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Joe Kozlowski
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:21 pm    Post subject: Negative effects Reply with quote

Sometimes I find that Stamp warmups make me just too loose. Has anyone else experienced this?
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cheiden
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stamp was a brilliant teacher but the method that bears his name offers only a tiny fraction of his brilliance. In order to succeed with this book you really need to go through it under the supervision of someone who studied with him. I've seen lots of folks play the exercises in a way completely at odds with the intent. And even my teacher who studied directly with Jimmy says that the buzzing portion of the book must be approached in a very specific way and even then some folks may not benefit and some may even suffer problems bacause of it.
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luna.metztli
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Negative effects Reply with quote

Joe Kozlowski wrote:
Sometimes I find that Stamp warmups make me just too loose. Has anyone else experienced this?


With my professor we all used stamp at CSU Fullerton, since Stamp taught there. For each individual he had us analyze what we needed in the trumpet spectrum. From that point we chose which warm up and exercises suited us the best. some may have had similar warm ups but there were those who went at it differently. Choose the exercise that make you feel confident and secure about your sound and control. Some may feel good loose and some may feel awkward like in your case.
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royjohn
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:34 pm    Post subject: Negative effects Reply with quote

Hi Abraham,

You wrote:

Quote:
With my professor we all used stamp at CSU Fullerton, since Stamp taught there. For each individual he had us analyze what we needed in the trumpet spectrum. From that point we chose which warm up and exercises suited us the best. some may have had similar warm ups but there were those who went at it differently. Choose the exercise that make you feel confident and secure about your sound and control. Some may feel good loose and some may feel awkward like in your case.


Wow, that makes sense! An individualized approach! Amazing! Probably too advanced for the doctrinaire bunch at TH.

Seriously, though, we hear so much here about a dogmatic approach. There are nine different dedicated forums here focusing on one approach each, and in any of them (even my favorite one) you can get asked to leave for saying something contradicting the dogma of the particular forum. We also have people saying there is one correct embouchure when, if you just look at videos of pros playing, you can see that they all play differently. Yesterday I advised someone to play with a closed embouchure and about two posts later a NY pro was telling the same person to play with an open embouchure. I don't know who your prof was, but giving people permission to take what they can use from an approach and modify it as needed seems extremely sensible to me. Moreover, he's teaching students to teach their students in a more open way. Maybe you don't play exactly as I do, but your way works for you.
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Bjmorris07
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Joe,

I couldn't help but smile at your question because it is exactly what my teacher brought up in my lesson yesterday; he said I sounded too open and not so controlled with this warm-up. I don't have much to do with Stamp, but to warm-up I often play an exercise of his. The one that goes: G-- F#-G-A-G-E-C. And then you do it again and add a note: G-- F#-G-A-C-A-G-E-C. Anyway, this warm-up for me, a passionate beginner whose played for a year now, is a little to much to start with because almost immediately, you are warming up over the span of an octave, and then more. When playing down an octave, not step-wise, I can quickly feel too loose. I still really like the exercise, but not as an initial warm-up. It's better for me initially to focus on concentrated notes and focusing my sound for notes individually. I don't know of any exciting ways to do that, but I just play a set of quarter notes on one tone and really try and focus my sound. After doing that on several different pitches, the stamp exercise sounds better.

I hope that made some sense!

-Ben.
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swthiel
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good stuff!
Bjmorris07 wrote:
Hello Joe,

I don't have much to do with Stamp, but to warm-up I often play an exercise of his. The one that goes: G-- F#-G-A-G-E-C. And then you do it again and add a note: G-- F#-G-A-C-A-G-E-C.

-Ben.

Minor correction: These are Cichowicz flow studies. I don't know if Stamp used them or not. I sometimes use these to replace the Stamp warm-up studies in my daily routine. When I use them, I do the first patten you describe, then take it down a half step at a time until I'm starting on C#. After that, I use your second pattern, starting on the C# and going up by half-steps until I'm starting on G. These continue to extend higher as well; Google "Cichowicz Flow Studies" and you'll find lots of information.

It's very good, by the way, that you're learning so early what works for you and what doesn't. Do be open to the idea that as you progress, a lot of things will start working for you that don't work for you right now.
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Bjmorris07
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh thanks for the kind correction! I somehow mistakenly associated that with Stamp.

Apologies for the non-relevant reply then, Joe. In the least, I can still say that I've also experienced some warm-ups that don't help me focus my sound. Other than that I don't have much of a topic-related reply. Oops!

-Ben.
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swthiel
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bjmorris07 wrote:
Oh thanks for the kind correction! I somehow mistakenly associated that with Stamp.

Apologies for the non-relevant reply then, Joe. In the least, I can still say that I've also experienced some warm-ups that don't help me focus my sound. Other than that I don't have much of a topic-related reply. Oops!

-Ben.

Not too off-topic, IMO! The Cicowicz studies accomplish a lot of what I think Stamp was going for, and your experience lines up the original poster's experience.

Unneeded tension and effort work against playing the trumpet, and Stamp really focused on knocking out that unneeded work. Perhaps one way to think about it is that when applied properly, Stamp's principles bring our playing into balance. If you're too tense, you're out of balance ... but if you're over-relaxed, you're also out of balance.
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grawlin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stamp is quoted so often I sometimes wonder if players just think he said something or it sounded like something he said, rather than actually quoting him. It's a problem great teachers face. I have been using several stamp warm ups lately and achieving nice results. At this point in my life I am very careful with what I spend time on, and I keep wandering back to the Stamp collection.

It fits very well into my scheme of teaching I call AirPlay and PowerPlay - most of it "un-common sense."
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MrGBand
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think problems come when we don not pay enough attention to what our jaw does during the bends/pedal tones. It is easy to accomplish both of these by pulling the jaw down and in a little. That's bad. You must make sure that the embouchure and jaw position stay in their normal position, and if anything, you jaw should move opposite to support the pucker.
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clayparler
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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey there,
I play stamp nearly every day as part of a routine. I've found that two things really help me out when working on stamp.
1. Alternate between forte and piano when playing exercises. For example, on Stamp 3, Play "C-D-C, G-A-G, C" at a full dynamic and then play "B-C#-B, F#-G#-F#,B" at piano. Continue alternating. Never underestimate the value of soft playing; it eliminates stiffness and provides focus.
2. Actively listen to the sound you are producing. I've read over and over that the point of stamp is to move from note to note with a seamless, fluid sound. It's really easy to frack notes when we move at bigger intervals. Keep it all connected.
Hope this helps a little,
R
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jesscarltonjazz@gmail.com
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:56 pm    Post subject: Stamp Reply with quote

I love the Stamp exercises. but I only really find the first basic warm up one to be helpful. I bought the whole book and hardly use any of it. But I do the first one every day, its great.
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EdMann
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the warmup is fine, although it can easily be overdone and many days I don't believe I need much of it at all, but there other very valuable exercises there. The two I focus on lately are the lip bends, both with mpc using a decrescendo as I ascend in the minor 3rds, and the octave exercises using the horn. Those really seal the deal for me helping me find better resonance and less chop movement respectively. Also, I've pretty much eliminated the free buzzing of 3a etc. and opt for some easy free buzzing during the day, working to buzz with as little tension as possible.

ed
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Trumpet_Lover
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that the key is to take rest properly.
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TimbersArmy
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've found that playing all the pedals in the Stamp warm-up routine can make me too loose as well, which is precisely why I like to use it as a warm-down at the end of the day.
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ListeningFromTheBackRow
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I first started doing the Stamp exercises in graduate school, my professor had me work on all of the warm-ups as they are presented in the book with the intention that, after really learning how to play the Stamp material properly I would choose which aspects worked the best for my warm up, warm down, maintenance, etc.

Usually when I warm up, I just work through the #3's as that is enough for me to get ready for most types of playing. If I'm engaging in an extended practice sessions (not getting ready for a rehearsal) I really work the other exercises as a way to improve my playing - but never as a total warm up before a rehearsal.
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cavwilli
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the way these exercises make my chops feel, but not overdoing it- it seems to me you need someone familiar with Stamp's method to explain the exercises in the book
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cjo295
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that the method is somewhat elusive without correct supervision. I use the beginning exercises in the same way I use long tones. For me, it's just a good way to get the sound even and consistent throughout all registers. Similarly, I don't overplay long tones - too much will lead to unnecessary fatigue. Stamps are the same way.
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joshua.mobley
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can agree that doing the same warm-up day in and day out will start to produce repetitive muscle memory. After a while a warm up starts not really doing it's job. So like someone who goes to the gym on a regular basis, they don't do the same workout everyday they change it up on a daily basis to keep their muscles guessing. Doing this in turn strengthens your muscles and helps you also progress playing wise throughout the day.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Negative effects Reply with quote

Joe Kozlowski wrote:
Sometimes I find that Stamp warmups make me just too loose. Has anyone else experienced this?


Yes, and there is a fine balance with Stamp that must be done in moderation, mixed with other exercises. No way to quantify it! I love the way stamp holds his mouthpiece when buzzing; critical! Do a teeny bit of buzzing as well. I have been playing Stamp every day I play for the last 17 years.
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