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Restoring yea or nay



 
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OldOlds
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Joined: 14 Aug 2022
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:58 am    Post subject: Restoring yea or nay Reply with quote

Back in 1976 I purchased an Olds Opera Fullerton cornet. I think it dates to the early 60's. I had no idea until recently what a rare gem it is. I have been a casual player since high school, got it out once a year or so and for long periods it just sat in the case. Now I am playing more, playing 4th in an amateur jazz band and 2nd or 3rd in our local community band. I am in a position to put some money in it and I have a back up instrument I can use. (A late 70's Bach Strad came from left field.)
So, I would like some insight into having an instrument restored. The finish is quite worn and the 2nd and 3rd valves are giving me fits. Will it affect the sound, will it ruin it, will the heavens open and angels sing?
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Dayton
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Joined: 24 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Restoring the horn may affect the sound, but if you don't have reliable valves you have a horn you cannot depend on for performances. That limits its utility. So restoring makes sense if you intend to use it for anything more than at-home practice.

Worth noting that a valve overhaul is expensive. You might wind up paying $500-600 to have the valves re-plated, plus whatever other work needs to be done. That does not take into account cosmetic work that you might want done, such as refinishing, which can also be expensive. A full restoration can be quite pricy, so make sure the horn is worth the cost.

Edit: I'll add that I've been in your situation. I inherited a 1950s Holton Super Collegiate cornet. It needed a valve overhaul and a new leadpipe. I also had the third valve slide reworked so that I could use it while playing. The cost was over $900, but I wound up with a dependable horn that I now use regularly.


Last edited by Dayton on Fri Aug 19, 2022 3:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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TrumpetMD
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Joined: 22 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've restored 4 trumpets, happy with the results. For me, it didn't impact the sound. Refurbishing a horn is a personal decision. And you're not likely to recoup the cost of refurbishing, if you sell it.

I restored my main players (1974 Bach 43*, 1980 Bach MLC), and 2 others I did for sentimental reasons (1965 Bach 37, 1957 Olds Ambassador).

Three of the horns were refurbished by Kanstul, with the last one done by Mark Metzler. They were re-lacquered/re-plated, rebuilt valves (the 43*), replaced lead pipe and/or tuning slide on 3 of them (red rot), and some dent work.

Refurbish, dent work, prep work, re-lacquering, and replacing lead pipe or tuning slide (if needed) will likely run $800 to $1200. Rebuilding the valves will likely run $450 to $600.

Mike
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Bach Stradivarius 43* Trumpet (1974), Bach 6C Mouthpiece.
Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns.
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stuartissimo
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2022 4:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is really something you should discuss with whomever you trust to do the restoration.

The finish is mostly cosmetic, chances are low it’ll have a big impact on the sound. Regardless, it’ll be pricey.

Restoring the valves however, can make a big difference, and not just to the valve action itself. I recently had the valves restored on my Olds Recording trumpet (they were sticky, it had to be done). Before the restoration, it played and sounded very, very nice. After the restoration, it played and sounded even better. Though I was very anxious to have anything done to the trumpet, I’m very glad I did. I’m not sure I would have if the valves hadn’t been sticking though. You can try some thicker valve oil first (Hetman 4 is a good try, it won’t make your valves fast though): it’s cheap and will give you an idea of what the cornet will be like with better compression.
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1975 Olds Recording trumpet
1997 Getzen 700SP trumpet
1955 Olds Super cornet
1939 Buescher 280 flugelhorn
AR Resonance mouthpieces
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cbtj51
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Joined: 24 Nov 2015
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Location: SE US

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote



Regarding valve restoration, I have a very high mileage Benge trumpet that I have owned since new in 1971. I had experienced a spring barrel separation on the 3rd valve in 2018 that prompted a repair necessity. The valves looked rough, but compression was still adequate according to James Becker at Osmun on his initial evaluation. After discussion of the process and setting proper expectations, Mr. Becker completed a total valve job in house over a period of a little more than 2 months. It was not cheap but the total experience was a real value price wise for the quality of workmanship that I experienced. The horn was a very good horn for decades before the valve work and is still a daily workhorse, a true utility trumpet and is once again a great horn, better than ever!

I had no work done on the finish as it was and is still a great looking trumpet as well!

Life is Short, find the Joy in it!

Mike
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'71 LA Benge 5X Bb
'72 LA Benge D/Eb
'76 Bach CL 229/25A C
‘92 Bach 37 Bb
'98 Getzen 895S Flugelhorn
'00 Bach 184 Cornet
'02 Yamaha 8335RGS
'16 Bach NY 7
'16 XO 1700RS Piccolo
Reeves 41 Rimmed Mouthpieces
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nieuwguyski
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Joined: 06 Feb 2002
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Location: Santa Cruz County, CA

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2022 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your other option would be to have the horn functionally restored, without worrying about the cosmetics. Having the valves sorted out, up to having them rebuilt, simply makes the horn a usable instrument. You could have any other functional issues dealt with at the same time and end up with a fine, playable instrument that simply shows its age.
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jeirvine
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Joined: 29 Apr 2022
Posts: 327
Location: Baltimore, MD USA

PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not all valve issues need $$$$ to fix. If they are leaky with low compression, then yes, a full replating might be necessary. But if they are just sticky, they may just need a good cleaning, light honing, and/or alignment. Just find a reputable expert who can give you an idea of what's really needed.
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1932 King Silvertone Artist Bore
1945 Buescher 400
1946 Olds Super
1947 Olds Super Cornet
1948 Couesnon flugelhorn
1951 Olds Special
1956 Martin Committee
1964 Olds Recording
1968 Bach 329 C
1996 Bach 37
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