Always happy to think and discuss trad jazz and cornet sounds. Here's Andy Schumm with an old Conn cornet. What do y'all think of this sound? I'm a fan.
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 Posts: 5299 Location: Central Texas
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:57 am Post subject:
JazzFluegel wrote:
shofarguy wrote:
Jazz,
I know that what we refer to as lacquer.... In both cases, they are using an electrostatic spray gun to apply the finish. That is the reason the finish is so thin and has such a minuscule effect on the sound of the instrument.
As far as epoxy finishes go, I know less about them. ...e.
"Thin" would be nice; the lacquer on my 1525 which I bought new just a few years ago is more like "molecular.". Already worn off in places that should last decades. I have become adept with my Blitz cloth & my lovely wife's clear nailpolish... It arrived NIB with black spots (and poor solder work) which I promptly reported in writing and am still waiting for a reply Good thing it performs so magnificently. Thanks for the input, gV.
Hmm, well, different people wear through finishes at varying rates, largely based upon body chemistry (and perhaps diet choices). I have a 1525, and I play it *a lot* in band settings, often outdoors in the heat, as well as in a brass band. The lacquer looks brand new, and I've had it about 7 years now.
My father, on the other hand, can burn through a lacquered horn in a matter of months. _________________ "Music is like candy, you throw the (w)rappers away."
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:12 pm Post subject:
Hard to beat Andy Schumm and The Fat Babies. I've heard them several times at the Green Mill in Chicago and every time I think, "Man, these 'cats are the CSO of trad."
It's also hard to beat The Mill for atmosphere. It's barely changed from Prohibition days when the cops used to close it down several times a night. _________________ Jim Hatfield
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:30 pm Post subject:
Another variable that certainly affects tone as well as playability is mouthpiece drill size, a subject that isn't often addressed. Here's a link to an article with some interesting information on the ""role of the hole."
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 1:22 pm Post subject:
jhatpro wrote:
Another variable that certainly affects tone as well as playability is mouthpiece drill size, a subject that isn't often addressed. Here's a link to an article with some interesting information on the ""role of the hole."
I think another example is cup mass. Modern mouthpieces tend to have more metal around the cup. I find that mass results in possibly greater stability but at the expense of more effort to get the sound going. Playing a medium to small bore instrument with a lighter weight mouthpiece will spoil you for this type of music. Then you get frustrated trying to find more mouthpieces like that. I'm thinking of finding a mouthpiece maker to duplicate ones I have to make them available to all. _________________ Richard
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:01 pm Post subject:
Much as I love the look, feel, and build quality of my new WT American long cornet I've decided it's not the horn for me after all. At age 76, I just can't handle the .470 bore and 5-inch, fast flare bell.
It's going on eBay on Thursday. _________________ Jim Hatfield
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 2:03 pm Post subject:
After a two hour rehearsal with the WT, I sure feel 76! That .470 bore and 5-inch fast flare bell that I was so enamored with sucks the wind out of me big time.
It's a gorgeous horn - the best built I've ever held - but it's like a Maserati to a guy who's been driving the same Honda since 2006.
It's also a good reminder to "try before you buy." _________________ Jim Hatfield
I am sorry to read that, Jim. I turn seventy-five in a couple of weeks, and I can tell that I am working harder than ever. I got a silver Besson 10-10 shepherds crook this spring and had Rich Ita go through it, and I am suspecting that will be my short cornet, and my Kanstul American-style cornet that was a companion horn to the 610 trumpet is fast becoming my main horn for when I want a trumpet sound. I just carry a couple of shallower mouthpieces for when I want them.
I appreciate reading your experiences with the Wild Thing, and consider that to likely be my closest encounter with one for myself. _________________ Felton (Butch) Bohannon
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:52 pm Post subject:
Thanks, Butch. I've seen Rich's work and I'll bet that Besson is a winner. Next to my computer as I write this is a King Improved Perfecto that he improved even further! _________________ Jim Hatfield
After a two hour rehearsal with the WT, I sure feel 76! That .470 bore and 5-inch fast flare bell that I was so enamored with sucks the wind out of me big time.
It's a gorgeous horn - the best built I've ever held - but it's like a Maserati to a guy who's been driving the same Honda since 2006.
It's also a good reminder to "try before you buy."
I read this and I'm a little saddened that you want to let it go so soon. Then again, I have never met you and don't know anything about your physique or how you play.
I do know that, given enough time and some coaching, your playing would become more efficient and the amount of air you need to use would dramatically go down. In fact, in my experience, playing Wild Thing instruments affected my playing of any and all brass instruments in that way. Now, it doesn't matter if a horn is an extra large bore or a medium bore, I just don't use nearly as much air as I used to.
We start by trying to push against the horn's resistance, but that is not how to play Flip's instruments. His horns need a resonant embouchure and then they open up and sing! They seriously don't need to be "pushed." But, it takes awhile and a willingness to learn that new approach. _________________ Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10204 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:11 pm Post subject:
Thanks for your interest, Brian. I'm saddened, too, because I thought it was going to be the horn of my dreams but I need to be realistic. In my experience if it takes more than a few weeks to adjust to a different horn, it's probably not a good fit. _________________ Jim Hatfield
Always happy to think and discuss trad jazz and cornet sounds. Here's Andy Schumm with an old Conn cornet. What do y'all think of this sound? I'm a fan.
it looks like Bach,
but cant say how deep. Maybe Bach A or without letter?
and also if it is vintage or not, I heard there is difference between the vintage (NY) Bachs and the new ones...
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Good thing it performs so magnificently. Thanks for the input, gV.
