trumpet bore size effect

[fuzzyjon79]

I used to own a Kanstul Chicago 1070 (.470 bore) and it felt incredible! It didn't wear me out, but it was really free blowing and slotted well. I regret selling it. Bore size can sometimes fool you.
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J. Fowler
"It takes a big ole' sack of flour, to make a big ole' pan of biscuits!"

[fuzzyjon79]

I'm not sure this will help, but this is a great online article. It deals with Schilke, but might be worth a read.

http://www.dallasmusic.org/schilke/B%20flat%20trumpets.html
_________________
J. Fowler
"It takes a big ole' sack of flour, to make a big ole' pan of biscuits!"

[connicalman]

Why are flugelhorns - of small and large bore - so darned easy to play all the way up to G atop the staff, then have a built-in steep challenge above that?

Why did a deeper cornet mouthpiece with a larger throat 'open up' a 0.460" student-model shepherd's crook such that I could play from G to C up there with better tone and everything as compared to a smaller Bach 6 & 6C?

Why is my Conn 5A cornet with its short wide wrap and 0.484" bore so easy to hit clean highs, even with a Wick 3 no-letter?

It's gotta be design, not (edit: ONLY) diameter.
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kochaavim, csillaagkep, αστε��ισμός, konnstelacji, connstellation... ...a.k.a. the 28A!
Other Conns: Victor 5A & 38A, New Wonder & 80A; 'stella 38A; 36A; 'quest 76A...

[connicalman]

Anyone with the Conn Victor Special in 0.438 & the mucho larger bore 80A cornet with an opinion? Those are almost the same wrap and bell, yes?
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kochaavim, csillaagkep, αστε��ισμός, konnstelacji, connstellation... ...a.k.a. the 28A!
Other Conns: Victor 5A & 38A, New Wonder & 80A; 'stella 38A; 36A; 'quest 76A...

[plp]

[Adam V]

The leadpipe has a MUCH greater effect on the sound and blow than the size of the bore. For example: An ML bore Bach 72*/43 will play much more open than a CG Benge (large, .470" bore).

Having said that... the bore still makes a difference. A great example is the difference between the Kanstul 1000 and 1001. The larger bore (1001) has a sound that is much less concentrated and more spread, for lack of a better word.

With Schilke Bbs, the bore size seems to make a big difference. The B5 has a medium-large (.460") bore, with a medium-large bell taper, and most people agree that it is a pretty tight-blowing horn. The B3 has a large bore (.463"), and a medium bell taper (less volume than the bell on the B5), yet it is MUCH more free-blowing than the B5. The Schilke leadpipe has a very slow taper, which may be why it is so sensitive to bore size.
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1970 Bach 37 Strad
Yamaha 635 flugel

Marcinkiewicz E3/3C

[Locutus2k]

[crzytptman]

Of all the trumpets I've ever played, I have not played any poorly designed L horns, or any poorly designed M horns. I can say that there is a difference, obviously in the response, definitely in the sound. It's neither good nor bad, just different. I prefer the depth of sound I can get with L horns, so that's what I play. I like to use my body to play, like a good singer does. I can play any size horn. I have played many poorly designed ML horns, so I'm not comparing them! I can play ML horns just fine as well.

However, if take the mouthpiece off, wrap your lips around the receiver and blow as hard as you can - you'd be hard pressed to tell any difference in bore size.
_________________
Crazy Nate - Fine Yet Mellow Fellow
"so full of it I don't know where to start"
Horn: "just mismatched Kanstul spare parts"
- TH member and advertiser (name withheld)

[Tony Scodwell]

Perhaps I should have said something about balance. Bore size certainly is just one part of the equation along with the leadpipe taper, venturi size, bell flair and so on. Those old 38B's were tanks and MF was for sure in his prime when he played them. I heard the band in the late fifties and early sixties many times and he ate raw meat in those days. I brought my new pride and joy B3 Schilke in one night for him to play and after saying what a fine horn it was, he said it didn't quite blow freely enough for him. Over the years dealing with some bad habits and just getting older, Maynard's playing changed. Still an amazing trumpet player, my feelings were that I preferred the earlier guy. As for his change to Holton, my very good friend Sandy Sandberg was responsible for getting him playing those. After many years at Getzen [where he was responsible for Doc's years there] Sandy joined Vito at Holton and in addition to having MF as an artist, he also signed up Al Hirt and Miles. Anybody that knows how the musical instrument biz works wasn't surprised at his move. Later at Conn [Vito was a bit tough to deal with] Sandy reunited with Doc there and started that somewhat ill fated venture through no fault of either one. My point is, Maynard changed from the Conn 38B's for more than musical reasons. Once again with no disrespect to anyone here, the bore size is but one part of the way a horn plays. I agree that two basically identical horns with two different bores will play differently, but as we all know, two supposedly identical horns seldom [if ever] play the same.
Tony Scodwell
Scodwell USA Trumpets and Flugelhorns available in the US only from Washington Music Center, call Lee Walkowich at 301.946.8808 or now in Europe at Musik-Bertram, Freiburg, Germany.

[delano]

My 2c

I have a n older Yamaha 6345 and a more older Selmer B700 which have the same bore on the second valve: 0.463 = 11.75 mm.
They have both a D-shaped tuning slide, the Selmer differs by not having a brace in it.
As far as my research went, both have some kind of Bach 25 leadpipe.
The biggest differences are:
Selmer L-bell (bigger throat and a little bigger in diameter), Yamaha ML-bell (I think rather tight), both bells are goldbrass.
The Selmer has a tuning bell setup.
The Selmer is in raw brass with nickel slides, the Yamaha is in epoxy lacquer
The Yamaha is standard weight, the Selmer a little heavyweight.
They play COMPLETELY different.
The Yamaha plays only a very little more open than a Bach 37, it's a trumpet with (for me) a lot of resistance. The sound is with a shallow mouthpiece (I play a Yamaha 11B4 GP) on the bright side.
The Selmer is the most open playing trumpet I encountered and has a beautiful, more deep and round sound still playing the same mouthpiece.
So I think that the form of the bell is a very influential parameter for the playing characteristics of a trumpet (cornet, flugel).

[Usedtobegood]

[razeontherock]