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JLoyalist Veteran Member
Joined: 12 Feb 2013 Posts: 139 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 5:30 pm Post subject: Jon Faddis' Mouthpiece History |
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Does anyone know what kind of mouthpieces Jon Faddis has used through his career?
I know he plays on a custom Laskey now. Anyone know how this compares to his custom Schilke?
I've also heard that he used to play on an old Giardinelli custom piece in the early 70's? Anyone know what that piece was like?
I'm always curious what the greats messed around with throughout their careers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hv7bC21nZs
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One of my personal favorite clips of Faddis. His sound here is to die for. |
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mcgovnor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Posts: 2607 Location: ny ny
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Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:00 pm Post subject: he |
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He played on a Reeves when I worked with him, but fooled around some. |
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american boy Veteran Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2012 Posts: 344 Location: ny
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Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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I played with him a few times,and he had a Schilke piece..looked like around a bach 7 diameter and shallow..What a mutha player..Never seemed to ever tire,and just projected like light speed.Awesome |
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so what Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Oct 2004 Posts: 617 Location: near Dallas
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Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: Jon Faddis' Mouthpiece History |
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Wow, that is great playing indeed. Wonderful use of the high register as part of the music. Nice. |
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razeontherock Heavyweight Member
Joined: 05 Jun 2004 Posts: 10609 Location: The land of GR and Getzen
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Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:39 pm Post subject: Re: Jon Faddis' Mouthpiece History |
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JLoyalist wrote: |
One of my personal favorite clips of Faddis. His sound here is to die for. |
While I have no idea what mpc he played, the shots of his chops here suggest he studied embouchure with Elvis.
HA! |
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ominous curry Regular Member
Joined: 11 Jul 2015 Posts: 68
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Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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That made me chuckle...
If he played a bach 7 rim diameter size (around .650 ID) I take my hat off to the guy because that's not that small and he really does sing up there like nobody I've ever seen. |
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mcgovnor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Posts: 2607 Location: ny ny
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Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:42 pm Post subject: In |
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I can send you recorded session files of myself on a 3c doing it.
Double b's in figures. If you set correctly and have the air chop balance it can be done on any size. Jon played around a 7 and is a magnificent player. |
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ominous curry Regular Member
Joined: 11 Jul 2015 Posts: 68
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Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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But lets not forget the cup depth/lack of cup depth in jon's mouthpiece. I don't believe he or anyone for that matter could peform what jon does on a deep mouthpiece. The mouthpiece is what forced Jon from an early age to be incredibly efficient with his chops and air. |
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Ed Kennedy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187
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Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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I met him when he was 17 before he went with Lionel Hampton. He was using a Burt Herrick. |
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Vin DiBona Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2003 Posts: 1473 Location: OHare area
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Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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For years, used a Schilke Heavyweight mouthpiece around the diameter of a Schilke 11 which Schilke measured at .650, so yes, it was around a Bach 7.
The cup is very shallow.
Doesn't anyone go to a manufacturer's website to check on anything?
http://www.schilkemusic.com/products/mouthpieces/custom-series/#faddisXL
Many great high note players are on some much larger mouthpieces than you may think. Ever hear Dan Fornero? Very 3ish size.
R. Tomasek |
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dershem Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 1885 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Vin DiBona wrote: | Many great high note players are on some much larger mouthpieces than you may think. Ever hear Dan Fornero? Very 3ish size.
R. Tomasek |
Or Arturo. |
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mcgovnor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Posts: 2607 Location: ny ny
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Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:39 pm Post subject: ominous |
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Ominous...you are incorrect. When a player practices with efficiency in mind, and has enough in his mind to discern what his face and air need to do to move forward and actually play in that register, the mouthpiece has nothing to do with it. Once the player has learned what it is he needs to do, then a mouthpiece can be crafted to make him sound better doing it, help make him more accurate, make it possible to still play in a brass quintet and then be doing it 2 hours later, or just make it ..closer to him. Most of us wanted to still be able to sit down and play 3rd trumpet, function on recording sessions, playing ANYTHING, play a show, any book, play solo literature, or be bopsters. Here's what most of the TH current crop miss. Most players who can play efficiently up there are simply better all around craftsmen on the horn than most. In Jon's case, his high note playing on sessions wasn't the thing that he was hired for. It was his ability to play and not miss, and cut through the track playing a 4th line d. His pitch was incredible, and he could sit next to guys like Alan Rubin, who was a Vacchiano protege, and be just fine. And another word for word for the record. Maynard, was a high note gifted player. No one ever played them like him, from the sound standpoint. Not really the best lead trumpet player. Cat Anderson was a different animal completely. Not a lead trumpet player, but could play up there like..well, Lynn Biviano did for a while..d's and e's above c, even g.. Lynn could play great lead, though, at one time. Dave Stahl, f's over double c in figures, and great lead. I could go on for an hour, and then someone else would chime in. The guys often mentioned, who garner the most attention because they have a mp or a horn endorsed with their initials on it are not necessarily the best, and are FAR from the only guys doing it. If you want to hear little old me, I'll send you an mp3, been doing it for 20 years or more. I was a late bloomer:) |
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ljazztrm Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 Dec 2001 Posts: 2681 Location: Queens and upstate, NY
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Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Awesome post by Mcgovnor - He can really back up what he's saying and is one of the top players on the scene today. I took a few lessons with him in the past.
He's one of the few I know who can do the real high note thing on a 3C WITHOUT embouchure shifts - all one embouchure.. In fact I am not familiar with another player who can do this consistently above double C (without embouchure shifts/multiple embouchures) - although I know a good amount of lead players who use a 3C (usually the older shallower ones) to play lead and have a great, big sound and sparkling G's and A's. I can think of a few Bill Adam students in fact around my part of town.
I know we have been talking about MF's unique mouthpiece design causing his embouchure to work the way it does - and this, imo, is true and I am experiencing this as well using his piece along with correct fundamentals and a lot of playing - but, in general, it is not the mouthpiece that really matters, it's the player.
Could Jon play the way he does on a 7C? Yes, he would have the same chops - No, not for as long, or as consistently doing it every day, or with the same cutting power - but he still would have his phenomenal chops. In most cases, players develop their chops on whatever mouthpiece and, then, gravitate to whatever makes their life the easiest - the most efficient - and allows them to do it consistently day after day. Bobby Shew calls it: Using the right tool for the job. and says 'You wouldn't hammer a nail with a banana.'
The world's fastest runner would be really fast running in Blundstone boots (at least ones that fit them fairly well) - but, why? They'd be even faster in running shoes. There are certain limitations - playing lead and loud high notes on a flugel mouthpiece? An orchestral mouthpiece? Not gonna happen - your asking for injury. And players deviating too far from a trumpet mouthpiece that fits their physiology? You will probably see double and/or multiple embouchures develop with shifts if they are successful - few players have mastered these shifts - usually solo players who can get away with it.
Faddis didn't always have the range he has now. He talks about this. It was always exceptional even as a young kid - loud G's some double C's - but in the late 80's he added about an octave through equipment (mouthpiece and horn) changes. All the best, Lex _________________ Mpcs: Jim New-Manley Jazz1/Jazz2/Jazz4/Lead3. Legends MF1. Reeves 39EX/HV. Frost 39MVD. Flugel: Jim NewMF3. Jim New-Manley F1+F2. Pickett MF. Reeves HF.
Trumpets: THE LYNNZHORN!!/Stomvi Forte pocket
Flugel: Manchester Brass Pro Model
Www.LexSamu.com |
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RussellDDixon Heavyweight Member
Joined: 04 Apr 2014 Posts: 830 Location: Mason, OH
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Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 5:53 am Post subject: |
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I was working on my website today and remembered this thread. Here is Jon Faddis answering that question within Augie Haas outstanding thesis that he has graciously allowed me to include on my website -
"What equipment do you use for upper register playing and why?
I have used a medium bore Schilke since 1971 or so. Since then, I have played mouthpieces made for me by Bert Herrick, Bob Reeves, Bob Giardinelli, Jeff Parke, Greg Black, Schilke, Karl Hammond and Scott Laskey, whose mouthpieces I currently play. Both the mouthpieces and trumpets are played because this particular equipment makes it easier for me to get the sound that I want and to play the music that I hear inside of my head." - Jon Faddis
http://www.trumpetplayersdirectory.com/trumpetrange.html _________________ Schilke X3 Bb trumpet
Yamaha 631g Flugelhorn
Lynn Nicholson Model Monette Prana XLT mouthpiece
Kanstul Claude Gordon Personal mouthpiece |
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EdMann Heavyweight Member
Joined: 31 Mar 2007 Posts: 2481 Location: The Big Valley
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Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2015 8:15 am Post subject: |
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A buddy of mine came up with Jon in the Bay Area, east bay, and was always fascinated by his acumen up there. He arrived in LA for college and hung with the late Bill Lamb and their teacher gave them a small mpc to fart around on for a couple of weeks. Their world was blasted open! And my friend had Jon as a sound model. They both went on to good careers playing whatever they wanted. As for my BD, "play this!" and he handed me a Bach 1C and the lead chair. I'm not sure why I didn't simply quit.
Equipment does matter.
ed |
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John Holifield Veteran Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 291
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Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2015 11:06 am Post subject: |
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EdMann wrote: | A buddy of mine came up with Jon in the Bay Area, east bay, and was always fascinated by his acumen up there. He arrived in LA for college and hung with the late Bill Lamb and their teacher gave them a small mpc to fart around on for a couple of weeks. Their world was blasted open! And my friend had Jon as a sound model. They both went on to good careers playing whatever they wanted. As for my BD, "play this!" and he handed me a Bach 1C and the lead chair. I'm not sure why I didn't simply quit.
Equipment does matter.
ed |
In my experience the younger and less developed the player is the more equipment matters. The more developed and experienced the player the less equipment matters. I'm not saying it doesn't matter at all it just matters less as a player develops.
John _________________ Working hard is great. But, it is more productive and rewarding to Work Smart! |
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chase1973 Veteran Member
Joined: 19 Nov 2018 Posts: 121 Location: Valdosta
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Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2021 11:37 am Post subject: |
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When Jon was first working in NYC and playing lead w Thad & Mingus, he was using a custom piece Reeves made cut for sleeves, not sure of the dimensions tho. He then had Bob Giardinelli make him a piece before getting chummy with the late Scott Laskey who made the majority of his pieces. Laskey told me he uses a rim closer to a Schilke 13B with the cup depth of a 6A4a (.671") with a 27 throat (thou he had used a 29 throat prior) and a 39L backbore |
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