Conn Cornet

malden · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:28 am Post subject: Conn Cornet

Can someone identify the model of this Conn 1931 cornet? It looks like an 80A but I am not sure. Thanks

Cheers

Dale Proctor · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:32 am Post subject:

Look on the bottom of the mouthpiece receiver - the model # may be stamped there. Otherwise, measure the bore size - the 80A will have a .484 bore, while similar-looking Conns will have a smaller bore.
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"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham

Sturmbill · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:02 am Post subject:

Do what Dale suggested. This might help as well:

https://cderksen.home.xs4all.nl/ConnLooksCornet.html
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Noli illegitimi carborundum... Joe Stilwell

malden · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:58 pm Post subject:

Thank you Dale and Sturmbill

It is an 80A. And since it is pre-50s make it will need a special short shank mouthpiece? A Conn 4 was provided.

My other options are Curry special order, Wick stock mps, and any vintage pieces I can find. What about the Yamaha or Stork short shank mps for cornet?

Cheers

bnsd · Veteran Member Joined: 17 Jun 2014 Posts: 126

What is your impression of the Conn 4? I bought a used cornet that came with the Conn 4 and found it to be TERRIBLE for a cornet sound. Totally trumpet like (with all the range associated), and really not pleasant because of it.

I've tried a couple other pieces, and they all sound and feel better. I finally landed on a Curry 3TC and I love it. Big sound (or soft when called for), consistent intonation, and "enough" range to handle everything except lead playing

Richard III · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:24 pm Post subject:

Ignore anything you've heard about needing special mouthpieces. Everything works in the magic 80A. Play what sounds best for the type of music you are playing.
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Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

Dale Proctor · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:38 pm Post subject:

If the Conn 4 exterior is smooth without a step in it, then it is an older Conn "short shank" piece. If it does have the step, then it's a newer one and has a modern cornet taper. The older 4 is actually a bit more shallow than the later 4. I don't like either one - they're too small and give the 80A a brighter sound. While a lot of modern cornet mouthpieces wobble a little in my 1954 80A, I've found the the Wick and Stork short shank cornet pieces don't. Of course, with horns this old, there can be significant receiver wear, which also affects the fit.
_________________
"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham

malden · Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:09 pm Post subject:

Dale,

It is the stepped modern Conn 4 and there was a modern cornet Bach 7C in the box as well. The receiver looks to be reamed out a bit from their use though this horn is a real closest queen, amazingly, its almost in new condition.

The Stock 5 rim is pretty good for me, probably to be paired with A or A+ cup. The Wick 5 would be a place to start but I have never tried one. Are the Yamaha short shanks out of the question?

Cheers

fabiopereirabr · Regular Member Joined: 21 Jul 2012 Posts: 58

Looks like a conn 38a Victor, a kind of small bore 80a

https://cderksen.home.xs4all.nl/Conn38A1936image.html
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Fabio

Dale Proctor · Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:02 am Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:20 am Post subject:

FWIW, I and use a Curry VC (Vintage Cornet Series) mouthpiece on it. I believe the shank defaults to short-shank. Check it out: http://www.currympc.com/index.php?id=49
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

Dieter Z · Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:25 am Post subject:

Most of my cornet mouthpieces fit my '47 Conn 80A well, that is: Wick, Yamaha, Sparx and ACB short shank. The only one that has a slight wobble is a ACB long shank cornet mouthpiece.
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B & H Sovereign 928
Conn 80A
F. Besson Brevette Kanstul made
B&S Challenger II 3137 rl
Buescher 400 - 225 (WWII)
Benge 90C
Eastman 540 D/Eb
ACB Fluegelhorn
Selmer Picc
ACB mouthpieces for most of my playing

Denny Schreffler · Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:40 pm Post subject:

You seem to have a grasp of the mpc vagaries of the old Conns.

Yes, most mpcs can “work.”

Yes, a lot of old Conn cornets have a receiver that has been abused with mpcs that are too large.

If the receiver is correct, the proper shank can improve some old Conns. I have the same Curry VC piece in the regular short shank and in the Conn short shank – the proper shank is notably better on a ‘41 36A and a ‘48 80A.

A surprising piece that came to me is a Stork 2CR-C. It has an extremely short shank with a taper so narrow that the mpc firmly inserts all the way up to the top of the shank (before it tapers in, before tapering out to form the exterior of the bowl) – right up to what I call the shoulder of the shank. I don’t know how much loss of contact there is between the receiver and the shank throughout its length, but it’s the mpc that I gig with on the 80A. I use LeFreqs on most of my mpcs.

I’ve gotten two (old, smooth-shank) Conn 4’s with old cornets. They seemed to be useless for me but I finally drilled out a throat (what Stork refers to as, the “bore”) a few steps (can’t remember how much and am too lazy to get up to check – probably to a #23). The tone is still not what I normally would want but now it feels OK to play.

It could be the perspective/distortion of your photo, but it appears that the valve buttons are mismatched. If so, you’re likely to have significant valve alignment problems.

There are differing opinions on the best utilization of the Opera Glass. I’ve settled on opening it just a crack and using the main slide for all tuning.

-Denny

Dale Proctor · Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:19 am Post subject:

Yes, the two Stork short-shank cornet mouthpieces I own insert into most of my cornets all the way to the widest part of the shank. They do seem to seat well in my old 80A. I too like my 80A with the opera glass opened about 1/8" and the rest of the tuning pull on the large tuning slide.
_________________
"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham

malden · Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:36 pm Post subject:

malden · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:18 pm Post subject:

I decided to do the valve job on this horn. In 3-5 weeks will have it back. Fingers crossed. It was in too nice condition to leave with sickly valves.

Cheers

Dale Proctor · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:26 pm Post subject:

Quite a commitment - hope you like it when it's done.
_________________
"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham

malden · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:14 pm Post subject:

Denny Schreffler · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:25 pm Post subject:

malden · Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:53 am Post subject: