| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Rapier232
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Aug 2011
Posts: 1322
Location: Twixt the Moor and the Sea, UK
|
 Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:59 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| VetPsychWars wrote: | | Seymor B Fudd wrote: | | VetPsychWars wrote: | Ah, I wish I had a Buescher 265 to send over there for you to guys to pass around.....
Tom |
If I ever showed up with a "long cornet" like that .....they wouldn´t treat me well. In fact I once did, my Getzen 300 series and was I frowned upon? Yes.
Although I really went about it with great care and cornetty attitude. Still too bright. And not "stylish"  |
Well, I could send a Buescher 400, that’s a proper short cornet.
Tom |
You could, but no one would want to play it. There are plenty of good cornets available here already. Neo’s, Xeno’s, Prestige, Smith-Watkins, Eclipse. etc.etc.
_________________
"Nearly as good as I need to be. Not nearly as good as I want to be".
Smith-Watkins Bb
Will Spencer Bb
Eclipse Flugel
Smith Watkins K2 Cornet
JP152 C Trumpet
Besson Bugle |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
TKSop
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Feb 2014
Posts: 1735
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 1:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Rapier232 wrote: | | VetPsychWars wrote: | | Seymor B Fudd wrote: | | VetPsychWars wrote: | Ah, I wish I had a Buescher 265 to send over there for you to guys to pass around.....
Tom |
If I ever showed up with a "long cornet" like that .....they wouldn´t treat me well. In fact I once did, my Getzen 300 series and was I frowned upon? Yes.
Although I really went about it with great care and cornetty attitude. Still too bright. And not "stylish" |
Well, I could send a Buescher 400, that’s a proper short cornet.
Tom |
You could, but no one would want to play it. There are plenty of good cornets available here already. Neo’s, Xeno’s, Prestige, Smith-Watkins, Eclipse. etc.etc. |
Well yea, basically...
If you take something out of the norm into the bandroom then you'll get questions and funny looks.
If you're a great player and/or it sounds right anyway, then it's okay...
But even if you don't blame your deficiencies on your equipment, rightly or wrongly someone else is bound to do it for you if you're using something particularly unusual.
We can argue amongst ourselves as to whether that's justified or not, but it's very much the case.
It's not that everyone is expected to use the same brand/model in a section (atleast not in the vast majority of bands, serious or otherwise) but there's definitely an unspoken rule of what's considered proper and what isn't. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
VetPsychWars
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 7196
Location: Greenfield WI
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| TKSop wrote: | | It's not that everyone is expected to use the same brand/model in a section (at least not in the vast majority of bands, serious or otherwise) but there's definitely an unspoken rule of what's considered proper and what isn't. |
That sure as heck doesn't sound like fun. I mean, seriously not fun. Even knowing full well the stamp on the bell or mouthpiece doesn't matter all that much, you'd still get crap for it?
Wow.
Tom
_________________
1950 Buescher Lightweight 400 Trumpet
1949 Buescher 400 Trumpet
1939 Buescher 400 Cornet
GR65M, GR65 Cor #1 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TKSop
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Feb 2014
Posts: 1735
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 2:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| VetPsychWars wrote: | | TKSop wrote: | | It's not that everyone is expected to use the same brand/model in a section (at least not in the vast majority of bands, serious or otherwise) but there's definitely an unspoken rule of what's considered proper and what isn't. |
That sure as heck doesn't sound like fun. I mean, seriously not fun. Even knowing full well the stamp on the bell or mouthpiece doesn't matter all that much, you'd still get crap for it?
Wow.
Tom |
Not really - the fun is in turning up and playing good music, well, with likeminded people... The fun isn't diminished in the slightest by the inability (in effect, even if not a spoken rule) to turn up with something really out there.
Currently rehearsing for a contest (Grand Shield) and I'm the only one on the front row not using a Yamaha - not that there's a rule that says you have to, it's just what people happen to have.... there's probably a dozen or so you could choose from without raising any eyebrows.
(I'm the odd one out in the cornet section using my Eclipse - the rest are all on either Yamaha or Besson) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 2:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
| TKSop wrote: | | VetPsychWars wrote: | | TKSop wrote: | | It's not that everyone is expected to use the same brand/model in a section (at least not in the vast majority of bands, serious or otherwise) but there's definitely an unspoken rule of what's considered proper and what isn't. |
That sure as heck doesn't sound like fun. I mean, seriously not fun. Even knowing full well the stamp on the bell or mouthpiece doesn't matter all that much, you'd still get crap for it?
Wow.
Tom |
Not really - the fun is in turning up and playing good music, well, with likeminded people... The fun isn't diminished in the slightest by the inability (in effect, even if not a spoken rule) to turn up with something really out there.
Currently rehearsing for a contest (Grand Shield) and I'm the only one on the front row not using a Yamaha - not that there's a rule that says you have to, it's just what people happen to have.... there's probably a dozen or so you could choose from without raising any eyebrows.
(I'm the odd one out in the cornet section using my Eclipse - the rest are all on either Yamaha or Besson) |
Made me think about the alleged difference between brass bands on the Island and us isolated in the rest of the world. The Yamahas I´ve tested as well as the Bessons all sound somewhat thin, bright and a bit "compressed," in comparative terms, to the Getzens, Bachs etc. (=meaning "heavier"). Please do not misunderstand me - basically I´m still fond of the traditional bright delicate cornet sound so often heard on old recordings, Fodens, Munn&Felton, Fairy Aviation, you name them, also remembering those rare occasions when we had the honour to be conducted by Harry Mortimer, Eric Ball, Geoff Brand. Early one Saturday morning, sun shining through the big windows, us trying to play the Resurgam, this dramatic masterpiece, Mr Ball holding the stick...sigh! I will always remember Brand´s comment after an intricate run "good try!".... As far as I recall performed on a Getzen Eterna. But now I lost myself in memories. Sorry. But playing in a brass band is an emotional experience. Hence sometimes fueling somewhat biased opinions.
I recently bought a cheap Yamaha 2330 to use as a spare horn but brought it to some rehearsals - my ordinary horn on service. It was a pleasant experience, reminding me of old days, but the horn felt tiny in comparison. Not bad at all, I could go on using it, very delicate to play, but the 3850 fits better - in our band. A whole lot of heavy trombones not to mention dito euphoniums and barytones.
So perhaps there is this difference in the tonal spectrum between you sons and daughters of Albion and the rest of the world?? More so because of differences in equipment than search for a special, not necessarily better, sound?
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Schilke 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
chi2lon
Regular Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2018
Posts: 14
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
It has been a few months since I started on my safari, and I thought I'd give a quick update. I took my time and made sure I could bring a few different trusted sets of ears while trying the horns through out the process. I always ended up coming back to the Stomvi with copper bell. I found it to be the easiest to play top to bottom by some margin, and it was the favourite in front of the bell for sound. I was still a bit concerned bringing it to rehearsal the first time, but I have gotten a lot of positive feedback following the switch. I guess the moral of the story is trust your ears and don't worry about the stamp on the bell.
_________________
Parke 640-285-24
Bb - Bach 37 MTV-MV
C - Bach 229 MV7
Toshi 16EWS
Bb - Schagerl Hans Gansch
Laskey 75MC
Eb/D - Yamaha 9610
Laskey PIC
Picc - Stomvi Elite
Monette B2 FL R6/FLG2
Cornet - Stomvi Titan
Flugel - Adams F2
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden
|
| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2019 6:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
| chi2lon wrote: | | It has been a few months since I started on my safari, and I thought I'd give a quick update. I took my time and made sure I could bring a few different trusted sets of ears while trying the horns through out the process. I always ended up coming back to the Stomvi with copper bell. I found it to be the easiest to play top to bottom by some margin, and it was the favourite in front of the bell for sound. I was still a bit concerned bringing it to rehearsal the first time, but I have gotten a lot of positive feedback following the switch. I guess the moral of the story is trust your ears and don't worry about the stamp on the bell. |
The Model #5856 Cooper?? Sure looks nice! Also nice of you to return telling the end of the story! And I agree about trusting ears - but - there are differences amongst horn, whatever ears listening to them.
Some more radiant, more core others less, some brighter, some "darker" - sometimes you might lessen the differences by using this or that mouthpiece.
But - stay happy with your choice! And good luck!
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Schilke 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637
|
| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2019 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: Picking a Cornet |
|
|
| Louise Finch wrote: | | .........I feel that the articulations of my Bach 184ML are more strident, making it sound more trumpet-like........
|
+1
| Louise Finch wrote: | | .........I have heard that the Bach 184L .......with the gold brass bell, is more brass band cornet-like.......
|
+1
| Louise Finch wrote: | | .......... the Smith-Watkins K2 blends fine ........
|
+1
I have the Bach 184 ML with gold copper bell as well as the Smith Watkins K2 (this horn is made by Kanstul).
For me the S-W K2 has the BBB sound that I have been looking for.
It is the BBB sound that I "hear in my head".
If I were in the OP situation, I would test-play the Yamaha Neo and the K2.
I also do recommend that the OP indeed sends a PM to Louise so she can give you her experience with the S-W K2.
Hope this helps.
Good luck with your selection search.
Cheers,
Harry |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
delano
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Discussions have more value when the posters read the other posts. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Louise Finch
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5464
Location: Suffolk, England
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 3:48 am Post subject: Re: Picking a Cornet |
|
|
| Harry Hilgers wrote: | | Louise Finch wrote: | | .........I feel that the articulations of my Bach 184ML are more strident, making it sound more trumpet-like........
|
+1
| Louise Finch wrote: | | .........I have heard that the Bach 184L .......with the gold brass bell, is more brass band cornet-like.......
|
+1
| Louise Finch wrote: | | .......... the Smith-Watkins K2 blends fine ........
|
+1
I have the Bach 184 ML with gold copper bell as well as the Smith Watkins K2 (this horn is made by Kanstul).
For me the S-W K2 has the BBB sound that I have been looking for.
It is the BBB sound that I "hear in my head".
If I were in the OP situation, I would test-play the Yamaha Neo and the K2.
I also do recommend that the OP indeed sends a PM to Louise so she can give you her experience with the S-W K2.
Hi Harry
Thanks very much for your confidence in me and my first-hand experiences, which is really appreciated, but there are two reasons why this wouldn't be a good idea. Firstly, the OP has updated the thread to say that he has bought a Stomvi, and secondly that I haven't played the S-W K2 for a number of years, so am not sure whether my recollections are reliable. Irrelevant to this thread, but if anyone wanted to hear my experience of my Yamaha Xeno, they would be most welcome bearing in mind that I am only an amateur player, as this is the cornet which I have played day in day out for the last four years, and really feel that I know.
Take care
Lou
Hope this helps.
Good luck with your selection search.
Cheers,
Harry |
 
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| chi2lon wrote: | | ..........I tried a bunch of horns............ Besson Prestige/Yamaha Neo/Smith-Watkins K2/Eclipse Yellow/Stomvi Titan........ Does anyone have experience with how these horns blend in a section ......... playing them yourself or with someone who plays them ........ |
I responded to the OP because I do have experience playing the Smith-Watkins K2 by myself and in a BBB setting.
| Louise Finch wrote: | | ..... the OP has updated the thread to say that he has bought a Stomvi........... |
I did not see that as a reason to not give the OP the benefit of my Smith-Watkins K2 experience.
| Harry Hilgers wrote: | | .... recommend .... a PM to Louise so she can give you her experience with the S-W K2. |
I was referring to the "mechanical issues" you encountered with the K2 
delano (with his non-constructive reply) and others are more than welcome to ignore my info given to the OP
Cheers,
Harry |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
delano
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| You can be right, maybe reading posts before 'answering' them is not a good idea for everybody. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Louise Finch
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5464
Location: Suffolk, England
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 4:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
h | Harry Hilgers wrote: | | .... recommend .... a PM to Louise so she can give you her experience with the S-W K2. |
I was referring to the "mechanical issues" you encountered with the K2
Hi Harry
No worries, I didn't realise that you were referring to this. I stupidly perservered for two years trying to get I believe the middle valve to bed in, with little playing time on this cornet overall, as it was sticking too much to take it to any rehearsals. When I did return it to the retailer, which I should have done earlier, it was found to have a score in the valve casing, presumably an isolated incidence and not an issue with the K-2 in general. I had the choice of a replacement, refund or choosing something else. Again stupidly, I chose a 928 Sovereign. I say stupidly, because I had already sold one 928 and one 927 Sovereign because they were not for me. My defence is that I was heavily pregnant with my youngest at the time, and exhausted by the train journey, underground and walk from the underground, and wanted to get it sorted in one go. After I had my little one, I decided to go with the Yamaha Xeno which I had really liked when I chose the K-2, but felt that it didn't have such a good sound as the Besson Prestige. I didn't like the playability of the Besson Prestige, and felt that the K-2 was a good compromise between the sound of the Besson Prestige and playability of the Xeno. I bought a used Yamaha Xeno on 2 weeks approval, and have been completely happy with my choice.
All the best
Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 8:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Louise Finch wrote: | | ........ I was heavily pregnant with my youngest at the time ....... after I had my little one ....... |
+1
1. Well, was it a boy or a girl?
2. Best start saving for a music instrument for him/her.
3. My oldest grandson is six and has been on violin for about a year
and just started piano. He told me for his next birthday he wants a
Stradivarius and for the birthday after that he wants a Steinway
Grand Model D Concert piano.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Louise Finch
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5464
Location: Suffolk, England
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Harry Hilgers wrote: | | Louise Finch wrote: | | ........ I was heavily pregnant with my youngest at the time ....... after I had my little one ....... |
+1
Hi Harry
1. Well, was it a boy or a girl?
A girl, Abbey, born on 05.05.13, so she'll be six in May. Time does fly.
2. Best start saving for a music instrument for him/her.
I'm disappointed that the local schools don't seem to offer recorder anymore. I started recorder in the same year as Abbey is in now, and it started me off in music for life. They have a teacher in to teach cornet, but from aged 9, and there is nothing for the younger children.
3. My oldest grandson is six and has been on violin for about a year
and just started piano. He told me for his next birthday he wants a
Stradivarius and for the birthday after that he wants a Steinway
Grand Model D Concert piano.
He has very good and expensive lol taste, but I'm really pleased to hear that he has started off playing so young.
Best wishes
Lou
|
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Louise Finch wrote: | | Harry Hilgers wrote: | | Louise Finch wrote: | | ........ I was heavily pregnant with my youngest at the time ....... after I had my little one ....... |
+1
Hi Harry
1. Well, was it a boy or a girl?
A girl, Abbey, born on 05.05.13, so she'll be six in May. Time does fly.
2. Best start saving for a music instrument for him/her.
I'm disappointed that the local schools don't seem to offer recorder anymore. I started recorder in the same year as Abbey is in now, and it started me off in music for life. They have a teacher in to teach cornet, but from aged 9, and there is nothing for the younger children.
3. My oldest grandson is six and has been on violin for about a year
and just started piano. He told me for his next birthday he wants a
Stradivarius and for the birthday after that he wants a Steinway
Grand Model D Concert piano.
He has very good and expensive lol taste, but I'm really pleased to hear that he has started off playing so young.
Best wishes
Lou
|
|
+1 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
auswa84
New Member
Joined: 21 Feb 2019
Posts: 7
Location: Kansas City, MO
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Besson and B&S have both been great for me |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
