Where were Olds trumpets made?

[Eggtracy]

I'm going to look at a vintage Olds trumpet tomorrow and I was trying to determine what model it was. Pretty much all I know is that it was made in Fullerton California. Where all Olds models made in Fullerton or just the Ambassador?
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Lucas Tracy

H.N. White Liberty Bb/A Trumpet
F.E. Olds Special Bb Trumpet
Wedge/Bach 7C
Wedge/Curry 1.25C
King 602 Bb Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet
Curry 1.25VC

[ConnCoprion]

actually they first were made in LA...then were moved to Fullerton.

If I'm wrong someone correct me.
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Philippians 1:6

[Dale Proctor]

All Olds horns were made in Los Angeles untill the factory was moved to Fullerton in about 1955. Check out this site:

http://rouses.net/trumpet/olds.htm
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"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham

[Eggtracy]

Ok, does this mean that it isn't a vintage one and that it's one of the horns made by the new Olds? Oh, I guess I also know that parts of it are silver and other parts are lacquer. Hope this can point you guys to a certain model. It would be awesome it was a Recording model, they're only asking fifty bucks for it and it's (supposedly) in good shape.
_________________
Lucas Tracy

H.N. White Liberty Bb/A Trumpet
F.E. Olds Special Bb Trumpet
Wedge/Bach 7C
Wedge/Curry 1.25C
King 602 Bb Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet
Curry 1.25VC

[WWBWSB]

I believe that one of the larger manufacturers out there purchased the old tooling from Olds. I can't recall whether it was Bach, or UMI that did so a few years back, but I may be mistaken. The new ones certainly do not play like the Fullerton, CA horns did!

[nieuwguyski]

The original Olds company was based in Los Angeles from around 1899 until 1956 (two different street addresses, but both in LA), and thereafter in Fullerton until 1979. A Fullerton Olds is considered an "original" Olds, though not as desirable as an LA Olds.

Check out the Olds trumpet models in this 1962 catalog at Alan Rouse's "Olds Central" website. This is the oldest catalog that shows color images of the Fullerton-era trumpets, showing the different combinations of alloys used in their construction:

http://rouses.net/trumpet/olds62/trumpets.htm

The Mendez is the only Bb trumpet that has no nickel-silver components, so your mystery horn is likely not a Mendez. Finally, the model name will be engraved on the bell.
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J. Notso Nieuwguyski

[BeboppinFool]

[A.N.A.Mendez]

Maybe you will get lucky, it could be a super!
_________________
"There is no necessity for deadly strife" A. Lincoln 1860

☛ "No matter how cynical you get, it's never enough to keep up" Lily Tomlin☚

[thedevilisbad]

just remember, the older the model the better the horn for olds.
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Do or do not, there is no try.

David Koch Custom 1958 Olds Ambassador
1951 Conn 80A
A lot of other crap.

[Rich G]

Over the past ten years I have owned many Olds trumpets made in the Los Angeles and later Fullerton facilities. I would agree that quality fell off somewhat with the student Ambassdor models with the move to Fullerton, but the pro models were still manufactured to a consistently high standard.

I owned at one time or another:

8 student Ambassadors (3 LA, 5 Fullerton)
3 student Ambassador cornets (2 LA, 1 Fullerton)
3 Specials (2 LA, 1 Fullerton)
2 Studio's (both Fullerton)
1 Ultra Sonic Super Star (Fullerton)
1 pro Ambassador Shepherd's crook 6S cornet (Fullerton) the best cornet I ever owned. Do not confuse this with the student Ambassador line.
1 Custom Custom High Range (CHR) tunable bell (Fullerton)
3 Recordings (1 LA, 2 Fullerton)

Other than the student Ambassador models where I did see occasional build quality differences (and playing differences), the more pro oriented models showed no dicernable differences in build quality and playability that led me to form a stereotyped conclusion ("LA good; Fullerton not as good"). Any variances I noticed (student Ambassador exceptions) with the Olds I've owned, were not due to an LA/Fullerton facility difference as much as the normal variances expected; no two horns, even of the same model, manufactured in the same facility, are going to be absolutely identical).

One of the best playing of all these horns I owned (believe it or not) was my Fullerton made Special. And the Fullerton made Shepherd's crook 6S cornet was in a league of its own. What a gorgeous sounding horn. Is this cornet drop dead gorgeous or what? I'm glad I didn't pass up buying one in pristine condition for $250 because I suffered from a "hardening of the categories" ("LA good, Fullerton bad... it's Fullerton, don't buy it...")

Take a look at this .468 bore baby and drool...

http://rouses.net/trumpet/olds77/amba6s.htm

The two Fullerton Recording trumpets I owned were every bit as consistent as the LA Recording I owned in sound and build quality, and I liked the cosmetic changes (bracing on slides) better on the later Fullerton models.

Olds trumpets after the Fullerton plant closed were continued to be manufactured by the conglomerate United Musical Instruments (UMI) that swooped in and took over Benge, King, Conn, Olds, etc.

The Olds produced by UMI were not the same horns.

FWIW, the differences I noticed in the LA and Fullerton student Ambassadors I owned was in better tolerances in the LA models (slides were perfectly interchangeable in the LA Ambassadors I owned, not so with some of the Fullerton Ambassadors). Also, the LA Ambassador models did have a "sonic signature" different from the Fullerton Ambassadors - they played brighter. The upper register had a more vibrant ring to it, an upper overtone structure that I preferred over the darker Fullerton models.

My conclusions are based on my experience with the models I've owned, and a reluctance to accept stereotyping that pigeonholes things (or people) into "either - or" categories that may precondition us to think a certain way.

If you have the opportunity to try a used horn before you buy, keep an open mind. Don't let "conventional wisdom" stop you from trying a horn because of where or when it was made. My 1995 Elkhart Strad is a better horn than the NY and Mt Vernon Strads I've owned. I'm glad I didn't pass it by because it was made during a "bad period" in Bach manufacturing history.

[A.N.A.Mendez]

Good points, I tend to favor the older Olds models as well and the LA is better rule is as you say, not always the case. I have a silver super from 1969 or so that is a dream to play, some of the Recording and Mendez models from the 60s are amazing fun horns to play (and gaze upon). That cornet you linked looks too cool!
So many horns, so little time,.closet space.....
_________________
"There is no necessity for deadly strife" A. Lincoln 1860

☛ "No matter how cynical you get, it's never enough to keep up" Lily Tomlin☚

[JoeCool]

My basic rule of thumb is this. I don't consider anything with a S/N over 500XXX. This was about the time Olds was sold (1963) to a mega parent company and quality, at least on the lower end horns started to go bad. This precipitated the departure of Zig Kanstul in the early 70's. But for a great Olds, you can't go wrong with an LA era horn of any model, especially in raw brass. Even the lowly Ambassador sings.
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Joe

[Eggtracy]

Well I went to check it out and it was a....(drum roll) Special!! Serial #424XXX. It was in great shape, played great, everything was great except all the slides were stuck but the first valve slide and there was some minor wear on the plating on the bell near the valve cluster, a small dent in the same place. I need to get the slides unstuck and to clean it out, it's pretty dirty but it's in good shape. I also got a LeBlanc Wow-wow style mute in great shape and a super old Humes and Burg Straight Mute. I have a question about the wow-wow, to get the stem to move more smoothly would I want to use slide grease? Because it's really sticking.

So, how'd I do, $50 for a Fullerton Olds Special?
_________________
Lucas Tracy

H.N. White Liberty Bb/A Trumpet
F.E. Olds Special Bb Trumpet
Wedge/Bach 7C
Wedge/Curry 1.25C
King 602 Bb Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet
Curry 1.25VC

[plp]

I'd say you did well. The real proof is how it plays, kinda obvious but true nonetheless.

[Eggtracy]

[Rich G]

Great price, you got a steal, enjoy the horn!

[JoeCool]

You made out like a bandit. These generally go for about 300 bills and up on ebay.
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Joe

[Eggtracy]

Cool . That would mean more if I was planning on selling it . But still, I could have ended up paying 300 for it on ebay.
_________________
Lucas Tracy

H.N. White Liberty Bb/A Trumpet
F.E. Olds Special Bb Trumpet
Wedge/Bach 7C
Wedge/Curry 1.25C
King 602 Bb Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet
Curry 1.25VC

[musicmork]

I'm gonna make a statement that will cause considerable controversy but here goes...

I have played MANY different Olds trumpets and cornets and you know what ?????????? I like REYNOLDS even BETTER !!!
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MARK /aka "musicmork"/ aka " The Creator "
TRUMPET: Getzen , Olds
MOUTHPIECES Bach 3-C, Schilke 13a4a
CORNET: Holton Galaxy (Awesome horn)
KEYBOARDS: Kurzweil PC88MX,Yamaha S-30, Casio Privia 575R

[Eggtracy]