More on Tongue Arch

[freaklip]

I realize I'm going to get ripped for this, but you only live once! I worked through SA religiously for about a year, and also tried to incorporate some concepts from 'Brass Playing..' At the same time, I was working on a more closed embouchure. During this time, my usable range increased from an E above high C to a nice fat G. Above the G, things kind of fall apart.

I got to the G using a tongue arch, as described by CG. However, I recently discovered that I can play that nice fat G with or without the tongue arch. In fact, I can do whatever with the tongue, and still hold that G. Also, above the G, the tongue arch doesn't seem to make a difference. It's starting to seem to me like wasted effort. Has anyone else had a similar experience? Am I going to trumpet player hell for questioning CG? Will I get to meet Jerry Callet there?

[EBjazz]

The tongue and it's "arch" are just part of the machine. The tongue doesn't actually create pitches, but it controls the air when in different registers.
If you are somewhat happy with your sound, technique, musicality and range then I'm happy for you and you certainly didn't waste your time.
The benefits of Claudes routines are not always immediate. As long as you feel good about what your doing with the horn, you are not going to trumpet hell.
I don't think there is a trumpet hell actually....unless that's the place where they keep calling "Bone solo".
Eb
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Eric Bolvin
http://bolvinmusic.com/product/the-modern-jazz-trumpet-method/
www.bolvinmusic.com

[John Mohan]

Hi there!

There is not any "one position" for any one note. There is "one air velocity (speed)" for any one note. And you create this speed through a combination of things, tongue arch being one of them. You can vary the position of your tongue for instance, wagging just the front of it or a part of it around a bit without changing the note, as long as you are maintaining the air speed. This is especially apparent to most all players in the lower register, and to some strong ones (including you) in the upper register.

As Claude wrote, when it comes to the tongue position, we can't always measure it, but we can feel it. You derive the "feel" of the different notes in different registers by practicing and developing (finding) that feeling, all the while building physical strength from the practicing.

But for all players, whether they realize it or not, one thing is always the same. The tongue does arch up and forward for higher notes as one plays higher and flattens for lower notes. This was proven in John Haynie's Flourouscopic Studies at North Texas State, when trumpet players from all over the world had their mouthes x-rayed in live motion image while playing. Amongst the participants in this study was Maurice Andre. And a bunch of players that SWORE they didn't arch their tongues. The pictures proved that they in fact did.

I would guess that when you think you are keeping your tongue flat in your mouth even though you are playing up high, what you are really doing is keeping the back area of your tongue flat in your mouth (as it should be), though the front is up and forward.

Sincerely,

John Mohan

[Quadruple C]

[ This Message was edited by: Quadruple C on 2003-09-20 23:22 ]

[freaklip]

Very interesting. Thanks for the advice.

Jim

[John Mohan]

You're welcome!

JM