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trumpetman7984 Regular Member
Joined: 01 Sep 2017 Posts: 54 Location: Cincinnati
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:05 am Post subject: Flugelhorns |
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I am looking for suggestions for a new flugelhorn. I currently use a YFH-631 for my flugelhorn playing. I am open to all suggestions. _________________ Schilke B1 Bb
Yamaha 8445 C |
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Christian K. Peters Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Nov 2001 Posts: 1529 Location: Eugene, Oregon
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:31 am Post subject: Flugelhorn |
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Hello Trumpetman,
The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable. My opinion. Flugelhorn really is a secondary instrument in my book and unless you have money to burn, your Yamaha should serve you well. In my early circles, most had Yamaha, Getzen or Benge. Few had older Cousenons (sp?)which you could not pry out of their cold, dead hands. Some say that the older Olds are good copies of the Cousenon. I have owned a Getzen, Benge and now a Schilke. I guess I finally had money to burn. The Schilke plays nicely for what I do. _________________ Christian K. Peters
Schilke Loyalist since 1976 |
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Don Herman rev2 'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 8951 Location: Monument, CO
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Agreed the 631 is a nice horn. What is there about you do not like or wish to improve? What are you looking for in a new flugelhorn? _________________ "After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley |
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delano Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009 Posts: 3118 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 7:34 am Post subject: Re: Flugelhorn |
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Christian K. Peters wrote: | Hello Trumpetman,
The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable.. |
?????? |
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trickg Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2002 Posts: 5675 Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:11 am Post subject: |
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I'm with the others - what are you hoping to improve upon by moving away from the Yamaha 631? For me, that's the flugel I compare other flugels to because it's a consistently solid, nice playing flugel. _________________ Patrick Gleason
- Jupiter 1600i, ACB 3C, Warburton 4SVW/Titmus RT2
- Brasspire Unicorn C
- ACB Doubler
"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP |
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John Mohan Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Nov 2001 Posts: 9828 Location: Chicago, Illinois
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:47 am Post subject: Re: Flugelhorns |
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trumpetman7984 wrote: | I am looking for suggestions for a new flugelhorn. I currently use a YFH-631 for my flugelhorn playing. I am open to all suggestions. |
Keep your 631.
I've had mine for 40 years and I'd never part with it.
Best wishes,
John Mohan _________________ Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
1st Trpt for Cats, Phantom of the Opera, West Side Story, Evita, Hunchback of Notre Dame,
Grease, The Producers, Addams Family, In the Heights, etc.
Ex LA Studio Musician
16 Year Claude Gordon Student |
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trickg Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2002 Posts: 5675 Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:50 am Post subject: |
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If you absolutely must get something other than the Yamaha, there are a few to look at:
Kanstul 1525
Kanstul 925 (I owned one of these - WONDERFUL flugel)
Conn V1 Flugel
Getzen 4895 Custom Reserve _________________ Patrick Gleason
- Jupiter 1600i, ACB 3C, Warburton 4SVW/Titmus RT2
- Brasspire Unicorn C
- ACB Doubler
"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP |
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shofarguy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Sep 2007 Posts: 7003 Location: AZ
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:52 am Post subject: |
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The finest flugelhorn I have played is the Flip Oakes Wild Thing. There is, in my opinion, no flugelhorn that matches its sound, even timbre, intonation responsiveness and build quality.
Other really good horns I've played include: Kanstul 1025 (mine was better with a French taper mouth pipe); Kanstul 1525 (ditto the French taper); Adams (not sure which model I tried); Inderbinen Wood; Jupiter JFH 846RL (now JFH 1100R).
Of course, there are others to investigate, but I haven't necessarily tried them. I'm not going to publish my list of flugelhorns that I didn't like. _________________ Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds. |
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cbtj51 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2015 Posts: 722 Location: SE US
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:37 am Post subject: Re: Flugelhorn |
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Christian K. Peters wrote: | ...The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable. My opinion. Flugelhorn really is a secondary instrument in my book and unless you have money to burn, your Yamaha should serve you well. In my early circles, most had Yamaha, Getzen or Benge... . |
I always considered my Flugelhorn as a secondary instrument used for alternate shading and shaping of my playing and my old school '76 Getzen Eterna 895 fit the need well. I have played in mixed sections of Flugels ranging from the Yamaha 631 (very common), other Yamaha Models, Bach (only one) Benge (a couple) a few other Getzens, and once a Couesnon. However, during the last few years, Flugelhorn has become a dominate (most of the time) instrument in a group that I play in regularly. My Getzen fit the group well with it's ultra dark sound. I recently acquired a much newer, extremely low mileage model of the same horn, theoretically the same specifications, but it seems lighter, smaller, and definitely much brighter. It turned heads in my group immediately. I really like the valves (not even broken in yet) and ease of play, but the sound will take some getting used to. I'm still gravitating to my older one at the moment. Of course, I believe in using the horns that work best for me, which for the most part, are not what many, if not all, of my peers would choose for themselves.
My point? If you can, play a few others including another 631 using your mouthpiece and consider those that you like best. Choose the horn that you like the most for ease of play and sound that you like. I would not be surprised if you choose your original Yamaha. _________________ '71 LA Benge 5X Bb
'72 LA Benge D/Eb
'76 Bach CL 229/25A C
‘92 Bach 37 Bb
'98 Getzen 895S Flugelhorn
'00 Bach 184 Cornet
'02 Yamaha 8335RGS
'16 Bach NY 7
'16 XO 1700RS Piccolo
Reeves 41 Rimmed Mouthpieces |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 1991 Location: USA
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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It is hard to offer any sort of recommendation without knowing more about what you are looking for, what makes you unhappy with your current setup, etc. My favorite flugelhorn is the Getzen 3895. I found it to be a very versatile horn, giving me the sound that I wanted in a wide range of settings.
If you live close to one of the big "trumpet" music stores -- Dillon, Thompson, Chuck Levin's Washington Music Center, Austin Custom Brass, etc. -- you could plan a visit so that you can play whatever they have in stock. Otherwise, consider going to ITG or one of the other big trumpet festivals to try out flugelhorns there.
Good luck! |
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2579
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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Try putting a Denis Wick 4FL in your current horn and see what you think. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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rufflicks Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Mar 2011 Posts: 641 Location: Mesa AZ
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Robert P Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2579
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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That one guy on the list sounds kinda... Ruff. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel |
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HERMOKIWI Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2008 Posts: 2578
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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99% of how you sound on a flugelhorn is you. The easiest and cheapest way to change your sound, other than changing you, is to change to a different mouthpiece. There isn't anything wrong with the flugelhorn you have. Your time is better invested into deciding what you want your sound to be and improving your skill to produce that sound.
I assure you that Clark Terry would have sounded like Clark Terry on your existing horn. It's not the horn, it's the player. _________________ HERMOKIWI |
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21trumpet Veteran Member
Joined: 06 Jan 2007 Posts: 307 Location: So. California
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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shofarguy wrote: | The finest flugelhorn I have played is the Flip Oakes Wild Thing. There is, in my opinion, no flugelhorn that matches its sound, even timbre, intonation responsiveness and build quality.
Other really good horns I've played include: Kanstul 1025 (mine was better with a French taper mouth pipe); Kanstul 1525 (ditto the French taper); Adams (not sure which model I tried); Inderbinen Wood; Jupiter JFH 846RL (now JFH 1100R).
Of course, there are others to investigate, but I haven't necessarily tried them. I'm not going to publish my list of flugelhorns that I didn't like. |
Plus 1 on what Brian says about the Wild Thing Flugelhorn.
I am done looking for flugelhorns. I found the one for me and you should give Flip a call and have a chat with him before you buy. _________________ Bach Commercial - LT190SL1B
Thane Performance C Trumpet - Raw Brass
Wild Thing Flugelhorn - Copper - Raw
Yamaha YCR2330 Cornet
Yamaha Custom Piccolo
Monette B4S S2 Mouthpiece |
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LittleRusty Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 12647 Location: Gardena, Ca
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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HERMOKIWI wrote: | 99% of how you sound on a flugelhorn is you. The easiest and cheapest way to change your sound, other than changing you, is to change to a different mouthpiece. There isn't anything wrong with the flugelhorn you have. Your time is better invested into deciding what you want your sound to be and improving your skill to produce that sound.
I assure you that Clark Terry would have sounded like Clark Terry on your existing horn. It's not the horn, it's the player. |
At this point we don’t know if anything is wrong with his flugelhorn. I think we can all agree 631 is normally a good instrument. |
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giakara Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 3826 Location: Greece
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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Keep your horn and try some mpc's.
Regards _________________ Lawler TL5-1A Bb 2015
Lawler TL6-1A Bb 2004
Lawler TL5-1A Bb 2003
Getzen eterna 910 C
Getzen eterna 850 cornet
Selmer Paris 3 valve picc
Yamaha 731 flugel
Carol mini pocket
Reeves/Purviance mpcs |
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zaferis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2011 Posts: 2310 Location: Beavercreek, OH
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:17 am Post subject: |
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Keep the 631!.. You might look for a different mouthpiece if you're looking for an adjustment in tone or minor pitch corrections.
From there if you really need to upgrade or replace, having played a bunch at stores and conferences, the only one that I think will be an upgrade are:
Kanstul 1525
Adams F1
Van Laar _________________ Freelance Performer/Educator
Adjunct Professor
Bach Trumpet Endorsing Artist
Retired Air Force Bandsman |
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iiipopes Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Jun 2015 Posts: 545
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:53 am Post subject: |
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zaferis wrote: | Keep the 631! You might look for a different mouthpiece if you're looking for an adjustment in tone or minor pitch corrections. |
+1 _________________ King Super 20 Trumpet; Sov 921 Cornet
Bach cornet modded to be a 181L clone
Couesnon Flugelhorn and C trumpet |
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dstpt Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 1272
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Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:12 am Post subject: |
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I had a 631 for 32 years...great horn...sold it, because I wanted a 4-valve for various reasons but specifically to practice below low F-sharp without torquing the embouchure…so I got the Getzen. It served me well, but after five years with that flugel, I bought a used Marcinkiewicz (3-valve) model from ACB (because it has a tuning slide, and I thought I’d be able to add a trigger to it), but it was not a good fit blow-wise, so I sold it on eBay to a medical doctor in Singapore, who wanted to use it in worship after hearing one played in a church service. Then, I got the Adams F2 from ACB, which is the darkest in sound quality of the five Adams models, according to what I recall Trent saying in one or more of his videos. I wanted the darker quality to have more contrast to my B-flat and C trumpets, but immediately missed the 4th valve, so I traded it at ACB for the Adams F4 (the Adams 4-valve). Very happy with the F4, but now I want triggers on all slides (except 2, of course). Just a trigger-happy guy, I guess. The color of the F4 seems very close to the F2. This is the one I got:
Red Brass and Nickel Silver bell
.55mm thickness
170mm flare (6.7")
Brushed lacquer
We're finishing a two-week run of "The Secret Garden," and I've been carrying it in my Bags of Spain quad case and I think I'll need to go back to the Adams case or to my Gard quad wheelie bag. I was running through the Webber "Pie Jesu" duet with my wife singing for a big funeral on Monday, and two of the valves started to hang. Had to switch to my B-flat with cup mute for the service. Pretty sure there must be some weird pressure happening inside that case, because I had some minor issues over the previous few days with those flugel valves during the shows as well, even after cleaning and oiling.
Update: went to carrying my Gard case for the four horns I’m using in the show and cleaned and lubricated the valves on the F4 and the show went fine without incident last night. Not sure if the pressure on the valves in the Bags of Spain quad case could be a contributing factor, but I’ll avoid using that case for the F4 for now. (Sure is a handy case, otherwise.) |
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