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How I found my "Canadian" Yamaha trumpet


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abundrefo
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 7:54 pm    Post subject: How I found my "Canadian" Yamaha trumpet Reply with quote

Well,

I played a few trumpets in the past. I started with an Olds Ambassador and I came from that to about 8 different brands and models. But, unfortunately I had to sell my last trumpet and I've been playing flugelhorn exclusively for the last year or so.

This week I was on a business trip to Montréal, Canada, and I thought I'd stop by Twigg Musique and test some horns. Fist of all, I was amazed by the way these guys from Twigg treated me. Geoffroy and Pierre-Olivier were great! They helped me a lot! I spent the whole afternoon there, I tried a lot of horns and these guys were always happy to help me with everything I asked them. ...so I really need to thank them!

Well...
I started with the Bach 19043B "Mariachi", two samples of the 19037 and the Bach Artisan. There was something familiar about the Artisan. Nice horn. But I did not fall in love for it. The 19043B was also nice but I couldn't figure out exactly how to work with articulation. Maybe I was overdoing it or the horn wanted me to be more precise and work on a better sync between tong and fingering. The tone was a bit on the bright side to my taste. I didn't like any of the two 19037 I tested. I felt a bit of backpressure and it surprised me that the 19037 wasn't so easy to play. I wanted to like it since the time I was watching video reviews about it.

Next, I asked for a Yamaha 9335NYSII. Just amazing. Very easy to play! But... I could't spend that much money.

So, Geoffroy said I should try a 8335IIS. He said that if I like the way the 9335NYSII plays but wanted something that's somehow similar to Bach, I should try the 8335IIS. He nailed it! It was very easy to play. It had a great tone and it was very even. Just a great horn!

Since I was already there and I had lots of time, I asked them for a few more horns. I tested a Schilke i32, a Yamaha 8335LA in lacquer and one in silver. The Schilke i32 was actually very good. I like it better than all the Bachs I tested there. But I was looking for a slightly broader tone. The 8335LA in lacquer was very, very good. But I didn't like the silver one. They played very different for some reason that may or may not have something to do with the finish.

I went back and forth playing the 8335IIS and the lacquered 8335LA. After playing just these two horns, I started getting more comfortable with the 8335IIS while I felt I was loosing a bit of control of the 8335LA.

So it seemed the 8335IIS was the one for me. Just in case, I asked if they had other 8335II samples. They had three other 8335IIs. Another one in silver, one in lacquer and a 8335IIRS. It turned out the first 8335IIS was still the best one for me. That also intrigued me because knowing that Yamaha is usually very consistent, there was a noticeable difference in the way the 8335IIS played against the 8335II in lacquer, but also when comparing the two 8335IIS against each other. Maybe it had something to do with waterkey screws tightness, maybe not...

Anyway, I'm very happy with the 8335IIS I picked. Seems like it will serve me well. Built quality is great. And it sounds smooth and incredibly nice.

I'm glad I had the chance to test all these horns and I'm glad I met Geoffroy and Pierre-Olivier. Great guys!
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brassmusician
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice! thanks for posting your observations about the different horns you played. Good that you got to try several 8335II's and could choose the best one. Not surprised that you found variability between them - makes me think that buying one sight unseen and unplayed is not a good idea, even with Yamaha's reputation for consistency. Another factor which I am sure comes into play when testing a variety of trumpets is mouthpiece gap. BTW I also play a Yamaha 635ST flugel which I had the good fortune to grab for next to nothing from a local auction website.
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi abundrefo

Congratulations on your new trumpet. I'm glad that you had such a positive experience and found a trumpet you really like. I really like my Xeno II too.

As a matter of interest and thinking about my comments on the classical v jazz trumpet thread, when I wondered whether my Xeno II seems more orchestrally orientated owing to me having the lacquered version, would you mind sharing whether you found any differences between the lacquered 8335II and the 8335SII you chose, over and above the differences between the two silver-plated ones, or which you could contribute to the different finish.

Many thanks

Lou
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jojocat
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The guys at Twigg-Musique ( Montreal and Quebec City ) are all great people.
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dstdenis
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your review of these instruments. I'm amazed at the the variety of models the store had in stock! Congratulations on finding an instrument you like.
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Morogan
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Congratulations on your new Xeno II. I would have loved to have had the opportunity to play several, identical models and variants against one another for comparison as you did -- that's always the best way. (I lucked into my 8345IIGS, which I am very happy with, thankfully.) I have not had good experiences locally when trying to do that, so kudos also to Twigg Musique and Geoffroy and Pierre-Olivier for their hosting abilities for a prospective customer. I wish more stores would be like that instead of "superstores". Enjoy the horn!
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dstdenis wrote:
Thanks for your review of these instruments. I'm amazed at the the variety of models the store had in stock! Congratulations on finding an instrument you like.


+ 1. It was great that the store had so many models in stock to try, and I also really enjoyed reading the reviews.

Best wishes

Lou
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Morogan wrote:
Congratulations on your new Xeno II. I would have loved to have had the opportunity to play several, identical models and variants against one another for comparison as you did -- that's always the best way. (I lucked into my 8345IIGS, which I am very happy with, thankfully.) I have not had good experiences locally when trying to do that, so kudos also to Twigg Musique and Geoffroy and Pierre-Olivier for their hosting abilities for a prospective customer. I wish more stores would be like that instead of "superstores". Enjoy the horn!


I couldn't agree more about wishing that a lot more stores were like this. I tried my Xeno II on approval and lucked in also. There seems to be quite a few of us now playing the Xeno II.

Take care

Lou
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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BobD
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Congrats on the new horn! I just bought the same one last week. I had been playing a beat up old Buescher Aristocrat student model from the 60's. I only tried one Bach 180-37S and one 8335IIS. Obviously they were both much better than the Buescher but between them the 8335 was easier to play and more in tune for me.

I think Yamaha makes fantastic instruments. I actually sold a Yamaha 62 tenor sax to fund the 8335IIS. Great sax.

Oh, not to derail the thread but one thing I noticed about the Yamaha was that the valves were kind of noisy compared to the Bach. It sounded like the valve guides were causing the noise on the 1st and 2nd valves but much less on the 3rd. Anyone else have valve noise?
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Morogan
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BobD wrote:
Oh, not to derail the thread but one thing I noticed about the Yamaha was that the valves were kind of noisy compared to the Bach. It sounded like the valve guides were causing the noise on the 1st and 2nd valves but much less on the 3rd. Anyone else have valve noise?

Funny, that's about the only criticism I have regarding my Xeno II -- the valves are definitely a bit louder than I'd prefer. However, by no means are they too loud; they do not distract me at all when I am playing.
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Morogan
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Louise Finch wrote:
I couldn't agree more about wishing that a lot more stores were like this. I tried my Xeno II on approval and lucked in also. There seems to be quite a few of us now playing the Xeno II.

Indeed, there do seem to be quite a few on here, at least. Frankly, I'm not surprised. These IIs do seem to be much improved over the originals of which I've sampled a few. Still wish I could have tried the 9335NYSII like our friend abundrefo got to do. =)
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BobD wrote:
Congrats on the new horn! I just bought the same one last week. I had been playing a beat up old Buescher Aristocrat student model from the 60's. I only tried one Bach 180-37S and one 8335IIS. Obviously they were both much better than the Buescher but between them the 8335 was easier to play and more in tune for me.

I think Yamaha makes fantastic instruments. I actually sold a Yamaha 62 tenor sax to fund the 8335IIS. Great sax.

Oh, not to derail the thread but one thing I noticed about the Yamaha was that the valves were kind of noisy compared to the Bach. It sounded like the valve guides were causing the noise on the 1st and 2nd valves but much less on the 3rd. Anyone else have valve noise?


Hi BobD

I've just got out my Xeno II to check and you are right that the valves are a little noisy (all three are the same). I don't think that it is the metal valve guides as my Bach trumpet also has metal valve guides, rather I think that it is spring noise. It doesn't bother me at all, and although when I checked for it, I realised that I had noticed it all along, it doesn't bother me at all. My Xeno cornet has quieter valves, but is admittedly a lot older.

Take care

Lou
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Morogan wrote:
Louise Finch wrote:
I couldn't agree more about wishing that a lot more stores were like this. I tried my Xeno II on approval and lucked in also. There seems to be quite a few of us now playing the Xeno II.

Indeed, there do seem to be quite a few on here, at least. Frankly, I'm not surprised.

Hi Morogan

I'm not either.


These IIs do seem to be much improved over the originals of which I've sampled a few.

I completely agree. I didn't think the Xeno I was that much different to my previous 6335HGII, but the Xeno II seems in a different class.

Still wish I could have tried the 9335NYSII like our friend abundrefo got to do. =)

Yes, I'd like to try one too, but the Xeno is good enough for me.

Take care

Lou


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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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BobD
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has anyone compared the the 8335IIS and 8335IIRS? The place I bought mine from is having a horn day this Sat. and they will have a couple of RS models. When I bought mine I only compared it to a Bach37 so was thinking about going Sat and trying a couple of RS models.
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dstdenis
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BobD wrote:
Has anyone compared the the 8335IIS and 8335IIRS? The place I bought mine from is having a horn day this Sat. and they will have a couple of RS models. When I bought mine I only compared it to a Bach37 so was thinking about going Sat and trying a couple of RS models.

I play-tested two reverse leadpipe models. I prefer the standard leadpipe model because it has a bit more resistance and focus, which I like. Here’s a good review from Chase Sanborn that goes into more detail: http://chasesanborn.com/2014/10/review-yamaha-xeno-trumpet/
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BobD
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that link. I think I'll probably go try a couple of horns but I can't imagine that any of them will play better than what I have.
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scottfsmith
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BobD wrote:
I can't imagine that any of them will play better than what I have.


If you come in with a closed mind you can be sure they won't! Stick your old horn in the pile and don't look at the numbers on the horns, just play them and see which one works best. I spent several hours at ITG this summer playing the whole Yamaha line of Bb trumpets, including all the artist models and my own old Xeno, and the 8335RGS was the winner for me.
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abundrefo
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brassmusician wrote:
BTW I also play a Yamaha 635ST flugel which I had the good fortune to grab for next to nothing from a local auction website.


Yes! I really like the 635ST. I compared it to a Couesnon and a few Adams in the past and I still prefer the sound of my 635ST.
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abundrefo
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Louise Finch wrote:
Hi abundrefo

Congratulations on your new trumpet. I'm glad that you had such a positive experience and found a trumpet you really like. I really like my Xeno II too.

As a matter of interest and thinking about my comments on the classical v jazz trumpet thread, when I wondered whether my Xeno II seems more orchestrally orientated owing to me having the lacquered version, would you mind sharing whether you found any differences between the lacquered 8335II and the 8335SII you chose, over and above the differences between the two silver-plated ones, or which you could contribute to the different finish.

Many thanks

Lou



Hi Lou,
Humm... I'm not sure how to describe it more accurately. When I played the lacquered version and the 8335IIS I bought, I just felt the 8335IIS was more precise and with a broader tone. Maybe the lacquered version was more transparent and had a tiny little bit of a softer slotting.


Last edited by abundrefo on Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:05 am; edited 2 times in total
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abundrefo
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dstdenis wrote:
Thanks for your review of these instruments. I'm amazed at the the variety of models the store had in stock! Congratulations on finding an instrument you like.


Thank you!
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