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Stradbrother Veteran Member
Joined: 13 Apr 2015 Posts: 150
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2022 12:28 pm Post subject: What is the main modern orchestral C trumpet? |
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Hey Friends
I apologize if this has already been asked before, I tried combing through the search results but didn't find anything.
What is the current main orchestral C trumpet out there in major orchestras?
From what I've learned, Bud developed the modern orchestral sound with a 229 large bore Bach C, I could be totally wrong there.
From there I heard Phil Smith carry on that tradition, and over the years, I've seen a ton of folks with 229 Bach C horns with an H pipe in orchestras.
But more recently, I see some orchestral trumpet players with Yamahas, almost equally to the amount of Bachs I see today.
Are these Xenos taking over as the main orchestral trumpet these days?
I only ask because as a subbing player myself, I want to make sure I'm set up to match tone whenever I'm called to sub. In college I found success on a vintage Getzen Eterna large bore C horn, but in more recent years, I'm finding it hard to match my section mates with that horn. The Bachs seem to have such a standardized orchestral sound that is tough to replicate. |
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trompette229 Veteran Member
Joined: 21 Mar 2016 Posts: 203
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2022 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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Bach dominated the landscape for decades but the Artist model Chicago and NY Yamahas are now played in: NY, Boston, Chicago, LA just to name some of the top tier orchestras. They are a similar style horn to the Bach but they are rapidly becoming one of the horns of choice in the orchestral world. |
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Stradbrother Veteran Member
Joined: 13 Apr 2015 Posts: 150
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2022 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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trompette229 wrote: | Bach dominated the landscape for decades but the Artist model Chicago and NY Yamahas are now played in: NY, Boston, Chicago, LA just to name some of the top tier orchestras. They are a similar style horn to the Bach but they are rapidly becoming one of the horns of choice in the orchestral world. |
That's what I thought. I recently attended a SF Symphony concert and it was incredible, but afterwards as I looked into the section, I noticed some Yamahas. |
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irith Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Sep 2008 Posts: 879
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2022 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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I would agree that the Yamaha Artist models are fast becoming, if they aren't already, the most common horn of choice these days - though I can't speak for outside the US as well. Certainly there are still plenty of people winning and keeping jobs with Bach or others, but overall I think the Yamahas are the "safe" choice. _________________ Bach, Schilke, Pickett mostly |
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Andy Del Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 2665 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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It depends on where you are working, and what sort of players you are working with.
As an example - 7 players (mostly no longer working full time in orchestras) saw:
New York Bach 7/7
Early Elkhart Bach 37
Early Jupiter 1600
Bach 43/25R
Bach belled frankenhorn
Mt Vernon Bach 37
Kanstul 1500A
The blend was as good as you can want, judging from the video recording I heard.
Mainstream horn and have the section our head. Better still listen and match as you go. With that, your Getzen may just do the trick… _________________ so many horns, so few good notes... |
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Manuel de los Campos Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 654 Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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Sell that Getzen to me, I allways wanted one but over here they are very very rare.
I play Antoine Courtois Delmotte C trumpet, never had any issue with blending with others: YOU are the instrument _________________ Technology alone is a poor substitute for experience. (Richard Sachs) |
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OldSchoolEuph Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2012 Posts: 2441
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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irith wrote: | I would agree that the Yamaha Artist models are fast becoming, if they aren't already, the most common horn of choice these days - though I can't speak for outside the US as well. Certainly there are still plenty of people winning and keeping jobs with Bach or others, but overall I think the Yamahas are the "safe" choice. |
While I have endorsed Yamaha since the mid-70s, I have to disagree. When I look at who is playing what, you can't rule out Schilke. While shrinking, they still have a chunk of that market. By far surpassing that is indeed Yamaha, but in these orchestral Cs, Bach 229 variants still hold the lead by a nose. _________________ Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com
2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20 |
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nltrumpet Veteran Member
Joined: 11 Nov 2019 Posts: 206 Location: Washington DC
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2022 8:32 am Post subject: |
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Even though I don’t own any of their horns, there are a decent number of orch trumpet players using Shires that come to mind |
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Vin DiBona Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2003 Posts: 1473 Location: OHare area
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2022 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Chicago has a mix of horns.
Estaban Batallon is on Herseth's Bach.
John Hagstrom is still on the Yamaha.
Mark Ridenour plays a Powell. (I believe he still does, anyway)
Tage Larson still plays a Yamaha.
There are rumors I've heard, but they are just rumors.
R. Tomasek |
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OldSchoolEuph Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2012 Posts: 2441
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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Vin DiBona wrote: | Chicago has a mix of horns.
Estaban Batallon is on Herseth's Bach.
John Hagstrom is still on the Yamaha.
Mark Ridenour plays a Powell. (I believe he still does, anyway)
Tage Larson still plays a Yamaha.
There are rumors I've heard, but they are just rumors.
R. Tomasek |
This jumped-out at me as having an inaccuracy, so I contacted John Hagstrom. He sent me this in reply to post here to correct the record:
“The Bach C I’m playing on was built in 1953 and played originally in the CSO by one of my predecessors, Rudy Nashan, who was 2nd trumpet from 1950 until 1961. It’s a perfect match for Bud’s 1955 Mt. Vernon, and this pair of C trumpets are the instruments heard on most of the CSO/RCA recordings that were made under Fritz Reiner. The Yamaha is a fine instrument, and I gave away tons of my time to help develop it beginning in 2001. Even so, these particular two Bach C trumpets are superior, especially as a pair in companionship within the sound of the whole orchestra.”
So that's 2 Bachs. _________________ Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com
2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20 |
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Vin DiBona Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2003 Posts: 1473 Location: OHare area
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Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2022 9:24 am Post subject: |
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The rumor was true. Someone told me he was on a Bach, but I could not confirm.
R. Tomasek |
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