What kind of horn is best for a comeback player?

BReid

Hello, everyone. I'm a newcomer to trumpetherald and would greatly appreciate some advice. I am a 56 year old comeback player after 25 years away from the horn. I played from 6th grade through college, and then played in church orchestras for a few years after that. When opportunitites to play in ensembles dried up, unfortunately, so did my trumpet playing.

Back in the day, I played a Bach Strad 37, but I sold it several years ago. I recently bought a Bach Strad knock-off made in China. I paid around $500 for it brand new. As you might imagine, I haven't been particularly happy with the way it sounds. The intonation is decent, but the slotting seems squirrly (on 3 different mouthpieces). At first, I thought it was just me, given that I hadn't played in 25 years.

Well, I recently stopped by a music store in a city I was visiting and played some Yamaha Xeno models, and wow...totally different experience! Rock solid intonation and slotting all the way to high C. Those horns were a joy to play and sounded great. I was smitten! The problem is, I'm not in a place right now where I can knock down $2-3K for a pro model horn.

My goal is to work hard on Clarke, Arban, etc., to the point that I can once again play well enough to play in church and parhaps join some kind of local music group. I'm looking to take lessons along the way as well.

There seems to be two schools of thought when it comes to players in my position:

1. You are not a pro player, so you don't need a pro horn. Right now you don't have the chops to make a pro horn do what it was inteded to do, anyway. Just buy a decent used, American-made, namebrand student or intermediate model. You can buy a pro horn later when your playing has improved.

2. Even though you are not a pro player, buy a pro horn anyway. A pro horn will sound better, play easier, and be more fun. This will motivate you to practice more. You'll get better, faster. And that pro horn will last you the rest of your life.

I can see some wisdom in both of these options...

I've been looking on ebay, but the Olds Ambassadors, Conn Victors, and King Tempos are mostly old "beaters" that some high school kid has kicked down a flight of bleachers at the football game on Friday night...no thanks. The Benge, Bach, Getzen, Schilke and high-end Yammies are out of my price range. And not being able to "try before you buy" is an added challenge.

Anyway, sorry for the long post... Your thoughts? Is there another option I haven't thought of besides suffering through the Chinese horn while I'm working to get better? Thanks so much for your input. Blessings, everyone!
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BReid

lakejw · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:50 pm Post subject:

Speaking as a professional and someone that has bought a lot of trumpets, my advice would be to 1) don't chase good money after bad, and not waste more money on a horn that doesn't excite you. This would include more 'knockoffs' or student model horns.

And, 2) be patient and find a decent used professional horn here on Trumpet Herald or eBay. A good-condition Bach, Yamaha, XO, Selmer, King, etc. can be had for $800-1500. Since you already have a cheap horn, I would recommend holding out for a professional model. You don't need to spend $3K to get a good horn.
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chef8489 · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:58 pm Post subject:

Wish you had not wasted the 500.00 on a crappy Chinese knockoff of a Bach strad. For 500.00 you could have had a decent horn to get you by till you saved up enough for a real Bach strad or another pro level horn. Now you should save up and buy a used pro horn in great condition as they can be had in the 1500 to 2k range easy. If you have a store nearby where you can play many models you can get an idea of what you are looking for, but that would only be a guide as each horn is different. When it is time to buy make sure it is from a reliable source where you can return it if something is wrong.

Croquethed · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:08 pm Post subject:

Do a little research and hit Craigslist. In the past 6 months I saw an Olds Recording in very good shape for $750, a Conn 2B for $500, and right now somebody's selling a lightly used Getzen Capri for $275...that one has my trigger finger itchy.

Strads and Yammies will always command Strad and Yammie prices. I don't know if you'll ever find a "deal" on them.

I got my horn, a Getzen Eterna 900, brand new and thanks to timing, was able to combine two coupons that saved me about $500 off the "discount" price.

Stay patient and do your homework, you'll get a decent horn at a decent price.

dstdenis · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:45 pm Post subject:

I'd recommend two alternative approaches. Pick the one you like:

Plan A. Dump the knock-off and get a used student trumpet, maybe a Yamaha 2335 or Getzen 300. Play it for awhile. Set a goal for yourself: "When I can [insert goal here], I will reward myself with a pro trumpet." Goals might include playing for a year or two, or playing through a method book, or taking lessons for a period of time, or playing in a community band for a period of time. Whatever grabs you.

Once you reach your goal, reward yourself with a pro trumpet. Lots to choose from, but I'd recommend one of these:

Yamaha Xeno II
XO Brass 1602s
Bach 37

Plan B. Dump the knock-off and get a pro horn now.
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Bb Yamaha Xeno 8335IIS
Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
Flugelhorn Courtois 155R
Piccolo Stomvi

cheiden · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:53 pm Post subject:

Since you liked the Xenos so much I'd recommend your keeping an eye out for a used 6000-series Yamaha horn. These were top of the line pro horns in their time. Ocassionally they can be had for reasonable money. I personally don't hate the intermediate 4000-series. And even the beginner's 2000-series don't suck. All are solidly built, and reliable players.
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"I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart

HaveTrumpetWillTravel · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 4:49 pm Post subject:

Agree with others to have a "wish list" of horns that you'd love (another bach, the yamaha) but also look into buying opportunistically, basically any used pro horn that plays well. Where I am I looked into some of the second hand yamahas and jupiters, but founds two Carols, each selling at about half off used. I really like them. I'd try craigslist. There's a stable of good names you see over and over again: Conn, King, Benge, Bach, Yamaha, Jupiter...

matthes93401 · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 640

The major brands have intermediate or budget pro Bb trumpets. I know the new Jupiter intermediate is highly regarded. A CarolBrass with reverse leadpipe, like Teeter's trumpet would qualify as easy to play ( Doug Teeter is the US Distributor in the US). The Brasspire trumpets available at Austin Custom Brass play well.

Dennis78 · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:58 pm Post subject:

+1 for the Brasspire brand!
Very happy with mine
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a few different ones

BReid · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:28 pm Post subject:

Thanks so much, everyone, for your input. It's really helpful!
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BReid

cbtj51 · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:29 pm Post subject:

As a 3 1/2 year Comeback Player after a 14 year layoff, I can certainly relate to your dilemma. I got a call from a Music Intern in my Church a couple of weeks after I retired form my day gig with a rather insistent request to consider playing with a newly formed Brass Ensemble at Church. I was fortunate in that I still had my old Benge and my Getzen Flugelhorn in storage (more on that in a moment). I really never planned on playing again and had "loaned" my then pristine, more versatile Yamaha 6335 to a very close pro friend 14 years earlier with the understanding that it was still my horn and that if anything changed, I might ask for it back. He agreed and really neither one of us thought that my plan to not play again would ever change. Back to the Benge. It was and is a very nice horn in most every way and recomissioning was not very difficult. Same with my Flugel. What was different was my playing opportunities. I played mostly Big Band and Latin before with some R&B shows as well and a lot of Top 40 Bands for at least the last 10 years that I played. Living in a different city now with no Trumpet connections I played in my Church Brass Ensemble on a very bright set up with my Benge and a relatively shallow Reeves 41S695 mouthpiece. As I tried to fit in, I met a professional Symphony Musician who encouraged me to play in other situations including a regularly occurring alternate 3rd Trumpet position in the local Chamber Orchestra. I made the changes that I could to bring my sound into line with the new requirements including a deeper mouthpiece and getting my somewhat more versatile Yamaha back. I worked on my playing and especially, expanding my playing style into a "legitimate" approach that I had never even thought about in my old trumpet life, saving my money until I could afford a much needed C Trumpet and later, a more versatile new Bb Trumpet. I acquired a great, older Bach C from my new Symphony Musician friend about a year into my comeback and bought a new Bach Strad about a year and a half ago and am playing in many situations regularly with much joy and expanding my sound and style continuously.

I am so glad that I took my time working toward determining and filling my current needs as well as evolving my sound and getting my Trumpet playing desires in focus. I plan to play as long as I physically can, and am enjoying it immensely!

Best Wishes,

Mike
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'71 LA Benge 5X Bb
'72 LA Benge D/Eb
'76 Bach CL 229/25A C
â€˜92 Bach 37 Bb
'98 Getzen 895S Flugelhorn
'00 Bach 184 Cornet
'02 Yamaha 8335RGS
'16 Bach NY 7
'16 XO 1700RS Piccolo
Reeves 41 Rimmed Mouthpieces

HaveTrumpetWillTravel · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:59 pm Post subject:

One fun thing about coming back to trumpet is there is a lot more fun equipment now! Wedge mouthpieces and plastic mouthpieces, pocket trumpets that sound great, brands that have taken it up a notch, new brands, practice aids, and on and on.

My Carol 506 has the silver leadpipe and is a reverse leadpipe and I really like it. I may eventually move back to a Bach or onto a higher level Yamaha or Jupiter, but it's nice to have options.

Ed Kennedy · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187

ltkije1966 · Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:16 am Post subject:

There are some great used horns out there at a reasonable price. The way I see it, if you don't like it, then you can turn around and sell it for what you paid.

These are a few you might look at...

https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104230
https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104191&s=For-Sale-Callet-New-York-Trumpet
https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104179
https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104068
https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104029
https://www.trumpetherald.com/marketplace.php?task=detail&id=104005
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Scott Kuehn

Brad361 · Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:46 pm Post subject:

Lots of good suggestions here, I would just add that IMO, “intermediate”
horns are usually just student models with cosmetic upgrades.

If you keep an eye out (the marketplace here is a good place), you can find a pro horn like a Getzen Severinsen, Benge (I would probably avoid most of the approximately 1983 and up UMI horns), Yamaha Xeno, Bach Strad (maybe 37 or 43 models), older Conn, King and Olds...the list goes on. Do you absolutely NEED a pro level horn right now? Probably not, but it might give you that extra motivation to continue your comeback, and it might depend on how poorly your Bach knockoff plays, if it does play poorly.

Brad
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When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval

gpena73 · New Member Joined: 08 Mar 2016 Posts: 7

Just like a single malt, Buy the the nicest horn you can afford. Have a blast coming back!