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Bach 6 Mouthpiece


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ricealumni95
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Joined: 24 Jul 2021
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 3:55 pm    Post subject: Bach 6 Mouthpiece Reply with quote

Anyone know the throat and back bore of this mouthpiece ?
I just bought one from the 60’s I believe (Corp …No dot )

Also the rim ? I’ve heard it’s on the flatter side which I’ve heard is good for thinner chops. I’ve got very thin chops. (Not very much red at all)
Recently I’ve been on a Patrick 1.5 CR
I’m thinking I’ve been on mouthpieces too big for my chops all these years.
I read the Vachianno take on mouthpieces and the importance of matching appropriate mouthpieces size to individual chop sizes etc…
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Shifty
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 4:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Bach 6 Mouthpiece Reply with quote

ricealumni95 wrote:
Anyone know the throat and back bore of this mouthpiece ?
I just bought one from the 60’s I believe (Corp …No dot )

Also the rim ? I’ve heard it’s on the flatter side which I’ve heard is good for thinner chops. I’ve got very thin chops. (Not very much red at all)
Recently I’ve been on a Patrick 1.5 CR
I’m thinking I’ve been on mouthpieces too big for my chops all these years.
I read the Vachianno take on mouthpieces and the importance of matching appropriate mouthpieces size to individual chop sizes etc…

It depends. Trumpet or cornet? 6, 6B, 6BM, 6C?

All answered by the Bach Mouthpiece Manual, published on a lot of sites. Here's one: https://www.johnkealmusic.com/Images/document/AV2BA901_Original_1889_web.pdf

Yes, it is pretty flat. A matter of taste. It seems more folks discuss the Bach 5 rim, which is less so. I have both, like both. Not sure which I like best.
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ricealumni95
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

6 (as in a straight 6 trumpet mouthpiece )
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Irving
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to the catalogue the back bore is a 10. The throat is either a 27 or 28. Some of those old 6 models were from Mt Vernon, but not stamped. I have a 6C corp that has a 28 hole. If you like it don't modify it. Get a newer 6 and modify that one instead.
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Andy Cooper
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could I suggest that you compare the scans of a 1 1/2C and a 6 at

https://trumpet.cloud/mpc/

The 6 is capable of a lot of sound with what some would call "core".

If the rim is too flat for you and you would like a little more "zing" in the sound, consider the 6B or 6BM (26 throat 24 backbore) or the Schilke 9 (26 throat and the Schilke C backbore).
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Halflip
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe the Bach "straight" 6 (no letter) trumpet mouthpiece was Vincent Bach's personal favorite.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The image of a Patrick 1.5C is at -
https://patrickmouthpieces.com/trumpet-mouthpieces/#!/1-5C/p/11504052/category=2605557

It looks to me like the cup on the 1.5C might be a little less deep than on a Bach 6 - but perhaps the internal volume of the cups are similar.
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ricealumni95
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks everyone. I’ll be curious to see how it feels.
I’m able to control the sound the way I want it much better on a smaller rim and a deeper cup. I’ve experimented with the 5B recently, but after a while it’s cutting into my chops. As I mentioned I’m thin lipped (almost no red) I’ve always had great range and endurance on bigger mouthpieces but now I’m all about getting my sound more compact and more focused. I studied at Rice with Wilt and Ghitalla and now 25 years later 😦
I’m still at it ! Crazy how time flies!
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Shifty
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm certainly no expert, but I know what I like. I've got pretty thin lips as well. The straight 6 seems to be the best fit on my Connstellation 28A, although it seems to change from day to day.

I do like deeper than average cups and fairly flat rims. So I have a Curry 6TC and a 6TF that I like to use on my trumpet. They feel a lot like my Bach 6C, but give me the depth that I like.

I have a Curry 6FLD for my flugelhorn; I like it, but also like my Stork 5FL a bit more for most applications.

I play a Curry 5BBC on my cornet, but only because until recently he didn't offer a 6BBC. I see your point about the Bach-style 5 rim, but I've gotten used to it.

If the Bach 6 rim size and shape is good for you, a budget safari should start with www.currympc.com/Trumpet-Standard-Series-.html
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ricealumni95
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you so much. I’m hopeful that I’m moving in the right direction , at least for now
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Halflip
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shifty wrote:
I have a Curry 6TC and a 6TF that I like to use on my trumpet. They feel a lot like my Bach 6C, but give me the depth that I like.

Unlike Bach, where the same size mouthpiece will have different rim shapes for different depths, Curry has standardized on a single rim shape for each numbered size regardless of depth. For the size 6, Curry uses a version of the Bach Mount Vernon 6C rim shape (which agrees with Shifty's observation).

Shifty wrote:
If the Bach 6 rim size and shape is good for you, a budget safari should start with www.currympc.com/Trumpet-Standard-Series-.html

If you like the Bach 6 "no letter", you may not like the Curry Standard Series size 6 mouthpieces because, since Curry consistently uses a 6C rim, it will be rounder than the Bach "no letter" 6 rim. The Bach 6B and 6C rims get progressively rounder than the "no letter" 6. I just wanted to point that out if you explore Curry options.

Mark Curry would probably be willing to make any of his size 6 Standard Series mouthpieces with a 6 "no letter" rim, but they would be custom orders with a somewhat higher price. I've ordered Mark's designs with a custom size and rim shape and have always been extremely pleased with the result.
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MrOlds
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I read somewhere that Roger Voisin played a Bach 6.

The few times I payed one I thought the rim profile was flat-ish kind of like a 2C or maybe a 1X?

If you like the depth of the Bach 6 but flat rims aren’t your thing you could look at a Stork B cup in whatever diameter fits you.
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ricealumni95
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2022 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’ve been playing on the Bach Corp 6 (No dot) and it’s great. Fits my chops really well. Is it worth looking for a Mt Vernon if I run across one or should I stick with the Corp?
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Irving
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2022 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you find one go for it. There is a 6 corp on ebay if interested.

I have a couple of Mt. Vernon 6 corp cornet mouthpieces. They are very different than the corp. Very deep with a wide, flat rim with a pronounced bite. I have no idea about the Mt.Vernon 6 trumpet mpc. Keep in mind that the 6 family is one of Bach's oldest designs. They changed throughout the years, but I say this because of the mouthpieces that I have picked up. I can only talk about the mpcs that I have. I would say that the corp models (Elkhart) have the sharpest rims. I have a 6C corp that has a 28 hole. Very sharp rim, which gives it a more metallic sound. I have a NY 6C that is very deep. Deeper than a 6B. One thing that stayed the same is the diameter. The width seems consistent, but the rims and cups changed.
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cplt
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2022 12:32 pm    Post subject: Curry 6's Reply with quote

Just wanted to chime in about the Curry 6's. I just got a 6BC a couple of weeks ago, and it's been a great match for my C trumpet. Its rim is rounder and more comfortable than the Bach 6, 6C, and 6BM I've tried. Sound and playability are excellent -- even got a compliment from the (community) orchestra conductor a couple of weeks ago :)

Interestingly, my Monette Tradition Plus 6 seems to have a *very* similar rim — I have no trouble going back and forth (I like the Monette on my Bb). The Curry 6BC plays a bit tighter and brighter than the Monette, but the feel is comparable.

Just a thought if you end up liking the 6's — although the Tradition Plus line is about 3x what a new Curry costs, so it's definitely a bigger investment.
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cheiden
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2022 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been experimenting with an older Bach 6 and I like that I can play consequentially louder than my usual setup, which I really need sometimes. Only problem is that it plays darker and I need something projects better. With my limited research the throat and backbore aren't unique but the cup is more V-shaped than the 1.5C cup I normally use. Makes me wonder if a shallower V-cup would be a better option for me. Any other suggestions for a piece that's easier to play louder and project better on?
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ricealumni95
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2022 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 6 definitely brings darker undertones in my sound. I can play fortissimo and my sound stays together. I’m not getting much zing but that’s what I’m trying to avoid. If I could describe my sound on the 6, it’s mellow but not like I sound on my flugel mpiece…more trumpet like …kind of a buttery large symphonic sound. My range is fine. I’m still able to play up to double F easily as I was on my Bach 1 1/2.
The rim on the 6 is very comfortable and it pairs well with my thin lips I think ..provides more surface area to sit on. This mouthpiece does not feel
small at all. It’s a bathtub of a cup and just what I’ve been searching for to help round out my sound and give it more expansion. The 6BM felt really small and stuffy, so I stuck with the 6.
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Shifty
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2022 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Halflip wrote:
Unlike Bach, where the same size mouthpiece will have different rim shapes for different depths, Curry has standardized on a single rim shape for each numbered size regardless of depth. For the size 6, Curry uses a version of the Bach Mount Vernon 6C rim shape (which agrees with Shifty's observation).


I have a Bach 6 and 6C as well as a Curry 6TFD, 6TC and 6TF. I can't find those combinations on any of the comparators but, visually, it looks to me like Curry standardized on the Bach straight 6 instead of the 6C. All my Curry pieces seem very flat, ala Bach 6.

I wonder if Mark would be willing to chime in?
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Dale Proctor
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2022 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Bach 6 cornet mouthpiece is very nice, and comes stock with the 24 backbore. I bought a Bach 6 trumpet mouthpiece and didn’t like it at all - my sound on it was pretty tubby.
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Andy Cooper
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2022 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dale Proctor wrote:
The Bach 6 cornet mouthpiece is very nice, and comes stock with the 24 backbore. I bought a Bach 6 trumpet mouthpiece and didn’t like it at all - my sound on it was pretty tubby.


Perhaps because the trumpet mouthpiece has the #10 backbore. I played the 6 at one time with the 24 backbore and larger throat on C trumpet. Worked pretty well.
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