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Do You Believe in Ghosts?


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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:17 am    Post subject: Do You Believe in Ghosts? Reply with quote

Do you believe in ghosts?

When people pass from this life, do they live on somewhere, somehow? Is the energy that was their life passed on, or does it just pass away? When a person is laid to rest, does the work of their hands cease, or does it continue? Sometimes, the stories told of former years mix with my own memories and I seem to see them as they might have been. Years of old black & white movies and documentaries play in my mind with that peculiar low-fidelity voice narrating what I see and creating for me a sort of time travel. I see young men living the lives we reverence today. I hear their music and begin to feel the excitement they must have felt for the artists of their time. Many of them are now gone. Ghosts they are today.

Yet, I have held their lives in my hands, some of them. I’ve set their music free, in a sense, from the forgotten corners in the closets of my memory. The music of ghosts. Not spooky and foreboding, but vibrant and exciting! For me, it’s playing Begin The Beguine that stirs them in my soul. For others, it’s the steady thrum of a lathe and the swick-swack of a wooden mallet, or the shish-shish of brass filings falling to the ground. Look! Can you see him? Elden Benge is alive and producing some of his best instruments today.

The story of the Benge trumpet has been told, in various forms by various people, many times over through the years. Details vary with the teller, but one thing has become clear to me. There is a certain cadre of very passionate Templar of the Benge legacy. These guardians who have made Benge a part of their lives are some of the most influential in the trumpet industry. Icons, really, though outside the world of the trumpet enthusiast, very few people would ever recognize their names. This is their story. This is the story of the Burbank Trumpet Company.



It begins in 1967 with a young, Southern California musician whose trumpet was destroyed in a car accident, smashed between his thigh and that of the driver, as they were T-boned by another car. The bell of that old Besson couldn’t be fixed properly, so it was replaced with another bell that a repairman had in his shop. But for Michael Thomas, his horn just wasn’t the same and he knew it was time to find something else. Some years before, he had heard rumors and stories of a new brand of trumpet being built in Burbank. What was it? Benge? By that time, Elden had died and his son, Donald, was running the operation. Michael contacted him and Donald said he had some used horns for sale and invited him to come out to the shop at 1122 W. Burbank Blvd.

When Michael arrived, Donald showed him the horns that were available and told him he could pick any one he liked. Michael found the best one, bought it for a pretty good price and took it home only to be met by the ringing of his telephone. There was a problem. It was Donald on the phone. It seems the trumpet Michael had purchased wasn’t supposed to be for sale. It was sent in for service by Irving Bush, principle trumpet for the Los Angeles Philharmonic Orchestra. This was Irving’s treasured Chicago Benge! So, the “Great Benge Trumpet Caper of 1967” ended with the horn back in its rightful owner’s hands and Michael with a different one. More importantly, it opened the door for friendships with both Donald Benge and Irving Bush that would have long lasting benefit for all three of them.



In that same few years, Michael, with business partners, established a new company of his own to produce Roché-Thomas valve oil. He put a kit together that included the oil, a container of slide grease, cheese cloth, a mouthpiece brush and some replacement valve felt pads, which he sold to Donald Benge to include with his new horns. As the Benge company was sold, those kits came along with each new instrument. My 1976 Benge 5X came with one and I still have the mouthpiece brush, even though I no longer own the horn. When UMI finally moved the Benge factory out of Southern California, Michael’s connection with the company ended. But, he had established friendships in the mean time with Donald Benge and Zig Kanstul, who had run the Benge factory in the 1970s.



There is a story of Donald’s trek to his grandmother’s house in Chicago, where he is said to have found, in the attic, bell mandrels used by his father when he lived there. Since Zig had also taken advantage of UMI’s decision to sell the Los Angeles Benge tooling and since UMI’s new Benge horns were no longer up to the standard of what was once proudly proclaimed “The Finest Trumpet in the World,” the decision was made to use that tooling and continue building true Benge trumpets using the Burbank name as a brand. At first, Donald was involved, but later he and Zig parted ways and the rights to the Burbank Trumpet Company, as it is called now, fell to Michael Thomas.



The current line of trumpets include the 5X, 3X, 3X+ and the 6X-CG. One can still order a 2X or 2X+ and Michael is open to a certain amount of customization. A new endorsing artist, Roger Wood, is playing the 3X+ now and will have his own version of it soon. The 3X+ RW represents the first new Benge-style model in the Burbank line. There is also talk of a heritage version of the 3X+ patterned after the trumpets of the 1950s, when Elden was still alive and building them.



These are signs that the Burbank brand is experiencing something of a reemergence. Even the name is changing from a somewhat obscure Michael Thomas Music to MTM - Burbank Trumpet Company. Michael is putting increased effort toward marketing, so that more people can see and enjoy these lovely instruments. And they are lovely, just as they have been for more than 70 years. I first saw the Burbank line at ITG, this summer. Michael had the 5X, 3X+ and 6X-CG on display and I was eager to try them and see how they compared to the original Benge trumpets I grew up loving.

I can say that I was very pleased! The 5X was very competent. It responded to articulation better than my vintage 5X. The 3X+ caught me by surprise with a peculiar timbre I’d first heard in 1975 when I was in High School marching band and one of the guys played one. I recognized that sound instantaneously! The CG model felt and sounded just like the Benge I had had restored by Kanstul for a friend some years ago. Superb!

In fact, I believe the Burbank trumpets being manufactured today in the Kanstul Musical Instruments factory are among the best of their kind ever. They differ from Kanstul’s own model 1000, 1001 and 1070 in detail, but those details make more of a difference than I imagined. The first and most obvious difference is that, while the Kanstul horns use a lightened version of the bottom valve caps used on their signature line, Burbank horns have the original Benge design. Other details include the original style mouthpiece receiver and water key mounting pads. The only changes from the original horns I have been able to ascertain is that Benge used a thinner bell wire than what is used on the Burbank now, the Mother-of-Pearl finger buttons have concave inlays instead of flat-topped ones and those buttons look more like the Chicago-era Benge design, which I really like. Also, the large bore horns are now .470” bore, as Kanstul doesn’t make 468” parts.



You can see and hear these trumpets on HornTrader.com. Steve Dillard is an approved vendor and friend of Michael Thomas. His videos were produced over a period of time and some details have changed. For instance, Burbank can now legally use the “X” in the model names and can use the CG moniker on the 6X lightweight. A premium for that model Pays for the lighter bell. You can also buy direct from MTM.

Michael was kind enough to allow me to take his demonstrator CG model home for several weeks to try out and I found it to be an invigorating partner. Playing this trumpet makes me smile. It has an honest, upfront sound that immediately gets me singing, “Come on, shake your body, Baby. Do the Conga!” The sound from behind is somewhat thin, because of the ultra-lightweight bell, but it carries well enough. The upper register is really easy, never stuffy and just cooks. What fun! I had the horn the day I first tried video recording with my Olympus DSLR. It proved to be the best of three horns on hand at getting a signal down on the recording, that day. The high overtones are all “right there.” Intonation is good. The Benge Scale is still present, but not a problem at all.



I feel like this is a natural-born party horn. Fun, lively, friendly, the CG never seems to put a foot wrong. I could easily play this trumpet for everything, although I admit it would take a bit more work to play heavy classical music or dark blues ballads. The timbre is simply lighter than what a heavier bell would produce. Still, when I see that forward swept second valve slide with those darling little turnings, feel the feather weight of the horn in my hand and experience how quickly it lights up when I play, I just can’t seem to wipe that silly grin off my face. What fun!


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Brian A. Douglas

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There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.


Last edited by shofarguy on Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:57 pm; edited 2 times in total
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yourbrass
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fun stuff, thanks, Brian! I hope they sell well, there's nothing like a good Benge.
-Lionel
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:06 am    Post subject: Re: Do You Believe in Ghosts? Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
Burbank can now legally use the “X” in the model names and can use the CG moniker on the 6X lightweight. A premium for that model still goes to the Claude Gordon Estate.


Fantastic write-up Brian! Thanks for letting us know about the resurgence of Thomas's Burbank line.

But I've got to ask, what "Claude Gordon Estate"?! To my knowledge, all of Claude's descendants are dead (even his stepson whom himself had no descendants). As far as I knew, the last things left of the estate were sold at auction and I believe the source of those things was the local Jehovah's Witnesses Kingdom Hall in Big Bear, California as Patty had decreed that whatever was left go to the Church upon the death of her son.

I have tried contacting that Kingdom Hall numerous times over the years, as I would like to clean up, possibly re-edit and distribute Claude's clinic video "The Seven Natural Elements of Brass Playing" originally produced by the Selmer Corporation. I want to be sure that if the JW hold the copyright, they would either sell it to me or at least allow me to go ahead and "spread the word" of Claude's teaching. But all I get is an answering machine every time I call (even during normal business hours) and they never return my calls.

So, if you or Thomas have some connection or know who ended up with the rights to the Claude Gordon name and Estate (which ironically is probably someone or an entity that never knew Claude and never played trumpet), I'd sure like to know how to reach him, her, or them.

Thanks,

John Mohan

P.S. PM me if you want to be discreet.
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jaemard
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always a treat to read your reviews, Brian. Would love to own one of these horns.
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

VERY interesting and well written. The only downside monetarily for me is now I may have another horn to add to my "eventually" list!😉

Brad
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Do You Believe in Ghosts? Reply with quote

John Mohan wrote:
shofarguy wrote:
Burbank can now legally use the “X” in the model names and can use the CG moniker on the 6X lightweight. A premium for that model still goes to the Claude Gordon Estate.


Fantastic write-up Brian! Thanks for letting us know about the resurgence of Thomas's Burbank line.

But I've got to ask, what "Claude Gordon Estate"?! To my knowledge, all of Claude's descendants are dead (even his stepson whom himself had no descendants). As far as I knew, the last things left of the estate were sold at auction and I believe the source of those things was the local Jehovah's Witnesses Kingdom Hall in Big Bear, California as Patty had decreed that whatever was left go to the Church upon the death of her son.

I have tried contacting that Kingdom Hall numerous times over the years, as I would like to clean up, possibly re-edit and distribute Claude's clinic video "The Seven Natural Elements of Brass Playing" originally produced by the Selmer Corporation. I want to be sure that if the JW hold the copyright, they would either sell it to me or at least allow me to go ahead and "spread the word" of Claude's teaching. But all I get is an answering machine every time I call (even during normal business hours) and they never return my calls.

So, if you or Thomas have some connection or know who ended up with the rights to the Claude Gordon name and Estate (which ironically is probably someone or an entity that never knew Claude and never played trumpet), I'd sure like to know how to reach him, her, or them.

Thanks,

John Mohan

P.S. PM me if you want to be discreet.


John,

That's a good question. To be honest, it escaped me while talking to Michael, but I can ask him the next time we talk.
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There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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Jerry
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a chance to give some of these horns a quick blow at last year's NAMM show. I'm not a Benge guy, but the 3X+ is the one that spoke to me best. (Michael seemed to me to be a really nice guy.)
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trumpet.sanity
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there a web site for Michael Thomas?
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trpthrld
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I worked for Mike in his store for a couple of years after I got out of the USAF Band in Riverside, CA. He is one of the all-time GREAT guys. That was how I became associated with Kanstul, and the rest is history.

Mikey is a pretty fine trumpet player, too.

I play-tested HUNDREDS of the Burbank line of horns before we sent them out to dealers & players. The line included a flugel with a 6 1/2" bell and BEAUTIFUL engraving, a fixed-bell D/Eb trumpet, and both a short-bell & long-bell piccolo trumpet. Also a mid-line horn with a reverse lead-pipe (model 900) that played as well as the pro-line horns. We also had a student line...I think the model 601?

It was pretty easy to tell who my private students were in that part of California - most played the 900, a few the 601 & a couple were on the Benge copies.

There were also either 9 or 10 Burbank "C" trumpets made. Very light-weight, more of a C for chamber / quintet than a full orchestra. A former student has one of them and I sure wish I had kept it instead of selling it to him.

I don't remember if there were any Burbank cornets.

Freelance trumpeter Warren Roche was the "Roche" of "Roche-Thomas."

If you watch the movie "Lady Sings the Blues," Mike is in a few of the shots. His big scene is they're on a long bus ride, Diana Ross is singing a song with Richard Pryor...and Mike is pretty much center-screen, between the two of them.
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

trumpet.sanity wrote:
Is there a web site for Michael Thomas?


Not at the moment. It's being redesigned, I believe. So, go to horntrader.com for video descriptions and demonstrations. You can email Michael at resp88fa@verizon.net and you can phone him at (909) 496-1144
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There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's ironic, but in a good way, that the Burbank 6XCG has a .470" bore (which is what Claude wanted Benge to produce the horn with in the first place) due to Kanstul no longer making .468" bore tubing, given the fact that the reason Benge wouldn't make the horn in .470" bore is they didn't have and didn't want to spend the money to produce tooling in that size, so the original CG trumpets were only offered in .468" bore.
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For those who are planning to attend ITG in Hershey Pennsylvania this year, Michael Thomas will have a booth there with a selection of Burbank Horns, Irving Bush mouthpieces and EMO Mutes.

Michael invites all of you to drop by his stand and say hi.
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Brian A. Douglas

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There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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qcm
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Do You Believe in Ghosts? Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
In fact, I believe the Burbank trumpets being manufactured today in the Kanstul Musical Instruments factory are among the best of their kind ever. They differ from Kanstul’s own model 1000, 1001 and 1070 in detail, but those details make more of a difference than I imagined. The first and most obvious difference is that, while the Kanstul horns use a lightened version of the bottom valve caps used on their signature line, Burbank horns have the original Benge design. Other details include the original style mouthpiece receiver and water key mounting pads.


Also, the Kanstul bell is a touch heavier on the 1000 compared to my Benge 3X. I remember making that remark to Charles Hargett at ITG a number of years ago. Very, very nice horn, but just a little bit different than my Benge.

I played a number of Burbanks back in the 80's. If memory serves, they used a star in their model names. A 3 star was really a Benge 3X. When I played the 3 star, it felt like I was playing my 3X.

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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2017 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

David,

Yes, a few things are a touch heavier on the 1000 & 1001. The bottom valve caps are the most obvious. The mouthpiece receiver is machined, not drawn as the Benge horns were.

As far as the bells go, everything Zig ever told me about Benge horns points to them being essentially the same as what Kanstul is making today. He said that Benge used .020" sheet brass, the same as Kanstul. You and I saw the mandrels, right? The one thing that is different today compared to my own '76 Benge is that the bell wire is a larger gage now. That, and that Kanstul has added a hydraulic punch to cut out the shape of the bell from roll stock, whereas this was done by hand with a template and shears at Benge.

Still, the sheet stock varies within the roll, too, as much as 10% +/-, according to Zig, so the weight of individual horns will vary because of that. And I imagine each fabricator will turn out bells that are drawn a little bit differently than the next guy's.
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Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:44 am    Post subject: Re: Do You Believe in Ghosts? Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
Also, the large bore horns are now .470” bore, as Kanstul doesn’t make 468” parts.


Given the above, how does Kanstul go about repairing or restoring any 6X or CG Benge trumpets that need new tubing or pistons if they don't make .468" parts?

By the way, one of my students from Germany recently bought a new Burbank 6XCG from Steve Dillard (The Horntrader) and loves it. He had been playing a Kühnl trumpet (not sure which model). He sounds much better on the Burbank - nice, bright sound that rings. The Benges (and now Burbanks) make great recording horns. Microphones, whether in a recording studio, or on a decent Webcam, love them!

One more question: Does anyone know for sure how thick the sheet brass used for the CG Benge, CG Selmer and the Burbank 6XCG horns respectively was?

Cheers,

John Mohan
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Brent
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:32 am    Post subject: Kanstul Reply with quote

If I recall correctly, the Kanstul 1000 is more of a copy of the Chicago Benge. Anyone had a chance to really play each side by side?

The Kanstul 1000 family of horns sure get positive reviews.

Brent
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John,

The Benge and Burbank bells are made fro .016" sheet brass. Well, the early Benge horns were .020" brass, then buffed down at the bell flare. The change to the lighter stock happened because Benge technicians lost too many horns while buffing down the bells and Zig felt the lighter stock would give essentially the same effect without the high loss ratio.

Brent, the Chicago line was patterned off a mint Chicago Benge some guy found in his (I think) dead relative's closet and brought to Kanstul to identify. The Burbank horns were originally made from bell mandrels found in Elden's mother's Chicago home attic. So, assuming Elden used those mandrels while making horns in Chicago, both the current Kanstul Burbank and Chicago lines are related directly to the Chicago Benge trumpets. The real Burbank and LA Benge horns are made from different #3 bell mandrels. I think the non-Chicago bells have a little bit darker sound.
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Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Michael Thomas has launched a new website for The Burbank Trumpet Company. It's a very nice site! It also links to a PDF of the article I wrote comparing the Benge and Burbank 3X+ trumpets.
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Brian A. Douglas

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There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
John,

The Benge and Burbank bells are made fro .016" sheet brass. Well, the early Benge horns were .020" brass, then buffed down at the bell flare. The change to the lighter stock happened because Benge technicians lost too many horns while buffing down the bells and Zig felt the lighter stock would give essentially the same effect without the high loss ratio.


Thanks for the info on the thickness. Regarding what you wrote about the DOH!!! moment when Zig suggested they simply order thinner sheet brass, I'd have loved to have been a fly on the wall at that moment.

I've written about that in the past as well. From: http://everythingtrumpet.com/gearhead/BengeCGdetails.html :

Quote:
Later when Zig Kanstul took over as manager for Benge he noticed that workers were spending many hours custom buffing down the metal on the CG Benge bells (over-buffing and losing a lot of them), so he made the intelligent decision to make the CG bells from a thinner gauge of brass--more consistent, quicker and cheaper.
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
Michael Thomas has launched a new website for The Burbank Trumpet Company. It's a very nice site! It also links to a PDF of the article I wrote comparing the Benge and Burbank 3X+ trumpets.


Yes, beautiful website. I wish Michael Thomas the best success - glad to see a good website finally launched.
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