Dec 2020
Posts: 25
Location: France

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:33 am    Post subject: Rollin for higher pitch Reply with quote

I have experienced, when I roll my lips inside (rollin like an old man explain in Jeff Smiley's BE book ), that the pitch goes higher with less effort with the proper air pressure applied. And I was wondering why?
Is it because the part of the lips, that is vibrating, is more tense in this configuration ? Is it because the physical characteristics of the flesh, that is exposed to the standing wave, has changed in this position ? Or is it because the total mass is reduced? Or all of that?...
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Cordially.
Francis.
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JayKosta
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Joined: 24 Dec 2018
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Location: Endwell NY USA

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The precise reason that various lip formations and positions 'works' probably is different for different people - different lip, teeth, etc.

But the 'simple answer' is that the 'working position' allows the lips to vibrate / pulsate at the desired pitch more easily.

Yes, it probably is related to the tension, flexibility, amount, shape, etc. of lip tissue that is exposed to the air flow.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
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Larrios
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Joined: 14 Nov 2003
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Location: Serooskerke (Walcheren), The Netherlands

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Francis,

Check out this page on Jeff's website, and scroll to article 3 on Strength vs. Leverage:

http://www.trumpetteacher.net/resources.html

Ko
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FRANCIS MAZIERS
Regular Member


Joined: 04 Dec 2020
Posts: 25
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies.
To be more precise, I feel that, in higher pitch, it is my skin, above (upper lip) and under(bottom lip) the red part of the lips, that is involved.
The skin is more stiff there and I was wondering if it wasn't, in part obviously, which would allow a faster vibration with less effort than in a FARKAS embouchure where we have to stiffen the red part of the skin with a lot of efforts with the mask.
It's just a guess and I'd like to hear your opinions on it.
Francis.
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JayKosta
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Joined: 24 Dec 2018
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Location: Endwell NY USA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1658091#1658091

especially the bits about 'individual feelings'.
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
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kalijah
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Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 3257
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The skin is more stiff there and I was wondering if it wasn't, in part obviously, which would allow a faster vibration with less effort than in a FARKAS embouchure where we have to stiffen the red part of the skin with a lot of efforts with the mask.


Yes. And it is obvious. There is more natural "stiffnes" in terms of natural elasticity. Also, the action of "holding" the lips in. That is, rolling-in, adds stiffness to the muscular substrate as well.
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FRANCIS MAZIERS
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Joined: 04 Dec 2020
Posts: 25
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I have my answers. Thanks very much to all !
Francis.
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