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wohlrab Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Mar 2015 Posts: 131 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 11:38 am Post subject: I Play Better When I Don't Practice |
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Like the title says.
Background: Semi pro trumpet player, working on pro. Most of my calls are for rock, big band, small group jazz. 1-3 gigs per week + rehearsals/jams. Working range up to E or so. I swear, when I'm practicing a couple hours a day, I'm consistent, but my sound is dull and my range suffers. I feel heavy. I practice intelligently, nothing too outlandish.
This last week I didn't have many playing obligations outside of teaching and I swear I came into my gig on Friday light as a feather. Range was there, my sound was alive. Didn't play the rest of the weekend. Then rehearsal last night? Sure, pass me the lead book. I want all the solos.
This has been petty much consistent for months now and it's annoying because I have things I want to practice. I want to be enjoying the process of getting better and pushing myself, but I'm just not on my A game on stage when I'm doing that.
What's up with that? |
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Trumpjerele Veteran Member
Joined: 20 Feb 2019 Posts: 170 Location: Spain
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know what's up with that, but enjoy it!!!!
Others of us are not that lucky!!! _________________ Notice!!! Amateur musician without formal studies
Trumpet: Yamaha 8310Z
Mouthpiece: the great Yamaha11b4
Sax tenor: Yamaha YTS 23
Mouthpiece: Otto link tone edge |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 2036 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | I swear, when I'm practicing a couple hours a day, I'm consistent, but my sound is dull and my range suffers. I feel heavy. I practice intelligently, nothing too outlandish....it's annoying because I have things I want to practice. |
Perhaps the "a couple hours a day" is the problem. Between those couple of hours per day, plus rehearsals, jams and gigs, you might be wearing yourself out. Why not try 30-40 minutes of practice per day and see what happens? If that works, you could gradually move up to 40-60 minutes and see how that goes. Good luck! |
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ldwoods Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Sep 2004 Posts: 1843 Location: Lake Charles, LA
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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Dayton wrote: | Quote: | I swear, when I'm practicing a couple hours a day, I'm consistent, but my sound is dull and my range suffers. I feel heavy. I practice intelligently, nothing too outlandish....it's annoying because I have things I want to practice. |
Perhaps the "a couple hours a day" is the problem. Between those couple of hours per day, plus rehearsals, jams and gigs, you might be wearing yourself out. Why not try 30-40 minutes of practice per day and see what happens? If that works, you could gradually move up to 40-60 minutes and see how that goes. Good luck! |
That's kinda what I was going to say. You may be practicing so much your lips are stiff and lose flexibility\pliability. That happens to me all the time. Even though you may not feel stiff, obviously from your symptons, you are probably stiff. _________________ Larry Woods
LDWoods |
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spitvalve Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 2158 Location: Little Elm, TX
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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It's really a matter of finding the optimal amount of practice vs gigs. As a young buck doing a cruise gig I made the mistake of trying to continue my 3-hour CG routine while playing two shows and a dance set every night. A few weeks into the job and my chops were fried. The other trumpet player in the band (the lead player and a CG student) set me straight. Gave me a condensed 30-minute routine that Claude had given him and within a couple of days I was back in shape and nailing all of the show music.
It could be that you're not balancing what you do in the rock band with what you do in the practice room. Try a shorter routine, softer, working mainly the middle register with long tones and some etudes, making sure you rest as long as you play. If you're consistently playing loud high stuff on the gigs, you don't need to practice any of that at home. Fundamentals should be enough, and you will make improvements little by little without busting your chops. _________________ Bryan Fields
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1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1977 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
1995 UMI Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces |
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Doug Elliott Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Oct 2006 Posts: 1172 Location: Silver Spring, MD
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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Practice only on days you don't have gigs. Consider the gigs to be your "couple of hours" on those days. Otherwise you're overdoing it. |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8333 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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I've barely played for several years. I doubt I'm playing better than before. _________________ LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn |
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LittleRusty Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 12662 Location: Gardena, Ca
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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Crazy Finn wrote: | I've barely played for several years. I doubt I'm playing better than before. |
But I bet you have made fewer mistakes. |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8333 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 12:58 am Post subject: |
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LittleRusty wrote: | Crazy Finn wrote: | I've barely played for several years. I doubt I'm playing better than before. |
But I bet you have made fewer mistakes. |
That's true!! _________________ LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn |
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jadickson Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Jun 2006 Posts: 1294 Location: Raleigh, NC
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 2:20 am Post subject: |
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You are maybe overdoing it, and your chops are swollen after practice..? |
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2596
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:06 am Post subject: |
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Is it possible that the playing you're doing is taking a bigger toll on your chops than it should? The fact that you say your range ends at an E makes me wonder if your mechanics could use tweaking.
Doc Severinsen was famous for being obsessive about practicing - I've read stories about how he'd be on a recording session and when everyone else was taking a break he'd practice with a mute in. As a gigging musician in New York I assume he was playing a lot more than you are.
Whether he ever experienced chop burnout I don't know. It could be that he was really good at pacing himself or he was so ideally suited to the instrument that his chops could take the constant use and keep bouncing back. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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Just_Another_Hack Regular Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2023 Posts: 54 Location: USA
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 9:04 am Post subject: |
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Great players use very, very little tension in their chops or body. They rely on efficiency. Consequently, they need to rarely, if ever, practice. They make it look easy, because it IS easy when your technique is on point.
Playing the trumpet is not a physical endeavor. It's not about raw strength or endurance. It should not feel hard, and it should not require hours of practice each week to sound great. That's not to say hours of practice aren't a good thing, but when those hours are needed to "keep your chops up", something is very wrong.
Perhaps you are discovering that weakness is strength when it comes to this infernal contraption. _________________ Professional lower-split 3rd clarinet player. |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9014 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 9:38 am Post subject: |
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Just_Another_Hack wrote: | Consequently, they need to rarely, if ever, practice. . . it should not require hours of practice each week to sound great. T. |
I hope this is not interpreted to mean that we mere mortals don't need to practice because we do. I don't know the poster's intent but there may be some who take this as an excuse not to practice and I don't think it is.
What I've seen is a balancing of playing and practicing. By that I mean, on days when they are free of gigs, many people practice on, not only some fundamental areas they may need brushing up on, but licks/passages of up-coming music that they need to work on. Or, in the case of a person who plays totally improvised music, licks. changes, etc.
I personally practiced all the stuff you need to improve in targeted areas if I had free time, and music that need brushing up on for upcoming gigs. And on a heavy day, maybe a little warming up at home before going to a gig.
Balance and needs. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn |
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Just_Another_Hack Regular Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2023 Posts: 54 Location: USA
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:18 am Post subject: |
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We all know cats who can't play unless they do an extremely specific warmup, 90 minutes of lip slurs every single day, etc. That's who I'm referring to. Cats who are slaves to extremely fickle chops. That's a function of lousy technique.
The chops shouldn't really be "doing" anything. They just vibrate. When things are working properly, range and endurance are non-issues. At that point, practice can be dedicated to dexterity, repertoire, articulation, etc. In other words, practice should be dedicated toward being a better player, not trying to wrestle the chops into submission. _________________ Professional lower-split 3rd clarinet player. |
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wohlrab Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Mar 2015 Posts: 131 Location: California
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for all of the feedback--
It is POSSIBLE that I'm over practicing, but I would be pretty surprised. That said, I'll try easing off, but staying consistent to see what kind of effect that has. I already don't practice on heavy gig days.
To the individual mentioning that my technique might not be there because I usually cap around high E, I agree. That's part of why I want a consistent routine that helps me open up my range. I also like to spend a fair amount of time practicing improvising because that's a lot of what I'm called for. But I know that's a very taxing exercise. |
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Jaw04 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 31 Dec 2015 Posts: 900 Location: Bay Area, California
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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Most touring jazz artists that I've met don't really practice the horn when they are on the road. They play a few sets at night, saving the chops for the gig, and might practice on an off day. If you are performing nightly that is enough playing, and in many ways you are improving each night onstage more than you would just shedding.
Practicing for a couple hours on gig days is probably over-doing it. I personally perform about as much as you, maybe less this time of year, and the only playing I do on a gig day is a few minutes of warm-up and/or soundcheck. |
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delano Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009 Posts: 3118 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 1:33 am Post subject: |
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Just_Another_Hack wrote: | We all know cats who can't play unless they do an extremely specific warmup, 90 minutes of lip slurs every single day, etc. That's who I'm referring to. Cats who are slaves to extremely fickle chops. That's a function of lousy technique.
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Cats who are slaves....
That's a function of lousy technic....
Great players also need to keep chops in form.
And at which point do reach the status of a good technic so you can stop practicing the things you seem to dislike.
I think my setup is quite ok but I do a lot of slurs, long tones and so on, first because I like them and second because I have the for you obviously ridiculous idea that I always can improve in sound and endurance by this kind of practice. |
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jadickson Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Jun 2006 Posts: 1294 Location: Raleigh, NC
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 4:06 am Post subject: |
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Just_Another_Hack wrote: | Great players use very, very little tension in their chops or body. They rely on efficiency. Consequently, they need to rarely, if ever, practice. They make it look easy, because it IS easy when your technique is on point... |
You lost me at "great players do not practice."
Maybe this was meant to say "great players do not constantly force their embouchure into submission and call it practice" ...?
The thing about tension and efficiency is valid. _________________ Justin Dickson
Middle school band director. Still learning.
www.BandmateTuner.com |
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spitvalve Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 2158 Location: Little Elm, TX
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 6:25 am Post subject: |
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A girl I dated in college once asked me if I did anything besides music. I said "there's no time to do anything else." At the time I was working a part time job, playing in four ensembles, teaching lessons, preparing for a recital, and playing as many gigs as I could scrounge up. She asked what I would do if I had more time. Before I could stop myself one word came out of my mouth:"Practice." It was the beginning of the end of our relationship. _________________ Bryan Fields
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1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1977 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
1995 UMI Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces |
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JimmyDamsgaard New Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2023 Posts: 6 Location: Denmark
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 7:20 am Post subject: |
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The other day a pro cornet player for 38 years in the royal national orchestra told me, that he uses every performance for practice, but never practices more than that. |
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