Interesting concept on how to use tongue for range.

kehaulani

This is an interesting way of thinking about how to use your tongue for range. Any thoughts?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lO_bHidLCoY&t=499s
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JayKosta · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 9:10 am Post subject:

Are you referring specifically to the '3 locations' discussion that begins at timestamp 8:19 (499s)?

My understanding from that section is that it highlights the various 'positional controls' that can be used to activate the muscles that affect the tongue. And the activation of those muscles has effect on the entire embouchure including lip tensions and positions. The method of 'using the tongue' to control embouchure and pitch is centered on learning the feeling, and training the ability to activate those muscles to help produce the necessary embouchure changes.
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kehaulani · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 10:01 am Post subject:

Yeah, the use of the tongue for range is nothing new. I just found his way of relating wind length to string length an interesting way of looking at it.
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JayKosta · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 10:38 am Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:05 pm Post subject:

String/Air analogy starts at about 2:25.
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JayKosta · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:37 pm Post subject:

It looks to me like he is using the idea of 'string length' because of the coincidental location of his muscle activation feelings that he calls 'focal points' being somewhat similar to string vibration ratios.

If using that imagery helps to learn and control the muscle activation, then fine - but it would be incorrect teaching to say that it 'works the same as changing the length of a string'.

It probably has more to do with the 'nearness' of the 'focal points' to the lips - due to the amount of lip change that results from muscle activation at the various points.
_________________
method 1: DO it right and right things will HAPPEN
method 2: make the RIGHT THINGS happen
--
See / Think / Adjust / Do
becomes See & Do.

kehaulani · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:02 pm Post subject:

I think the string analogy, acoustically correct or not, is a nice one. One other take-away I got from that was thinking of "lisping" when forming the tongue in its foremost position.
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kalijah · Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2023 6:48 pm Post subject:

ldwoods · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 7:09 am Post subject:

I do not follow or understand what he is talking about in the video. Can someone elaborate or explain what is meant my "moving focal point" and "half whistle"?
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kehaulani · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 9:45 am Post subject:

As I understand it, he's just using the imagery of the tongue positions being analogous to string subdivisions.

In other words, the tongue being in these three positions: the tongue unobstructed (awhh), the tongue in the middle of the mouth (eee) and the tongue being in its foremost position (thhee) as a string may have analogous positions as "open" string, string cut in half, string cut in fourth.

String positions, "open - half-quarter
and tongue, awhh-eee-thhee.
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JayKosta · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 10:19 am Post subject:

Vin DiBona · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 1:10 pm Post subject:

Last Sarurday, I was fortunate to go to a master clinic featuring Roger Ingram and Brad Goode.
They talked about many things but since both have extraordinary range, let it be said they talked more about the air needed than where their tongue was.
Let it be said that when two masters speak, what is said here is mostly just assumption.

R. Tomasek

JayKosta · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 1:38 pm Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:40 pm Post subject:

JayKosta · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 2:55 pm Post subject:

Jaw04 · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 3:44 pm Post subject:

Jaw04 · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 3:49 pm Post subject:

Vin DiBona · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 4:24 pm Post subject:

As there were many younger players in there (high school and under), Brad went around showing how much air he really needed to play a very strong high G - which he demonstrated - and it was powerful and loud. They were amazed at how little flow was really needed to play up there.

They both said tongue position is very important for the upper register. Roger compared it to an air compressor at a gas station. The compressor provides a flow of high pressure, but the nozzle kicks the air out with controlled velocity.

That's all I will say about this. You had to be there.

R. Tomasek

kalijah · Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2023 6:04 pm Post subject:

JayKosta · Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2023 5:19 am Post subject: