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Flugelhorns


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trumpetman7984
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:05 am    Post subject: Flugelhorns Reply with quote

I am looking for suggestions for a new flugelhorn. I currently use a YFH-631 for my flugelhorn playing. I am open to all suggestions.
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Christian K. Peters
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:31 am    Post subject: Flugelhorn Reply with quote

Hello Trumpetman,
The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable. My opinion. Flugelhorn really is a secondary instrument in my book and unless you have money to burn, your Yamaha should serve you well. In my early circles, most had Yamaha, Getzen or Benge. Few had older Cousenons (sp?)which you could not pry out of their cold, dead hands. Some say that the older Olds are good copies of the Cousenon. I have owned a Getzen, Benge and now a Schilke. I guess I finally had money to burn. The Schilke plays nicely for what I do.
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Don Herman rev2
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed the 631 is a nice horn. What is there about you do not like or wish to improve? What are you looking for in a new flugelhorn?
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delano
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 7:34 am    Post subject: Re: Flugelhorn Reply with quote

Christian K. Peters wrote:
Hello Trumpetman,
The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable..


??????
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trickg
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm with the others - what are you hoping to improve upon by moving away from the Yamaha 631? For me, that's the flugel I compare other flugels to because it's a consistently solid, nice playing flugel.
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject: Re: Flugelhorns Reply with quote

trumpetman7984 wrote:
I am looking for suggestions for a new flugelhorn. I currently use a YFH-631 for my flugelhorn playing. I am open to all suggestions.


Keep your 631.

I've had mine for 40 years and I'd never part with it.

Best wishes,

John Mohan
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trickg
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you absolutely must get something other than the Yamaha, there are a few to look at:

Kanstul 1525
Kanstul 925 (I owned one of these - WONDERFUL flugel)
Conn V1 Flugel
Getzen 4895 Custom Reserve
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The finest flugelhorn I have played is the Flip Oakes Wild Thing. There is, in my opinion, no flugelhorn that matches its sound, even timbre, intonation responsiveness and build quality.

Other really good horns I've played include: Kanstul 1025 (mine was better with a French taper mouth pipe); Kanstul 1525 (ditto the French taper); Adams (not sure which model I tried); Inderbinen Wood; Jupiter JFH 846RL (now JFH 1100R).

Of course, there are others to investigate, but I haven't necessarily tried them. I'm not going to publish my list of flugelhorns that I didn't like.
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cbtj51
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:37 am    Post subject: Re: Flugelhorn Reply with quote

Christian K. Peters wrote:
...The 631 is a nice horn. I had to look up the bore size to remember that this is the smaller bore size of the two models. Which I think is preferable. My opinion. Flugelhorn really is a secondary instrument in my book and unless you have money to burn, your Yamaha should serve you well. In my early circles, most had Yamaha, Getzen or Benge... .


I always considered my Flugelhorn as a secondary instrument used for alternate shading and shaping of my playing and my old school '76 Getzen Eterna 895 fit the need well. I have played in mixed sections of Flugels ranging from the Yamaha 631 (very common), other Yamaha Models, Bach (only one) Benge (a couple) a few other Getzens, and once a Couesnon. However, during the last few years, Flugelhorn has become a dominate (most of the time) instrument in a group that I play in regularly. My Getzen fit the group well with it's ultra dark sound. I recently acquired a much newer, extremely low mileage model of the same horn, theoretically the same specifications, but it seems lighter, smaller, and definitely much brighter. It turned heads in my group immediately. I really like the valves (not even broken in yet) and ease of play, but the sound will take some getting used to. I'm still gravitating to my older one at the moment. Of course, I believe in using the horns that work best for me, which for the most part, are not what many, if not all, of my peers would choose for themselves.

My point? If you can, play a few others including another 631 using your mouthpiece and consider those that you like best. Choose the horn that you like the most for ease of play and sound that you like. I would not be surprised if you choose your original Yamaha.
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Dayton
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is hard to offer any sort of recommendation without knowing more about what you are looking for, what makes you unhappy with your current setup, etc. My favorite flugelhorn is the Getzen 3895. I found it to be a very versatile horn, giving me the sound that I wanted in a wide range of settings.

If you live close to one of the big "trumpet" music stores -- Dillon, Thompson, Chuck Levin's Washington Music Center, Austin Custom Brass, etc. -- you could plan a visit so that you can play whatever they have in stock. Otherwise, consider going to ITG or one of the other big trumpet festivals to try out flugelhorns there.

Good luck!
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Robert P
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try putting a Denis Wick 4FL in your current horn and see what you think.
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rufflicks
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are a couple fine options.

The links are for playlists of these horns. The 631 is a good horn but there have been advances.

Elite Flugelhorn

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfAUQHpm4_foFRZZ2Vtz71-n-WxIr9pbO

The Titan flugelhorn is one of the finest playing and sounding flugelhorns available

Titan Flugelhorn

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1B27D191A0727294


Best Jon
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Robert P
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rufflicks wrote:
Here are a couple fine options.

The links are for playlists of these horns. The 631 is a good horn but there have been advances.

Elite Flugelhorn

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfAUQHpm4_foFRZZ2Vtz71-n-WxIr9pbO

That one guy on the list sounds kinda... Ruff.
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HERMOKIWI
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

99% of how you sound on a flugelhorn is you. The easiest and cheapest way to change your sound, other than changing you, is to change to a different mouthpiece. There isn't anything wrong with the flugelhorn you have. Your time is better invested into deciding what you want your sound to be and improving your skill to produce that sound.

I assure you that Clark Terry would have sounded like Clark Terry on your existing horn. It's not the horn, it's the player.
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21trumpet
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shofarguy wrote:
The finest flugelhorn I have played is the Flip Oakes Wild Thing. There is, in my opinion, no flugelhorn that matches its sound, even timbre, intonation responsiveness and build quality.

Other really good horns I've played include: Kanstul 1025 (mine was better with a French taper mouth pipe); Kanstul 1525 (ditto the French taper); Adams (not sure which model I tried); Inderbinen Wood; Jupiter JFH 846RL (now JFH 1100R).

Of course, there are others to investigate, but I haven't necessarily tried them. I'm not going to publish my list of flugelhorns that I didn't like.


Plus 1 on what Brian says about the Wild Thing Flugelhorn.
I am done looking for flugelhorns. I found the one for me and you should give Flip a call and have a chat with him before you buy.
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LittleRusty
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HERMOKIWI wrote:
99% of how you sound on a flugelhorn is you. The easiest and cheapest way to change your sound, other than changing you, is to change to a different mouthpiece. There isn't anything wrong with the flugelhorn you have. Your time is better invested into deciding what you want your sound to be and improving your skill to produce that sound.

I assure you that Clark Terry would have sounded like Clark Terry on your existing horn. It's not the horn, it's the player.

At this point we don’t know if anything is wrong with his flugelhorn. I think we can all agree 631 is normally a good instrument.
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giakara
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep your horn and try some mpc's.

Regards
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zaferis
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep the 631!.. You might look for a different mouthpiece if you're looking for an adjustment in tone or minor pitch corrections.

From there if you really need to upgrade or replace, having played a bunch at stores and conferences, the only one that I think will be an upgrade are:

Kanstul 1525
Adams F1
Van Laar
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iiipopes
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zaferis wrote:
Keep the 631! You might look for a different mouthpiece if you're looking for an adjustment in tone or minor pitch corrections.

+1
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dstpt
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a 631 for 32 years...great horn...sold it, because I wanted a 4-valve for various reasons but specifically to practice below low F-sharp without torquing the embouchure…so I got the Getzen. It served me well, but after five years with that flugel, I bought a used Marcinkiewicz (3-valve) model from ACB (because it has a tuning slide, and I thought I’d be able to add a trigger to it), but it was not a good fit blow-wise, so I sold it on eBay to a medical doctor in Singapore, who wanted to use it in worship after hearing one played in a church service. Then, I got the Adams F2 from ACB, which is the darkest in sound quality of the five Adams models, according to what I recall Trent saying in one or more of his videos. I wanted the darker quality to have more contrast to my B-flat and C trumpets, but immediately missed the 4th valve, so I traded it at ACB for the Adams F4 (the Adams 4-valve). Very happy with the F4, but now I want triggers on all slides (except 2, of course). Just a trigger-happy guy, I guess. The color of the F4 seems very close to the F2. This is the one I got:

Red Brass and Nickel Silver bell
.55mm thickness
170mm flare (6.7")
Brushed lacquer

We're finishing a two-week run of "The Secret Garden," and I've been carrying it in my Bags of Spain quad case and I think I'll need to go back to the Adams case or to my Gard quad wheelie bag. I was running through the Webber "Pie Jesu" duet with my wife singing for a big funeral on Monday, and two of the valves started to hang. Had to switch to my B-flat with cup mute for the service. Pretty sure there must be some weird pressure happening inside that case, because I had some minor issues over the previous few days with those flugel valves during the shows as well, even after cleaning and oiling.

Update: went to carrying my Gard case for the four horns I’m using in the show and cleaned and lubricated the valves on the F4 and the show went fine without incident last night. Not sure if the pressure on the valves in the Bags of Spain quad case could be a contributing factor, but I’ll avoid using that case for the F4 for now. (Sure is a handy case, otherwise.)
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