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thecoast Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 138 Location: San Bernardino County, CA
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:43 pm Post subject: Getzen 900S Eterna Classic Series Bb: Is $800 a good deal? |
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So I found on eBay a Getzen 900S Eterna Classic Series Bb. It was selling for $1,200 OBO. I offered $800. Offer was accepted. $902 out the digital door. It's got a minor dent on the bell near the main tuning slide. Everything else seems perfect. Do you think that's a good deal? _________________ —Bach Omega
—Yamaha 631G flugelhorn w/ Warburton 1FLX
—John Packer JP272 tenor horn w/Denis Wick 3
—Yamaha YTS-354 trombone
—King 627 “baritonium”
—Akai EWI 5000 |
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Manuel de los Campos Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 654 Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 3:58 am Post subject: |
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Yes _________________ Technology alone is a poor substitute for experience. (Richard Sachs) |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 5:02 am Post subject: |
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That's a good price! I got a mint 900dlx lately and paid 1200 for it. I'm becoming a Getzen fan... |
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Croquethed Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2013 Posts: 614 Location: Oakville, CT
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 6:43 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, you drove a fair bargain for yourself. I thnk most 900s in good shape can go for 1000 with wiggle room on either side. |
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2596
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 8:47 am Post subject: |
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If it's in solid shape it's a good deal in comparison to what I see they go for new. I've never played one but they're supposed to be as close a copy to the original Severinsen Eterna as Getzen could make. If you get a leadpipe replaced the replacement Getzen/Allied sends is the one they put on the Eterna Classic. The finger hook is different.
If you hunt on eBay you should be able to find an original Severinsen for about the same money - but watch out for red rot on the leadpipe which they were known for if they weren't kept clean religiously. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9025 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 10:16 am Post subject: |
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I've had both an original Severinsen and a current model Eterna Classic. Regarding the Classic coming as close as possible to the original, my understanding is that pertains mainly to current (not older) Eternas.
I couldn't tell the difference between the original Severinsen and the modern Classic. These are both excellent horns.
One caveat. Listen to Doc. If that's the sound you want, go for it. But if it's not, get another horn. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn
Last edited by kehaulani on Tue Feb 07, 2023 1:53 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2596
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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kehaulani wrote: | I've had both an original Severinsen and a current model Eterna Classic. Regarding the classic coming as close as possible to the original, my understanding is that pertains mainly to current (not older) Eternas.
I couldn't tell the difference. These are excellent horns.
One caveat. Listen to Doc. If that's the sound you want, go for it. But if it's not, get another horn. |
Right - the ones designated Eterna Classic. Supposedly the Eterna after Doc left wasn't the same or became not the same, I've never played one of those either.
Of course I seem to recall reading somewhere the the Severinsen Eternas changed subtly over time from the start of their run, I've never played an assortment of them to know if I'd be able to tell any difference. I would assume they all had similar characteristics.
Maybe somewhere is the story of why Doc left - maybe he just didn't want to be contractually tied down to appearing with one horn any longer? I seem to recall that he came back to Getzen briefly but it didn't last for whatever reason. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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thecoast Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 138 Location: San Bernardino County, CA
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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kehaulani wrote:
Quote: | One caveat. Listen to Doc. If that's the sound you want, go for it. But if it's not, get another horn. |
That's good insight because, though it has been said rightly "you're going to sound like you," it is also true that the trumpet you're playing will sound like the trumpet you're playing.
From late in 1978 (if memory serves) up until late 2002, I played a DEG (Getzen) student trumpet. I liked the sound I got from it and it served me well for those many years until I started experimenting with affordable (read Chinese) horns as well as some other American student horns and a couple East European (Czech) horns.
Today, I have only one Chinese horn (a flugel that I'm quite fond of, though I wish I had a rich uncle to buy me a Conn Vintage 1 flugel because of the amazing intonation). I had a Bach Stradifakius C trumpet that I ended up GIVING away because it's illegal to sell knockoffs.
I'm looking forward to receiving my Getzen pro horn and I hope that it feels more or less like the Getzen student model (in all the good ways). I suppose getting the Getzen Capri C trumpet was instrumental (maybe pun intended) in pushing me to get the 900S. If it doesn't work out, I'll end up selling it. But I'm thinking it will work out just fine. _________________ —Bach Omega
—Yamaha 631G flugelhorn w/ Warburton 1FLX
—John Packer JP272 tenor horn w/Denis Wick 3
—Yamaha YTS-354 trombone
—King 627 “baritonium”
—Akai EWI 5000 |
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Big C Regular Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2018 Posts: 53 Location: Bay Area
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2023 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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Robert P wrote: | If it's in solid shape it's a good deal in comparison to what I see they go for new. I've never played one but they're supposed to be as close a copy to the original Severinsen Eterna as Getzen could make. If you get a leadpipe replaced the replacement Getzen/Allied sends is the one they put on the Eterna Classic. The finger hook is different.
If you hunt on eBay you should be able to find an original Severinsen for about the same money - but watch out for red rot on the leadpipe which they were known for if they weren't kept clean religiously. |
Uh oh... my Severinsen has definitely not been kept clean religiously. How do I check for red rot in the lead pipe and -- maybe an even dumber question -- what does it mean, practically speaking in terms of playing the horn, if it has some? _________________ '78 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
'59 Reynolds Argenta cornet |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9025 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2023 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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If it were me looking for Red Rot, I'd take it to a local repairman with a scope and let him tell me. As far as effect, I would say, generally, it doesn't matter if it doesn't matter. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn |
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JayKosta Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018 Posts: 3304 Location: Endwell NY USA
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2023 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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Big C wrote: | ... what does it mean, practically speaking in terms of playing the horn, if it has some? |
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If it 'has some' that means it is likely to get worse unless more thorough cleaning and drying is done on a regular basis.
How fast it will worsen is difficult to predict. If it gets bad enough, there will be a hole through the pipe - and that will degrade playing. _________________ Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2596
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2023 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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Big C wrote: | Robert P wrote: | If it's in solid shape it's a good deal in comparison to what I see they go for new. I've never played one but they're supposed to be as close a copy to the original Severinsen Eterna as Getzen could make. If you get a leadpipe replaced the replacement Getzen/Allied sends is the one they put on the Eterna Classic. The finger hook is different.
If you hunt on eBay you should be able to find an original Severinsen for about the same money - but watch out for red rot on the leadpipe which they were known for if they weren't kept clean religiously. |
Uh oh... my Severinsen has definitely not been kept clean religiously. How do I check for red rot in the lead pipe and -- maybe an even dumber question -- what does it mean, practically speaking in terms of playing the horn, if it has some? |
In the case of mine it was glaringly obvious. It was actually a bit of a circus when I got the horn. There had been a bad dent in the leadpipe which the seller said they'd get fixed. Yeah, they fixed it but there was severe bubbling of the silver plate just below the mouthpiece receiver. When I looked down the leadpipe there were obvious deep craters in the tube walls - it was about as bad as it could be without actually causing pinholes and it would have just been a matter of time. There was no way a competent tech could have not seen it to get to the area that needed fixing. He should have taken one look at it and told him there's no point in fixing that dent this leadpipe is shot. It played but the pipe was in really rough shape. The seller gave me a partial refund to defray the cost of repairs. That and the case is in much rougher shape than was advertised. My next project is to rebuild the case.
To get the new leadpipe it has to be ordered from Getzen's related company Allied Supply by a repair shop with an account, you can't just order one yourself. There's no way to avoid this middleman unfortunately. It took a while - as I understand it Allied waits to get a few of them ordered and then makes and plates them - I got mine in silverplate which was extra. They send the whole thing pre-assembled - new leadpipe, tuning slide receiver, mouthpiece receiver and finger hook so factor that in when getting a quote for work - they don't have to take the old pieces off your old leadpipe and then reassemble them. My recollection is the leadpipe assembly was something like $120 in silver give or take. That was a few years ago.
Were I to do it again I'd order the pipe from a repair shop and solder it on myself since I've subsequently learned to solder. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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thecoast Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 138 Location: San Bernardino County, CA
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:20 am Post subject: Follow up: “Better deal” and comparative playing experie |
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Follow up on the purchase: there were some dents caused by shipper handling. The seller offered me a $200 discount and I accepted it. So price wise it’s a better deal, but fixing the dents is an unknown cost. The longer I have the horn, the less the little dings matter. But the main ones I really do want to fix, especially if I decide to sell it. I just hope the process doesn’t make it look like a different type of dent.
BTW, the case that the Eterna came with is the nicest case I’ve ever had. Built to last forever, surprisingly heavy. Looks practically new.
So my playing experience is surprising to me. And that is because the higher register is much harder work than on my Omega. That is discouraging because I bought the Getzen thinking it would be as easy to play in the high register as the Yamaha 6320 I had briefly and my Omega. I’d like to think that it’s a matter of getting used to the horn, but it didn’t take me any time at all to get used to the ease of playing on the 6320 or the Omega in the upper register. The Eterna feels like—I hate to even say— it feels like a student horn in the upper register. Such a sad thought. 🥺
I’ve used a couple of different mouthpieces, but that hasn’t made any meaningful difference in terms of the upper register. Now I’m debating whether I should keep the Getzen or not. I am so bummed out.🙁
Interestingly enough, that is not a problem with the Capri C. Love the Capri. Fun to play.
I’m going to give the Eterna some more time, but I’m not very hopeful. _________________ —Bach Omega
—Yamaha 631G flugelhorn w/ Warburton 1FLX
—John Packer JP272 tenor horn w/Denis Wick 3
—Yamaha YTS-354 trombone
—King 627 “baritonium”
—Akai EWI 5000
Last edited by thecoast on Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Riojazz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Dec 2006 Posts: 1015 Location: Mid-Hudson Valley, NY
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:28 am Post subject: |
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OK. As mentioned, the price is right. About the high register, has the horn been thoroughly cleaned? _________________ Matt Finley https://mattfinley.bandcamp.com/releases
Kanstul 1525 flugel with French taper, Shires Bb Destino Med & C trumpets, Schilke XA1 cornet, Schagerl rotary, Schilke P5-4 picc, Yamaha soprano sax, Powell flute. Sanborn GR66MS & Touvron-D. |
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thecoast Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 138 Location: San Bernardino County, CA
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:33 am Post subject: |
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Riojazz wrote: | OK. As mentioned, the price is right. About the high register, has the horn been thoroughly cleaned? |
First thing I did. _________________ —Bach Omega
—Yamaha 631G flugelhorn w/ Warburton 1FLX
—John Packer JP272 tenor horn w/Denis Wick 3
—Yamaha YTS-354 trombone
—King 627 “baritonium”
—Akai EWI 5000 |
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Croquethed Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2013 Posts: 614 Location: Oakville, CT
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:32 am Post subject: |
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At what point do you feel the horn is holding you back? Above high C?
If you were going to get dings fixed, maybe doing that sooner rather than later and having a GOOD tech look at it may help you detect some other flaw affecting playability that may have happened in shipping.
My everyday range is E above high C and I have a 900, a 907, and an X-13. None of the three hold me back. |
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Irving Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Feb 2003 Posts: 1887
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 11:22 am Post subject: |
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Could be a valve alignment issue. |
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Riojazz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Dec 2006 Posts: 1015 Location: Mid-Hudson Valley, NY
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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thecoast wrote: | Riojazz wrote: | OK. As mentioned, the price is right. About the high register, has the horn been thoroughly cleaned? |
First thing I did. | But of course. Had to check... _________________ Matt Finley https://mattfinley.bandcamp.com/releases
Kanstul 1525 flugel with French taper, Shires Bb Destino Med & C trumpets, Schilke XA1 cornet, Schagerl rotary, Schilke P5-4 picc, Yamaha soprano sax, Powell flute. Sanborn GR66MS & Touvron-D. |
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Riojazz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Dec 2006 Posts: 1015 Location: Mid-Hudson Valley, NY
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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Irving wrote: | Could be a valve alignment issue. | Now that's an interesting suggestion. My range isn't much, generally F over high C is it, so I really don't know but wouldn't a poor valve alignment manifest itself more by bad intonation with some notes on or just above the staff? _________________ Matt Finley https://mattfinley.bandcamp.com/releases
Kanstul 1525 flugel with French taper, Shires Bb Destino Med & C trumpets, Schilke XA1 cornet, Schagerl rotary, Schilke P5-4 picc, Yamaha soprano sax, Powell flute. Sanborn GR66MS & Touvron-D. |
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thecoast Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 138 Location: San Bernardino County, CA
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Riojazz wrote: | thecoast wrote: | Riojazz wrote: | OK. As mentioned, the price is right. About the high register, has the horn been thoroughly cleaned? |
First thing I did. | But of course. Had to check... |
🤓 _________________ —Bach Omega
—Yamaha 631G flugelhorn w/ Warburton 1FLX
—John Packer JP272 tenor horn w/Denis Wick 3
—Yamaha YTS-354 trombone
—King 627 “baritonium”
—Akai EWI 5000 |
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