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Wild Thing Players


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INTJ
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Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:40 pm    Post subject: Wild Thing Players Reply with quote

It's been a long time since I have posted here, though I have had a history of coming and going since I first signed up here 15 years ago--which was about a year into a comeback after a 23 year layoff. I have been lurking for a while to try and reactivate the middle-aged memory, with mediocre success..............

Five or six years ago I went to the Wild side. I am like many who found the Wild Thing fit me better than anything else I had tried, to the point I quit looking. I think I remember I need to add a disclaimer: I do not disparage anyone else's choice of horn as different stuff works for different people.

I now have two silver WTs, Flip's flugel in lacquer, and Flip's C in silver. I had a copper bell WT for a while but I just didn't like how it dampened response for me, and when I played Flip's copper bell flugel I didn't like it for the same reason. Many more seem to like how the copper calms things down. I just got rid of the copper bell trumpet and acquired my second silver WT a couple weeks ago. My goal was to have two silver WT's that play the same, and they are nearly identical.

About four years ago I went to the #1 slide and left the others in a box somewhere. Well, with the new horn I just had to see how it worked with the #2 slide. That started a sequence of playing each of my slides (two #1s, two #2s, a #3 and a #4) in each horn, wondering if it would somehow help in my extreme upper range.

I hadn't done that it a long time and I again remembered why. A player's range is all about muscle memory and consistency, and in the long run swapping slides around works against that. However, there is value in the other slides to fine tune one's tone to fit a particular setting. The #2 would be a better choice for me when playing the WT with a chamber orchestra, though Flip's C works even better. (98% of what I do is play lead in a community jazz band.)

So who all plays Flip's horns here?
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Rapier232
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Joined: 16 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do. Silver, Bb. Use it for everything, matched with a Mike Lovatt Smith Watkins Lead mouthpiece with the 80gm booster.
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ChopsGone
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doesn't everyone? I have a silver Bb trumpet, a silver short model cornet, and a gold-plated flugelhorn among the Wild Things, and love them all.
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shofarguy
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Joined: 18 Sep 2007
Posts: 7003
Location: AZ

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

INTJ,

It's good to see you posting again! I remember back when you explained your user name. It made me curious, so I found the website and did the evaluation, myself. I don't recall the designation, but the description felt right on the money. It said I was one of 1%!

So, there's that.

As you can see in my signature, I play a copper WT Bb trumpet and flugelhorn. I used to own a very special silver WT trumpet that appeared in my original article called Into the Wild... Thing. Flip called it, "One of two exceptional trumpets that have ever come through my shop."

When he released the copper version and revised the lead pipe specification, I tried one of each there. Both Flip and Mike Drapp were adamant that I sounded better, more confident, on the new version. I was able to take both a silver and copper trumpet with the new lead pipe home for a short time to decide which I liked best.

I found that the silver plated brass bell has a thicker, more solid tone. On the other hand, the copper horn seems to have more brilliance and reminds me of the Benge sound I love so much, but with all of the wonderful bottom end one gets with a Wild Thing. I chose the copper version. I play it with a #1-J slide all of the time. The Wild Thing is still the finest trumpet I've ever played.

The same thing applies to the flugelhorn, in my experience. I bought a copper flugelhorn, in the raw, to test the performance of a nano coating Mike and I hoped to sell to players who wanted invisible protection for their raw brass instruments. For a couple of years I had both my original silver plated brass flugelhorn and this new copper version. The brass horn carried more weight in the sound and had a sense of solid authority, compared to the light and lithe feel of the raw copper. I ended up selling the brass horn to 1957Tim a couple of years ago. My copper flugelhorn is the best instrument I've ever owned of any type.

I've tried the copper Short Model cornet. The one I played fell a little short of the VERY special silver cornet I tried at the shop several years back. That cornet was dreamy... I wish I had had the money to buy it.
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Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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Don Herman rev2
'Chicago School' Forum Moderator


Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 8951
Location: Monument, CO

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I own and play:
Silver WT Bb
Silver Flip Oakes C ("Nice Thing")
Gold WT Flugelhorn
Silver WT short cornet

I also purchased my Kanstul 1523 D/Eb from Flip and he performed his full enhancement process on it. He had to buy the tooling for the smaller bore, now that's service!

I use a Kanstul 1520 A/Bb/G pic; that is the only horn I actively play that did not come from Flip.

The horns are great, but the real magic is the relationship formed with Flip over the years. He is a very special guy.
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Tsox
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Joined: 08 Dec 2015
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lacquer Bb with the #1 slide except for church work (#2 slide)
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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Location: Houston, TX.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also have a lacquered Bb, bought new from Flip about three years ago.

Like the OP, I went through nearly all the standard and J slides, I’m back to the braced #1, it just feels and plays best for me.

Brad
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1957Tim
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Joined: 30 Oct 2004
Posts: 192
Location: Hannibal Missouri

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

INTJ,

I first went wild in September 2009 due to Flip sending me a silver Bb WT trumpet for a five-day trial. When I opened the case, the bell pipe looked like a cannon barrel in comparison to my Olds Mendez trumpet. When I was able to A/B these two horns, my wife said she couldn’t believe the difference in the sound. She said the sound of the WT was almost as big as the grin on my face. She later said that if I didn’t call Flip and tell him that he could kiss this horn goodbye; she was going to make the call herself.

I had never played a Flugelhorn until the summer of 2015. While on vacation I was able to meet up with fellow TH member, Shofarguy, (Brian Douglas) and he fixed that. He let me play his relatively new WT copper belled Flugelhorn and Bb trumpet. I will never forget that day; it seemed like Brian’s Flugelhorn almost played itself. To make a long story short, I purchased Brian’s older WT Flugelhorn in silver plate the next summer when we met in Anaheim to take in a day of the ITG and tour the Kanstul factory. This Flugelhorn is not only a joy to play; it has been the source of many complements. Thanks again Brian!

During my California tour, Brian had arranged for us to spend some time with Flip Oakes in Oceanside. I had been dreaming of the day when I could try out Flip’s WT short cornet. To make a long story short, my new Bb lacquered WT copper belled short cornet arrived in August 2016. The sweet mellow voice of this instrument is music to my ears, no pun intended. It has become my favorite of the three, however, I can’t imagine life without the other two.

On a side note, while I was at Flip’s place he happened to have a nice used Flugelhorn in silver plate. I gave my trumpet teacher back in Missouri a call to let him know and he had me bring this horn home for him. He still says these (Mine & his) are the best in tune Flugelhorns he has ever played.

INTJ, are you using a Flip Oakes mouthpiece? After trying Flip’s mouthpieces, I bought two for my trumpet and two for my Flugelhorn. I was so pleased with the way they played that I purchased a trumpet piece for my teacher. He had used the same Bach mouthpiece for over thirty years; however, he made the switch to Flip’s piece and has never looked back.

If you want an extreme sound, Flip’s extreme mouthpieces will do just that. I have one for each of my WT horns, as well as his standard piece; its nice having options.

-1957Tim
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INTJ
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Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey guys, good to hear from you all!!

I recognize everyone’s handle except for Tsox, but he joined while I was away. It’s good to see more WT players. While the horn doesn’t work for everyone, almost everyone I have let play mine has loved it.

My handle is my Myers-Briggs personality type. Not sure how well it works for most folks, but for oddly developed types like mine and those like me who test very strongly in their type, it can be life-changing.

I think everyone’s Flip and WT stories are neat! I got to meet Flip a couple years ago when Titan Hot 7 came to Medford, OR. At the time I lived 90 miles away. Flip is a great player, a great person, and his band is hot.

My assessment of the various horn finishes match Flip’s. The lacquered is the broadest sound and the copper bell has the most core. The silver has the response of the laquer but the plating focuses the sound just enough to give it “wallop”, in Flip’s words. Concerning the slides, except for the #1 vs #2–which she says is minimal, my wife has a very hard time hearing the difference with the other slides. She says what she notices most is my ease of playing with the #1 slide over the others, which makes sense.

So does Tom Turner or Crazy Nate still post here?
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INTJ
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Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tim,

I am using Wedge MPs, through Flip’s standard flugelhorn MP in 10.5 works okay for me as well.
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1957Tim
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Joined: 30 Oct 2004
Posts: 192
Location: Hannibal Missouri

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

INTJ,

Wedge pieces are nice. I was using a Wedge piece when I visited Flip’s place. After trying his pieces I switched, however, I still have my Wedge piece as a back up.

Tom Turner was one of several who I communicated with before trying out Flip’s trumpet. Tom was posting a great deal here on TH back when I joined, however, he doesn’t post too often anymore. He’s a great writer, and always had interesting posts, but life has a way of changing our priorities from time to time.

Crazy Nate is still playing his WT, but told me he was given the boot over something he posted here on TH. I’m not sure what happened, but I do miss his interesting personality in the mix.

There were a number of other WT players who used to post here that I haven’t seen a post from in some time now. Maybe they are just so busy playing their Wild Thing horns that they don’t have time to post.

Since purchasing my first WT horn, I can truly say that my horn to face time has significantly increased.

Take care my friend, and may blessing be yours in the New Year.

-1957Tim
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chuck in ny
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Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 3597
Location: New York

PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

intj

thanks for posting this up. i have a silver trumpet and a silver flugel and have looked at the same horns in copper but haven't played them. the conclusion i came to, based on gut feeling only, was that it is very hard to beat 70/30 brass as far as having a wide range of expression. your experience is the same as my apprehension, having dead spots in the sound, or a muted effect. i play dark in general but a horn has to have bright and brilliance as part of its tone. there is probably some wine analogy. i wouldn't want to lose the unrestrained life that's in my brass bell WT that always reminds me of a herd of mustangs.
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shofarguy
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Joined: 18 Sep 2007
Posts: 7003
Location: AZ

PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don Herman rev2 wrote:
I own and play:
Silver WT Bb
Silver Flip Oakes C ("Nice Thing")
Gold WT Flugelhorn
Silver WT short cornet

I also purchased my Kanstul 1523 D/Eb from Flip and he performed his full enhancement process on it. He had to buy the tooling for the smaller bore, now that's service!

I use a Kanstul 1520 A/Bb/G pic; that is the only horn I actively play that did not come from Flip.

The horns are great, but the real magic is the relationship formed with Flip over the years. He is a very special guy.


Hey, Don,

One day I was at Flip's shop talking about his C trumpet. He was telling me how the symphony guys tried it, loved it, but asked Flip not to name it a "Wild Thing" saying it just wouldn't do to play a horn with that name in a real symphony. I suggested that he rename it the "Mauler."

We pert'near peed our pants laughing over that one!
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Brian A. Douglas

Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
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Don Herman rev2
'Chicago School' Forum Moderator


Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 8951
Location: Monument, CO

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yah, he had told me that about symphony players, but I never heard the "Mauler" part... Gustav would be proud. My solution was to call it my "Nice Thing C" or NTC and that actually gained traction for a while. Mine is one of the first three made, still playing great. I have not spoken with Flip for a while now, need to ping him one of these days. Last year was brutal and busy.
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trumpet.trader
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Joined: 02 Jul 2017
Posts: 200

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it takes a certain kind of player to be okay with a trumpet named “Wild Thing”

I’m sure most of you won’t care or say it’s a non issue. But for me it is an issue. A few years back I played a Callet trumpet that was just amazing. And I compared with similar horns and had guys listen to me A-B it against a bunch of other trumpets and the Callet mostly won every time.

But the name of the horn was “Super-Chops”

And at the end of the day, that was a deal breaker for me. I just couldn’t tell guys I’m playing a “Suler-Chops” trumpet with a straight face.

And I know it’s perhaps superficial of me, but that’s why I never gave a “Wild Thing” a fair shake when considering purchase.
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trumpet.trader
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Joined: 02 Jul 2017
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Around the time I was trying Callet trumpets he was making a horn called “Jazz” which for me was equally a turn off.

And a similar story which his C version. The legit guys were turned off by the name, so he stamped the horns “Symphonique” instead and added a pinky hook instead of a ring. I think he was making Bbs and Cs this way.

Not sure if that improved sales for him. But for some players the name is an issue.

I had an exact duplicate of my favorite mouthpiece copied and put in a traditional blank just because of the response from other players when they saw I liked an old Jet Tone. I got sneers and nasty comments about my playing, sound and using a cheater mouthpiece. Once Bob Reeves copied it and I showed up on jobs with a different looking blank, all the comments stopped. But the piece is virtually identical.
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chuck in ny
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Joined: 23 Sep 2006
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Location: New York

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i get a fair amount of limited production and one-off stuff from the many small artisan shops in this country. they put their work out and all but the deliberately small outfits will never produce very much. eclipse and taylor are staffed up somewhat better but most little guys understand the fragility of cash flow and keep everything contained and in front of them.
this fragility is not fully grasped by most with the smug assumption that they will always be able to trade cash for a WT. it isn't that way at all. flip very nearly did not get up off the gurney during his health crisis. his whole business is him, and proprietary.
i have been careful to get every single horn and mouthpiece from flip paying for goods whether it hurt then or not. guys like flip, and me, it's a matter of when the business stops and not if. there is no continuity to starvation businesses as the cash was never there to staff them up. the same goes for his instrument augmentation, a great service and weak seller both.
there are people with some resources who keep ordering swamp rat knives accumulating dozens. it's the correct approach when you find something inimitable and unrepeatable. not so much in the trumpet world. it's a cool instrument but you are very lucky if you can earn large with it.
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INTJ
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Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

chuck in ny wrote:
intj

thanks for posting this up. i have a silver trumpet and a silver flugel and have looked at the same horns in copper but haven't played them. the conclusion i came to, based on gut feeling only, was that it is very hard to beat 70/30 brass as far as having a wide range of expression. your experience is the same as my apprehension, having dead spots in the sound, or a muted effect. i play dark in general but a horn has to have bright and brilliance as part of its tone. there is probably some wine analogy. i wouldn't want to lose the unrestrained life that's in my brass bell WT that always reminds me of a herd of mustangs.


I think you hit on something for me. I too tend toward a dark sound. When I back off I can make my WT sound flugelish, and that is with an MP smaller than a 10.5D. Perhaps a heavier horn for those of us who tend to go dark is too much.

My WT bell also reminds me of a herd of Mustangs:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K9CoBMlOLi4
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INTJ
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chuck,

Spot on on your comments about small artisan shops and Flip. I worry a bit about how much longer he will keep wanting to offer horns, and I worry about how long Kanstul will survive. The market demand just isn’t that great for specialty trumpets and Kanstul is a small operation. I am seeing a similar thing with my other pursuit. Guys like me who like custom M-70 bolt actions are a vanishing breed and the market is vanishing as well.
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INTJ
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho

PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don Herman rev2 wrote:
Yah, he had told me that about symphony players, but I never heard the "Mauler" part... Gustav would be proud. My solution was to call it my "Nice Thing C" or NTC and that actually gained traction for a while. Mine is one of the first three made, still playing great. I have not spoken with Flip for a while now, need to ping him one of these days. Last year was brutal and busy.


Flip also explained how a symphony player—LA guy I think, tried one of his Cs and lived it. He wanted four right then and expected it would become the new standard in a C. Unfortunately neither Flip nor Kanstul could afford to start giving away horns.
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