Articulation in upper register

LyonLover · Regular Member Joined: 21 Aug 2018 Posts: 49

Definitley figured out my endurance problem. Any time I rapidly increase my playing hours per day i get that issue for a bit. So I have so stay consistent with my practice schedule.

Anyway, I can slur up to a nice open high G (above high C). However I still have issues articulating above high C. Runs to high C and up the the Eb for example in the Haydn concerto, I could play it slurred great, but articulation sometimes causes airballs still. With scales up there its the same way. My articulation disrupts upper register playing. I've tried K modified tonging but the problem doesn't help much. Seems like a lot of people have the opposite problem as me where slurring is harder.

Richard III · Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2022 2:20 pm Post subject:

Each time you tongue, there is an extra load on your embouchure. Therefore, you are like me. Slurring range is way different than tonguing range.
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abontrumpet · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 May 2009 Posts: 1765

Kind of like Richard III is saying, when you "airball" that means that vibration has stopped.

So the goal when tonguing is to keep the lips available to vibrate immediately. This means you cannot disrupt the "position" (the shape, the ingredients) necessary to produce that vibration.

This means you attack it from two fronts: 1. how easy can you make a sound (response of the lips to the air) in the upper register -- the better the response the clearer the articulation; and 2. how little can you disrupt the lips when articulating.

Chances are it is less an issue that can be cleared up by addressing the tongue (like you tried to do with k-modified) and more of the above. But a few people don't seal the system properly when tonguing sometimes.

Robert P · Heavyweight Member Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2595

JayKosta · Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 6:15 am Post subject:

The air flow is stopped by the tongue, the lips stay in 'playing position'.
There shouldn't be deliberate 'lip motion' during tonguing.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
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BeboppinFool · Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 5:15 pm Post subject:

Doc Reinhardt called this phenomenon "multiple embouchures."

You're probably "shifting gears" to go from slurring to tonguing (and vice versa).

His remedy for this was to take any flexibility drill and play it tongued first and repeat it (without stopping to "shift gears") slurred. Most people find this uncomfortable at first but after awhile you'll start to tongue and slur on the same setting. If you add dynamic variations to this you'll derive even more benefit from this correctional procedure.

Incidentally, he would always have you start tonguing and slur (without stopping) on the repeat. This establishes what he called "the legs of the inner embouchure" which helps assure correct slurring technique.

Come on over to the Reinhardt Forum if you want to find out more about this.
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TrumpetLebowski · New Member Joined: 26 Nov 2022 Posts: 4

Interesting topic

Doug Elliott · Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 8:11 pm Post subject:

I have a slightly different take on this, maybe because I've experienced it myself.

Some players use tongue shaping to focus the oral cavity to the note being played. (Some refer to that as "air speed" but I don't use that terminology because that's not really what's going on). Some players rely more on the chops and/or air ("compression" but I don't like that label either) to create and focus the pitch. The most efficient players combine those two approaches into one. (And then there's pivot too, depending on other things).

When you articulate you're having to move the tongue away from its ideal focus position momentarily. And in that split second you have no support, so it doesn't work. You can focus and play those notes without articulation, but you can't play them with articulation. Once you become aware of that situation you can work on finding a more efficient tongue shape that allows a smaller motion to articulate so can better keep the focus. I have found that double and triple tonguing very lightly in the high range (all ranges, really) helps to learn what it takes to have a very small motion for articulating in the affected range. Dee-Dee-Gee Dee-Dee-Gee Dee-Dee-Gee for example, just barely moving your tongue in the smallest possible way. Then you can apply the same position to single tonguing. That may seem backwards but it works better than working on single tongue alone.

The exact same thing applies to middle and low range too... Learn how to keep focus in every range while articulating, so you're not overshooting or undershooting when you articulate.

kgsmith1 · Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2022 10:28 am Post subject:

JVL · Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2022 5:38 am Post subject:

hello
i agree with Bebopfoolin about "multiple embouchures".
Either your "up" embouchure is the right one and you must adapt or mid and low range from this one (for instance if you are a natural upstream player that has been taught to play like a downstream one), or there's some wrong adjustments you're doing at one point when ascending.

Then, you must practice very slowly tongued, slurred, double and triple tongued, at a mp or comfortable volume, Clarke exercices, licks etc, in the high register, going step by step.
It will take weeks, months, year to coordinate your whole embouchure / tonguing.
Forza !