Weltklang Rotary Flugel mouthpiece suggestions

Andreas Sperhis

Hi!

I recently bought an old Weltklang rotary flugelhorn from a flea market in the centre of Athens, Greece.
The instruments being sold there usually serve only decoration purposes so they are crap and very cheap.
The sellers cannot evaluate the quality of the instruments. So I got this flugel for 60 euros only!

I had a look in TH forum about Weltklang horns so I know that they are considered average or even poor.
However this one is quite playable, sounds very good and looks awesome (except the dents on the bell!):

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Right know I am using my trumpet mouthpiece to play it, a bach 1.5C.
The flugel sounds very sharp, almost a semitone, and the mouthpiece
shank is too narrow. The mouthpiece is about .5 cm deeper in the lead pipe than it should. I can estimate this because there is a mark from my trumpet's mouthpiece receiver on the mouthpiece. So I am looking for the right mouthpiece.

After reading some TH post about different flugel mouthpiece receivers and shanks my questions are:

1) I should get a german shank mouthpiece for this instrument, right?

2) I should get a mouthpiece that has the same rim and cup diameter my trumpet's mouthpiece has?

3) If the above are correct: I had a look at Thomann's and found this 3 different types of Warburton flugel mouthpieces, german shank (all same cup width as the Bach 1.5C):

3FLG medium depth
3FLMG standard depth
3FLXG extra deep

I have to decide which one might be suitable. I am between the medium 3FLMG and the standard 3FLG . I am looking forward to play
some balkan brass stuff and maybe I need the easier high range. Any other suggestions more than welcome.

Your opinions please! Thanks in advance!

Nikos K, Athens Greece

Klastos · Regular Member Joined: 15 Aug 2004 Posts: 51

In my experience playing rotary flugel in a Balkan band, there is no reason to get a special German shank flugel mouthpiece. I've had several such mouthpieces, and while they had their place, my trumpet mouthpiece has always ended up working better.

The shank size difference is minimal. While the trumpet mouthpiece inserts a bit further (like you said, about a half centimeter), the Tilz and Klier flugel mouthpieces that I have had were all shorter overall, resulting in similar pitch. A Bach 1.5C should work fairly well, but each horn and set of chops is different.

The Serbian truba sound is a bright, wide trumpet sound, so there's no reason to play a deep funnel cup, and even most German flugel mouthpieces are pretty shallow to facilitate the generally high tessitura of the flugelhorn in German wind band music.

Regarding the overall too-high pitch of your Weltklang, could it be old enough to have been built to a different tuning standard? I do not know what pitch standards were common in the GDR.

maxbert · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 2:00 am Post subject:

https://www.thomann.de/de/jk_mundstueck_fluegelhorn_1_1_2c.htm

try this one! Same size, right shank and not expensive.

Andreas Sperhis · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 12:04 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the replies! Klastos I appreciate a lot your comments, knowledge about truba balkan brass playing is rare! I may try to get a shallow german shank mouthpiece cause I want to see if it will fix some intonation issues from low C to the bottom of the range. Maybe it is just the instrument's fault. I wonder if it's in B instead of Bb, the lead pipe needs to be pulled out 8-10cm to play in Bb this thing!

maxbert thanks for the suggestion, I will have to think about it a little

Maarten van Weverwijk · Heavyweight Member Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 3377

FWIW,

It Is my experience that Curry TF mouthpieces (trumpet shank with flügel cup) work great on rotary flügelhorns, both sound- and pitch-wise.
If you're looking for a slightly less dark sound, Curry's TC-series (trumpet shank with deepish cornet cup) will provide a good compromise.
Please be aware that a rotary flügelhorn has a far more compact sound than the rounder, more velvet-like piston flügels.

And yes, if you have to pull it out that far your instrument is probably high-pitched (around A-452/455).

MvW.

Klastos · Regular Member Joined: 15 Aug 2004 Posts: 51

Yes, for a rich, mellow flugel sound, the Curry TF sounds fantastic on rotary flugel. As far as German shank flugel mouthpieces go, my favorite so far is an unlabeled, raw brass Tilz that came with my Ganter flugel. Still, I always go back to my trumpet mouthpiece. I should note that I find tighter-than-average backbores don't sound good on the flugel (the sounds gets somewhat nasal). A Bach 1 1/2C should be just fine.

I have a nice piston flugel that I use for jazz and quintet playing, so the rotary is just for Balkan stuff, and in that context endurance is everything. Play the mouthpiece that you are most comfortable with.

Maarten van Weverwijk · Heavyweight Member Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 3377

Andreas Sperhis · Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:18 am Post subject:

Hi!

Just want to say that my personal safari for a mouthpiece to suit my vintage weltklang rotary flugel is over. German shank mouthpieces helped intonation considerably.

First I tried the JK 1 and 1/2C: nice dark sound, improved intonation in comparison with bach 1 and 1/2 C trumpet mouthpiece, but quite difficult to play in the high register.

Second was the Warburton 3flmg, This one improved intonation as well but also made high register much easier. Very happy about this mouthpiece, expensive (120 euros+shipping to Greece) but very good results. Not very dark sound but since I want to play some balkan brass repertoire the outcome is great.
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