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hackney_wick
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Pops
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tommy t. wrote:
If I were an at home, treat myself, medical type looking for a book on diagnosing allergies, for example, or a would-be do-it-yourself home motorcycle mechanic about to tackle a valve adjustment on a Ducati, for another, etc. etc., I don't believe that I would be turning to books written in the 19th century or the first half of the 20th century. In fact, when I was in a college music program in 1960, my Chicago based trumpet prof. insisted on a Farkus chop setting. If I were starting today, I don't believe that I would want to learn the "smile" embouchure.

`
There may have been some progress since Arban. Just a thought . . .

Tommy T.


I felt the same way Tommy. So dated. 90% stopped at the top of the staff.
Somebody did finally rewrite the music in the Arban book, expand the range and add over 200 pages of new studies.

Me.
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BayernTpt
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My top three:
Clarke Technical Studies
Plog Warm Ups
Schlossberg book
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ljazztrm
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clarke's Setting Up Drills
Pops - New Arban Book
The old Arban's Characteristics Studies practiced this way: 1-12 do as many as you can in a 1/2hr back to back
Irons
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Steve A
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 12:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Essential Books Reply with quote

jungledoc wrote:


What books would experienced players and teachers recommend for players at different stages of development, from beginner to intermediate to more advanced?

I am, of necessity, self taught, a trumpet beginner, but with wider knowledge of music. Yeah, I know what you're all thinking, but really, there is no qualified teacher within several thousand miles of where I live.


A few thoughts:

- I play for a living, and have way more books than I use. Some I bought because someone I knew said they were great, so I bought them, but was already working from something else, and never really got to them. This should go without saying, but I think is often overlooked: the essential books are the ones you will actually use.

- Most music, most of the time isn't wildly high, fast, loud/soft, or otherwise difficult. Books that help you develop good and consistent sound and command in the core range in a variety of articulations and dynamics, and build fluency in different keys are a good goal. There are many of these. Unless you plan to become highly specialized (commercial lead player, baroque trumpet soloist, 19th century style cornet player), exotic specialized books are probably neither necessary nor wisely chosen.

- No book is more valuable/effective than the knowledge of what to do with it and how. There's no substitute for hearing these things done well, and having someone demonstrate and prescribe exercises for you. Which book you use can often be incidental to that, rather than essential.

- Respectfully, you may be thousands of miles from a qualified teacher, but you're not thousands of miles from internet, and neither are many qualified teachers. Skype may not be a perfect replacement for in person instruction, but money spent on good Skype lessons will probably lead to more improvement than the same money spent on books without guidance on how to use them, and which parts to use.
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homecookin
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Essential Books Reply with quote

Steve A wrote:
jungledoc wrote:


What books would experienced players and teachers recommend for players at different stages of development, from beginner to intermediate to more advanced?

I am, of necessity, self taught, a trumpet beginner, but with wider knowledge of music. Yeah, I know what you're all thinking, but really, there is no qualified teacher within several thousand miles of where I live.
y

A few thoughts:

- I play for a living, and have way more books than I use. Some I bought because someone I knew said they were great, so I bought them, but was already working from something else, and never really got to them. This should go without saying, but I think is often overlooked: the essential books are the ones you will actually use.

- Most music, most of the time isn't wildly high, fast, loud/soft, or otherwise difficult. Books that help you develop good and consistent sound and command in the core range in a variety of articulations and dynamics, and build fluency in different keys are a good goal. There are many of these. Unless you plan to become highly specialized (commercial lead player, baroque trumpet soloist, 19th century style cornet player), exotic specialized books are probably neither necessary nor wisely chosen.

- No book is more valuable/effective than the knowledge of what to do with it and how. There's no substitute for hearing these things done well, and having someone demonstrate and prescribe exercises for you. Which book you use can often be incidental to that, rather than essential.

- Respectfully, you may be thousands of miles from a qualified teacher, but you're not thousands of miles from internet, and neither are many qualified teachers. Skype may not be a perfect replacement for in person instruction, but money spent on good Skype lessons will probably lead to more improvement than the same money spent on books without guidance on how to use them, and which parts to use.


This is it !!!
This gets down to the heart of the matter.
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homecookin
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have gotten a lot of very good suggestions in this thread.
There used to be a lead trumpet player here in town who was really an amazing player.
He passed away about 10 or 12 years ago. He was from an older generation, he had worked with the big bands back in the day... Tommy Dorsey, Jimmy Dorsey, and a whole host of territory bands. He had killer chops, you could go to his house and wake him up at 5 a.m. and hand him his trumpet and he would pop a DOUBLE C, then hand you back the trumpet and then go back to sleep. He was originally from deep East Texas, he used to tell me that when he was a kid he would sit out in the barn and practice all day.
He only had one trumpet method book... the Arban book, and only one copy of that book.
As Steve A pointed out, there is a wealth of material out there, but the only thing that really counts is what you do with it.
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ljazztrm
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

textr
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Posted: 05 Jan 2009 16:13    Post subject:
For many years there was an amazing lead trumpet player here in town who has since departed this earth that had just incredible chops. He had the kind of chops that you could go over to his house and wake him up at four in the morning and hand him his his trumpet and he would pop a double "C" and then go back to sleep(although no one actually did that).
This guy grew up in East Texas in the depression era and the only trumpet method book he ever owned was an Arban book. In fact he told me one time that when he was a kid he would sit out in the barn and practice the Arban book all day (of course he rested when he needed to).
One time I went to his house and his Arban book was on the music stand and I looked at it , he had made small hash marks on the pages every time he played the complete page and there were literally hundreds
of hash marks on almost every page in the book especially the pages with
lips slurs and intervals, and the characteristic studies.
FWIW
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This is the 2nd time I've heard this. I grew up listening to old jazz from the 20's onward. Can one of you guys share this guy's name. I'm curious. Thanks and all the best. Lex
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BobD
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just got the Mitchell on Trumpet Book 1( guess there are 3 in print) and it came with a DVD of very good player playing all the exercises. I find it really helpful to hear how it should sound as far as attack, tone etc.

Just a thought to add to this old thread.
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jungledoc
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Essential Books Reply with quote

Steve A wrote:
- Respectfully, you may be thousands of miles from a qualified teacher, but you're not thousands of miles from internet, and neither are many qualified teachers. Skype may not be a perfect replacement for in person instruction, but money spent on good Skype lessons will probably lead to more improvement than the same money spent on books without guidance on how to use them, and which parts to use.


No arguments here. You might notice that this is a year-old thread. At the time I posted my question about books, I had no idea that one could take internet music lessons. It might have been replies on this thread that made me aware.

Shortly after this, I posted a request for suggestions of internet teachers. When I saw the name Bruce Haag pop up for the second time, I looked at his site, emailed him. On June 27 I took my first Skype lesson with Bruce. I now am using a bunch of books that he prescribed (even some that had been abandoned by former students that he was able to send to me). Bruce has been a great teacher and a supportive friend. I couldn't recommend him highly enough.

By the way, my "library" now includes several Claud Gordon titles (so far I've spent most time with Physical Approach and Daily Trumpet Routines), Arban's, Rhythms Complete, by Charles Colin and Bugs Bower, and I'm just starting in Irons. Except for Rhythms Complete, I think all of them were recommended at least once by someone on this thread.

And, by the way, your comment about "you're not thousands of miles from the internet" is only really true for the past couple of years. For a long time we had such a slow connection that on-line lessons would have been impossible. It's only been for about 2, maybe 3 years that we have been able to connect at fast enough speeds to support Skype. As it is, we still pay by the MB for our connection.
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chef8489
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know I am reviving an old thread, but it is 2022 and I am updating my books catalogue and almost Christmas. what do you think are the essentials. Are they pretty much the same? Thought Id revive this instead of starting a new one. Right now I have
Arbans Complete Conservatory Method for Trumpet

H.L Clarke Technical studies for the cornet

Rich Wiley The Arbans Jazz Scale Connection

Rich Willey- Guiseppe Concone Fifteen Vocalise Op 12 " Finishing studies for high voice"

Rich Willey -Vassily Brandt Thirty -Four Orchestral Etudes for trumpet

Rich Willey " Upside -Down scale Studies for Improvisation"

Tom Woo - Progressive scales and Arpeggio studies

Then I have a few beginner and intermediate books like

Foundations for superior performance warm-ups and technique for band Rich williams
Essential elements for band book 1
First practical studies for cornet and trumpet book 1 and 2.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A lot depends on what you want to 'get out' of the book.

The books you mention all contain plenty of good material that would be wonderful if you can learn to play them.
But maybe not, if you are looking for instructional material about 'how to do the actions to play them'.
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chef8489
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayKosta wrote:
A lot depends on what you want to 'get out' of the book.

The books you mention all contain plenty of good material that would be wonderful if you can learn to play them.
But maybe not, if you are looking for instructional material about 'how to do the actions to play them'.


No I am not looking for how to. I am just looking at stuff we should have in our stables and play to get better and more skilled as players. Some items on my Christmas wish list are as follows.

Charlier 36 Etudes Transcendantes for trumpets in English
Allen Vizzutti Trumpet method book 1
Saint Jacome Grand Method for Trumpet or cornet
Schlossberg Daily Drills and Technical Studies for trumpet
Earl Irons 27 groups of Excercises
Concone Lyrical Studies


Im wondering if there is anything I am really missing I should add to my wish list.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chef8489 wrote:
...
Im wondering if there is anything I am really missing I should add to my wish list.

----------------------
I like the various 'fake books' of popular songs, standards, blues, dixieland, jazz, etc. The songs are enjoyable to play, have 'listener appeal', and can help with general playing improvement.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
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chef8489
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayKosta wrote:
chef8489 wrote:
...
Im wondering if there is anything I am really missing I should add to my wish list.

----------------------
I like the various 'fake books' of popular songs, standards, blues, dixieland, jazz, etc. The songs are enjoyable to play, have 'listener appeal', and can help with general playing improvement.

I do have the fake book of hymns as well as easy pop melodies I got last year for Christmas and a few other books with various stuff like star wars, les mis, and other half Leonard stuff my mother bought for me. I need to go through them and see what all I have.

The Dixieland really interests me.
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Subtropical and Subpar
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chef8489 wrote:
JayKosta wrote:
A lot depends on what you want to 'get out' of the book.

The books you mention all contain plenty of good material that would be wonderful if you can learn to play them.
But maybe not, if you are looking for instructional material about 'how to do the actions to play them'.


No I am not looking for how to. I am just looking at stuff we should have in our stables and play to get better and more skilled as players. Some items on my Christmas wish list are as follows.

Charlier 36 Etudes Transcendantes for trumpets in English
Allen Vizzutti Trumpet method book 1
Saint Jacome Grand Method for Trumpet or cornet
Schlossberg Daily Drills and Technical Studies for trumpet
Earl Irons 27 groups of Excercises
Concone Lyrical Studies


Im wondering if there is anything I am really missing I should add to my wish list.


I also quite enjoy the Bitsch, Bosquet, and Reynolds etude books.
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Dayton
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Im wondering if there is anything I am really missing I should add to my wish list.


You have Arban's Method and Clarke's Technical Studies. You also have some of Rich Willey's scale books, and Brandt's etudes. That's a solid start.

You have Schlossberg and Irons on your list. Those are excellent books to add, as are Charlier, Concone and St. Jacome.

You might consider Eric Bolvin's fine Arban Manual or St. Jacome Manual to give you some ideas regarding what to practice from those methods, and how.

You have book 1 of Vizzutti's Method on your list. I'd suggest adding book 2 as well. Lots of great material there, and all of it more contemporary than the 19th century methods.

Have you considered adding jazz transcriptions and/or orchestral excerpts? Michael Sachs' "The Orchestral Trumpet" is a good starting place for excerpts. For jazz transcriptions, pick whomever you like. Ken Slone's "28 Modern Jazz Trumpet Solos" 1 & 2, or Hal Leonard's "The Trumpet Omnibook" offer a nice variety if you don't know where to start. They also cover a more contemporary trumpet range than the 19th century methods (if played as written), so will give your chops a good workout.

Speaking of range, there are any number of books that address it through technical studies. Clarke and Schlossberg will certainly give you a workout, as will Vizzutti and a few of the studies in Tim Woo's book. [Though any book can be an "upper register" book if you continue the studies upward.] But Walter Smith's "Top Tones" and David Baldwin's "Lips of Steel" are worth considering because they focus on range and endurance through very well-written etudes.

Have fun!
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kgsmith1
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2022 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flexus and Stamp
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