Lotus Trumpets

[anrapa]

No problem! Spain is a wonderful country too!
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AR Resonance Trumpets and Mouthpieces

Trumpets and mouthpieces: the ones I make

[trumplyr]

anrapa: From dstpt, "I was not the person that wrote about the “two pillars of the trumpet world,” btw. It was Marty, a.k.a. “trumplyr,” and I understood him to be referring to the two well-known names in our world affiliated with Lotus Trumpets: Adam Rapa, known mainly (to me) as a performer, and Andy Taylor, who has had a trumpet line under his name for some time.".

dstpt is entirely correct. I not only wrote that comment but let me assure you there was absolutely no sarcasm involved. I'm sorry I didn't know about you or your trumpet line (I do now ).

Anyway, I think everyone involved in these latest posts are now clear as to who is who. New ideas and theory's are always welcomed and I admire your drive to market your own designs. I wish you much success.

I'm feeling that this line of posts between a number of us should end before it starts to feel like beating a dead horse (no sarcasm or ill will here either).
_________________
Marty

"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth.
Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is the best."
Frank Zappa

[anrapa]

Thanks a lot Marty
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AR Resonance Trumpets and Mouthpieces

Trumpets and mouthpieces: the ones I make

[jojocat]

[wee steve]

Hmmm Interesting that Eclipse is being likened to monette,
I can't see any similarity, maybe the finishes slightly, the Original eclipse was about having a rear tuned trumpet with a standard body and a choice of bells, there where a few heavy ones around but they are certainly not a heavy horn, forward 19 years to the latest generation, the traditional tuned Eclipse, built in a bach style, not Monette but with interchangeable leadpipe system, or the Enigma, reverse leadpipe slightly more like the original eclipse in design again not heavy.

My point is that these horns may look alike but I can bet the sound and playability are completely different, it's very easy to say that one influenced that one but there are only so many things you can do, it's a trumpet.

These are obviously all great horns and some will like monettes and hate taylors and vice versa and the same with Bach Schilke Eclipse etc..

I loved my B and S Challenger II and hated my Bach 37, they looked the same.
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Eclipse Celeste MY 2023
B & S Challenger flugelhorn

Previous horns:
Eclipse Celeste CLS MY
Eclipse LY (rear tuned)
Bach ML37
B & S Challenger ii

[spyke]

I'm definitely interested in anrapa's trumpets as well. I agree with dstpt, I love the Italian names.
(I'm also an American, and as an aside, quite dislike the various trademarked mass consumer culture Italian-sounding portmanteaus or neologisms like "Frappuccino" that we have here. I appreciate real words, you know?)

So on the topic of these Lotus trumpets:

[anrapa]

[quote="spyke"]I'm definitely interested in anrapa's trumpets as well. I agree with dstpt, I love the Italian names.
(I'm also an American, and as an aside, quite dislike the various trademarked mass consumer culture Italian-sounding portmanteaus or neologisms like "Frappuccino" that we have here. I appreciate real words, you know?)

Oh, boy... while I do love how meat is cooked in steak houses all over the US and many other dishes are great too, I really don't understand why millions of Italians that moved to the United States can't fix the pepperoni/peppers/salame thing, or the Latte (which is our Caffè e Latte), or the Alfredo sauce that no one has ever seen or eaten in Italy.
So many things about Italy are totally made up and make no sense to us. But I REALLY like the States, every time I visit them I feel lucky.
But please, turn the air conditioning off!!!

(It would be fun to open a topic regarding people trying mouthpieces and horns in Italy Vs. the States!)
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AR Resonance Trumpets and Mouthpieces

Trumpets and mouthpieces: the ones I make

[Grits Burgh]

Anrapa, your lost post about American style Italian peaked my interest. I didn't want to hijack this thread, so see my post in the lounge.

Warm regards,
Grits
_________________
Bach Stradivarius 37 (1971)
Schilke HC 1
Getzen 3810 C Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet (1945)
B&S 3145 Challenger I Series Flugelhorn
Life is short; buy every horn you want and die happy.

[trumplyr]

Hello All,

I had posted some negative opinions about Lotus Trumpets lack of communication. It's only fair that I let you know that I received a reply yesterday from them and have followed up with another few emails.

I believe they are a small outfit and were simply overwhelmed with workload at that time.

Henrik has been very helpful in answering all my questions so I'm happy to report that all is well, no issues.

If you're interested in their trumpets I'd advise you to give them a chance and be a little patient on reply time. I guess I should have been.
_________________
Marty

"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth.
Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is the best."
Frank Zappa

[john4860]

Hello,

This is my first post to Trumpet Herald.

I sent them (Lotus) an email regarding purchasing one of their trumpets specifically I'm interested in their 4 valve Rapa trumpet.

Since the fourth valve allows extending range downward, my guess is that practicing on the 4 valve model would be beneficial for all aspects of trumpet performance. The better my low register is the better I am able to play in the upper register.

Does anyone have any experience with 4 valve trumpets or flugelhorns and it that assumption correct?

Thanks,

John
_________________
Staying relaxed is 90% of trumpet playing

[dstpt]

[dstpt]

Another email from Lotus Trumpets to share:
------------
Thanks a lot for your inquiry. Yes indeed, the brightest horn in our arsenal is the Lead Model, and we can certainly keep the hardware as light as possible. The price of all our horns is €5000, which is currently around $5600, plus shipping. (No sales tax 👍)

The F trumpet conversation kit is a possible add-on to the Rapa 4-Valve, which you certainly won’t be ordering if your goal is to keep the horn as light as possible.

The MAW valve manufacturer doesn’t offer any diagrams graphically showing the airflow, because the air still travels the same general path, as defined by the location of the valve-slide ports, just without all the accumulative resistance. They do offer this picture, but that doesn’t quite satisfy your request. They sell replacement valves for some standard brands of trumpet as well, including Bach. Big upgrade, for sure.

MAW Valve.png {Not sure how to upload the image he sent.}

If you meant to ask about the A-trumpet conversion, I’ll have to get back to you on the price of the Deluxe kit, as we’re not sure what the sales price will be. I have a specialist in natural horns working on bending the pretty, pigtail loop-d-loop into the tuning slide, which is NOT an easy task with such a tight loop. Once he’s got it down to a specific amount of time involved, which is bound to get faster than his prototype, he’ll know what to charge me. When we have that info, we’ll make out a video showcasing the feature. I’m having them made for every horn I own, and I think it’s a no-brainer add-on.

The Standard kit however, is €370 (currently $415), and that’s made in-house by Andy Taylor.

Hope this answers everything else for now.

I'd love for you to experience first hand how great these horns feel to play! If you have any more questions, feel free to give us another shout.

Talk to you soon,

Adam

[rufflicks]

Wow where to start with this thread?

I was just feet away from the Lotus table at the ITG the entire time. I took a moment to play the Lead Model on 2 occasions. My first impression was similar to the one Tony offers on page 3. I had some difficulty finding a center on the horn. It was almost like there were 2 different centers, one in the low to mid register then a different one from the top of the staff on up. I told Adam I would have to take more time to figure it out. He invited me back to have another go the next morning. This time I brought out a large grouping of couplers. (Gap adjustable mouthpiece) I found my best match/gap in a 3.5 coupler. Anything else produced less than desirable results for me… for me! Once I had this configuration I felt the horn played well but I was not at home on it. I was able to move throughout all registers on up to a double C. The feel was different than what I am used to. It was not unmanageable but it was a bit unsettling. The sound of the horn was not quite what I like to hear. This is not a conventional horn and I would be, (I say this with love and respect to all) cautious about laying down $5600.00 on this instrument. I personally would need more time with the instrument and I would like to play it in a familiar setting before making a commitment.

I played the AR Resonance as well. I can confirm they are different playing horns to be sure. I would need more time to figure out my optimal setting on the AR than what I had in that moment. I did not spend enough time with the AR to give it a fair comparison. I struggled on the AR to get above the G above high C. It might become easier if I could dial in the Gap. I did not get to fully explore the system Antonio has to accommodate conventional mouthpieces. It is possible that given time I could optimize this setup. Again I would need much more time working with the horn in familiar surroundings to fully evaluate it.

I picked up a Taylor played a few notes and immediately set it down. It was the same reaction I had to these horns many years ago. They just are not in my wheel house.

None of these horns are my cup of tea. That being said, if I was forced to choose because these were the only 3 builders left after the fast food wars, I would spend my time figuring out the Lotus.

Since this thread has devolved let me take a moment to take us further off topic.

I did take a moment and play horns in the Getzen/Edwards room and the Shires Room. There are some nice horns in the Getzen line but the surprise was the Edwards X-13. Paul suggested I give it a blow and he was spot on! This is a fine instrument and was immediately accessible. It was even, in tune all the way up and down, with a good full rich sound and an open blow. I could play soft and sweet or paste a double C with control and authority. It is a large bore and it plays a tad more open than what I am used to, but overall very worth a blow. I could take the horn off the table straight to any gig and know it would be just fine.

In the Shires room I played 2 horns… well 3 actually. I had to play Doc’s model as he was sitting in a chair the entire time I was trying horns so I felt it was the right thing to do. I walked in and asked Samantha for an open blowing ML that was the type of horn commercial players gravitate towards. She selected 2 horns, the first one was a good playing horn. I was at home on it and I could play comfotably throughout all registers. It felt even and had a nice sound. The extreme upper register did not quite have the authority as the X-13 and when played soft it was not as sweet as the X-13. It was just a tad tighter than I am used to but played well. I believe Samantha said it was a CL. Looking at their website it might have been the CLW. The 2nd horn I tried was noticeably more stuffy and I put it down rather quickly. Props to Samantha for getting it right on the first try! I then tried Doc’s model, I was not as at home on that horn as I was on the CL so this too was a short test ride.


Antonio when you say “Any B&S, Yamaha, Shire, Stomvi is A LOT more similar to a Bach than my horns to Andy’s". I think you mean that you can find horns in the B&S, Yamaha, Shire, Stomvi lines that are more similar to a Bach trumpet than yours is to Andy’s horns. In other words; each manufacture has a horn in their line that has a greater similarity to one of the Bach horns than yours do to Andy’s.. (You see not all horns in a line of instruments are similar to Bach models)

Stomvi has a wide variety of trumpets of which most do not look like a Bach. I intimately know this line and it is true that there are some mild similarities between a couple Stomvi models and Bach models but they are distinctly different. All Stomvi instruments have the same spit valves and they are Stomvi spit valves. The shape of the braces are different, the valve blocks are different and so on. If Vicente read your quote I think he would passionately disagree with your statement. I think Vicente would also assert that Stomvi trumpets play and sound different as well.

The point has been made that even if horns look alike on the outside they may not play the same. The real work is on the inside and a great deal of how the horn plays is determined by the air column. This is where the real difference in the horns starts.

What is being speculated is that Lotus and AR both have some relationship with Taylor. It is a logical conclusion that inspiration for some design aspects may have come from this relationship. You started this speculation with your first post on page 1. Without explanation you posted links. It was obvious you were making a statement and the logical conclusion was that there was similarity between the horns. If you were trying to show that the horns were different this may not have been the best approach. A simple statement that Taylor, AR and Lotus are separate companies with independent design teams would have been a much more concise way to dispel any question that the horns share design components. Unfortunately your 1st post lit this fire.

Now back to the regularly scheduled program…thread.

Best, Jon
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Rufftips

Remember this is supposed to be fun.

[anrapa]

Ciao Jon!
My comparison between your horns and Bach's was simply VISUAL and meant to show that if we want to look superficially at trumpets as B&S or Stomvi or other "non Monette looking" (whatever that means), they have many more similarities than what a Monette has to a Bach.
We all know that not only there are many visual differences, if we want to look into them, but most importantly, what's inside is a lot more important than what an eye can, poorly, see.
I still own 3 Stomvi horns and I owned not less than 15 so I totally know how they are and how they play (very well to be honest).
That being said, the 2 minutes you spent on the horn are unfortunately not enough to carefully check a horn that is designed to offer hundreds of combinations.
If there's an "universal" consensus on my horns is that they have an extremely stable and open high register. If that didn't work for you, and you can definitely play high notes, it means you didn't find your setup with the horn.

Here you can hear a few high notes with my horn: https://youtu.be/6ECOueiFoMI

Next ITG bring a set of couplers and plan a 15 minute session, I'll be happy to hear what happens once you find your ideal setup. [/youtube]
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AR Resonance Trumpets and Mouthpieces

Trumpets and mouthpieces: the ones I make

[Justin_Smith]

So many great trumpets out there.

I wish could have head over to ITG this year to try some of these beautiful horns.

As always, thanks Jon for your great review.

I would love to try one of Antonio's AR horns, Adams Lotus horns. I am looking forward to trying PT's X-13 when he is back N the bay this summer.

I have liked all of the newer Stomvi models which more players around here have been playing, thanks to you Jon. My favorite was the older prototype you had.

Thanks you all for making great trumpets. I think their should be very different horns, for different music, different players, so people can find the one the gives them their voice.
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Justin J. Smith

[rufflicks]

Tony,

I look forward to next year I very much want to spend some time figuring out my set up on your horn. I think that they are very interesting and worth the time needed to explore thier full potential. Like I said I think if I get things right it will change the way the upper register feels for me.

I do understand what you were trying to say about conventional horns and the way they look in comparison to Bach. Please forgive me I would not be a good representative for Stomvi if I did not clarify they are not Bach copies.

I very much look forward to seeing you again next year in Texas. Not only do I wish to spend more time playing your horns but I would also like to enjoy more time with you.

Till next year be safe and be well.

Best, Jon
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Rufftips

Remember this is supposed to be fun.

[rufflicks]

Justin,

Thanks for the kind words. I think you're absolutely correct all the manufactures out there have stepped up their game and are making good horns across the board. There are a lot of choices these days and it's fun to have such a wide selection. If you can find a manufacturer or company that you can develop a relationship with I think this aspect makes ownership even better. I've been lucky to have been able to work with a couple very great companies over the years in which I was able to develop a relationship. The feeling that you are actually part of something is extremely valuable to the player. This is what I enjoy most about working with Stomvi-USA. It is the level of engagement with the players that makes this whole thing fun.

Best, Jon
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Rufftips

Remember this is supposed to be fun.

[anrapa]

Thanks a lot Jon!
See you in Texas!
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AR Resonance Trumpets and Mouthpieces

Trumpets and mouthpieces: the ones I make

[Ed Kennedy]

[HERMOKIWI]