GR Wayne Bergeron mpc. review

Schilkeshaker · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 2:51 pm Post subject: GR Wayne Bergeron mpc. review

...just can't wait to read the first one!

Trptbenge · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 5:20 pm Post subject:

I received the Wayne Bergeron signature Studio and classic mouthpieces today. I was surprised on how quickly I received them. Kudos to Wayne and Barb for getting them out so quickly.

Coming from a larger mouthpiece I gravitated at first to the Classic. It has a great cup volume and chop room. I can see using this mouthpiece in classical situations and at church. Surprisingly, I do not lose any range on the classic. I switched to the Studio and the more I played it the more my chops got used to it. I have a huge sound with the mouthpiece. According to the overlays it is similar in some respects to a Schilke 13A4a but very different in others. The differences make this an amazing mouthpiece. The rim on it, like th Classic, is incredibly comfortable. My sound has a great core and life to it. Finally, unlike the Schilke the Studio gives me a very resonant lower register. I really love this mouthpiece. In fact, I love both of the mouthpieces. I need to add that both mouthpieces feel larger than they actually are due to the location of the high point on the rim.

I really was excited about the mouthpieces and worried that my high level of anticipation would set me up for disappointment. However, this was not the case. The mouthpieces exceeded my expectations. I played a variety of things - including flow studies and the mouthpieces performed very well.

I know that these mouthpieces are a significant investment of money but they are worth it.

I look forward to playing them tomorrow at jazzband rehearsal.

Mike
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It's the sound that makes the difference!

Schilkeshaker · Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:34 pm Post subject:

Thanks Mike!

dgest · New Member Joined: 10 Nov 2008 Posts: 3

TrumpetBenge - can you tell me what mouthpiece you are currently playing so I can use that to relate to your review of the Bergerons? Thanks
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DG

drcarl · New Member Joined: 20 Mar 2012 Posts: 5 Location: Jasper

Is Mr Bergeron playing these pieces now?

What about the Parke Bergeron model mouthpieces?

Schilkeshaker · Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:32 pm Post subject:

Yes, he plays the GR's now:

http://waynebergeron.com/store_mouthpieces.html

Trptbenge · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:32 am Post subject:

DG,

Before the Bergeron I was playing three different mouthpieces - depending on the horn and the situation. These included a Reeves 42S, a Warburton 4M and a Schilke 13A4a.

I will try and update my review as I play them more. I used them at jazzband rehearsal last night and they worked well. I am still acclimating to them and found myself still gravitating to the classic. Though, the more I play the Studio the more I like it. I have only had them a couple days and I will spend more time over the next week.

Thanks!

MIke
_________________
It's the sound that makes the difference!

Schilkeshaker · Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:34 pm Post subject:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEq8ONpIQ2s

Souperman · Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:03 pm Post subject:

What are the throat sizes of these new mouthpieces? Just curious, thanks!

Vin DiBona · Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 12:31 pm Post subject:

Here is some info directly from GR himself regarding the new Wayne Bergeron mouthpieces.

"The GR Bergeron Mpcs: These took over two years to develop. There are things we did on the Studio that are not present in any other mouthpiece. The final version was a change of only .0014" per side or .0028" in a small particular area of the mpc. It lights up like fire. Wayne thought the version before the final was great. Well, it got better and after playing all day Wayne on fire.

We did a long and hard day of testing and then Wayne needed to gig test it. The next day, I made a complete set of the final prototypes, flew to Charlie Melk's to get them Silver plated and just got to Wayne's clinic with the new mpcs. Wayne used all of them in the clinic with out hesitation. He did every thing from his usual to some very exposed legit work, Chet Baker fluff, he hit it all. After the clinic he had a group of trumpet guys and students around him so he did some further testing. I'll tell you this, there was not a dry diaper in the room and that includes Wayne. He amazed himself said he could do stuff he never did before. Don't believe me, ask Wayne. The next day he played the Wisconsin State Music Convention with great results.

Are these Mpcs for everyone "No". Do they work for some, yes with great results. Even I am surprised at the number of people that are getting great results, Andy Greenwood is one. Check out Louis Dowdeswell, a young man playing Wayne's horn in Prozone Music with the Bergeron Studio Mpc." Louis Dowdeswell - O Holy Night - with Wayne Bergeron looking on! - YouTube

These are my own closing words.

At their $230 introductory prices, every one was sold in a few days. GR made 3 times more that Wayne thought would be needed. More are being made and there may even be a waiting list. Will the price go up? Most likely, yes, it will.
For those of you specs fanatics (not meant in a nasty way), I've asked GR for the throat sizes, but please keep in mind the throat size is just one factor in a mouthpiece's design. GR has 27 throats that will make you think you are attached to a vacuum cleaner's business end and some 24 throats that may not seem any bigger than a "normal" 27.

Here is Wayne's website. http://www.waynebergeron.com/home.html

Regards,
Rich T.
Chicagoland GR Dealer

Vin DiBona · Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:00 pm Post subject:

Here is some more information on the Bergeron throats directly from GR.

When I checked all the mpcs Wayne had they were all over place. Some at 28 all the way to a 24, I use the decimal numbers etc. The number like 25 is not accurate. I use the decimal so 27 = .144, a .146 is not a 27, it's a .146.

This hole is not the key, you need to know the diameter and length. Bergeron Studio and Classic would be called a 27 but I have a more accurate way to verify. The Studio is a longer throat, oh, don't forget the backbores are different. You have 21 parameters in a mouthpiece and each one is important. Not just the throat bore, how big, how long, what's before, and what's after it?

I don't like these measurements as they are too open for accurate manufacturing. 29 to 30, that's .0075 or a mile, we try to hold +/- .0001 before plating and polishing.

24=.152
25=.1495
26=.147
27=.144
28=.1405
29=.136
30=.1285

If you use gauge pins and go-no go you will have very open tolerances. Lets take a 27 hole. You put in a .144 (#27) pin and it goes, then try a .147 (#26) and it doesn't so you have a 27 hole, right? Well you might an issues, so try a .145, .146, both pins go. Is it still a 27 hole. No, in my
book , it's a .146 hole. How do you document/define a sloppy or loose 27 hole?

For a very detailed diagram of what GR is talking about parameter wise, go here.
http://www.grmouthpieces.com/aboutwindow.htm

R. Tomasek

jiarby · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Jul 2011 Posts: 1188

ironically, that diagram does not include throat diameter, throat length, or backbore taper/length... just cup & rim parameters

Vin DiBona · Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:59 pm Post subject:

Here is a diagram of the throat bore.
http://www.grmouthpieces.com/termsbore.htm
You can see (and read) why GR states the length of the throat must be taken into consideration.

R. Tomasek

Trptbenge · Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:53 pm Post subject:

Since I met GR back in 2003 at the University of Central Florida (incidentally Wayne and Malcolm McNab were the featured artists) I have tried, and owned, a lot of GR mouthpieces. Normally, I have perfromed the best on 65M or 66M mouthpieces - though I have found the 66M to be a little larger than I needed.

When Waynes moutpieces came out I wanted to try them for a couple of reasons. First, I had been playing a Schilke 13A4a for Jazz band with success. I thought the Studio might be an improvement on the Schilke (it is) and secondly, I am a huge fan of Waynes.

After I ordered them I really did have second thoughts about them maybe being too small. Of course, all of it was the mind games we all play - and since I hadn't received them yet I was just wasting my time worrying. When I first got them I felt the most comfortable on the classic. However, a week later I feel slightly more comfortable on the Studio but love both mouthpieces. They feel larger than they are due to the high point on the rim. I am getting a great sound on both mouthpieces and my range is very solid on the classic as well as the studio. In the past I have confused my embouchure by switching to other mouthpieces to do a comparison. However, this time I have played only the two Bergeron models. This has helped me adapt to the mouthpieces.

So, a week or so out and I am loving these mouthpieces more and more. They speak quickly and easily on the horn and I have a good, solid sound throughout my range. The rim is, without a doubt, the most comfortable rim I have played on.

They are not for everyone but they are definitely fit me to a tee.

Mike
_________________
It's the sound that makes the difference!

FDC05 · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:52 pm Post subject:

I have had my WB Studio for a few days now. I'm still up in the air on whether or not I can use it in the "real world." I can't wait for my next gig to give it a shot.

I have been on a 13A4 or years. I have tried others, but always made it back "home." But, I was never happy with the sound and control in the staff. That's why I got this mouthpiece. I was hoping for a better sound in the staff, while maintaining (or improving) my sound above the staff.

This mouthpiece DEFINITELY gives me a better sound all around the horn than my 13A4. However, it is taking my quite a while to get used to the rim. It's much wider, flatter, and has a much softer inner bite than the Schilke. It just feels "strange" to me. It definitely feels bigger than it is, which is hard to figure out, to be honest.

When things are working (solid breathe, relaxed, etc). I love this mouthpiece. The trick is to get more consistent with that! I guess I've been muscling for so long, I don't know how to relax as well.

I'll post again after some more time with it. I am considering the "Classic", thinking it may be easier on the face to have the same rim. We'll see...
_________________
Mark

Redhothorn · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Dec 2001 Posts: 1173

Interested in MORE thoughts on this mouthpiece. I currently play a Marcinkiewicz Shew #1. Played a Schilke 13A4 years ago. PLEASE keep up the reviews.

jiarby · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Jul 2011 Posts: 1188

Mine is on the way...
I have been playing the same 13A4A since 1981, so I am a little nervous about the reports of the big rim, or softer bite.

Although, sometimes the Schilke bites too much!

We'll see!

HowardB993 · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 7:23 pm Post subject:

I picked up the Studio model a week ago last Thursday, and REALLY like how it sounds, feels, and plays.
I started playing GR pieces late last year - picked up a used e65S in the marketplace. I made great strides with that piece that it lead me to get a matching flugel piece, cornet, and then started looking at different cups for different playing styles/occasions (all in the e65 rim).
In February I picked up a used Carl Fischer Jazz in the marketplace and have been using that for Big Band and Jazz applications, and have made really good progress in those areas. I also started using it in the polka band I play in on everything from polkas, waltzes, obereks (fast waltzes), and rock stuff.
I've been watching the progress of the Bergeron piece and finally couldn't take it anymore and ordered one - received it in about 3-5 days, and really haven't looked back since.
I did a-b it with the Fischer and the e65S.
It feels very similar to the Fischer, but more bite to the cup. It plays more efficiently than the Fischer - probably because of the #2BB vs the #3BB, so I still catch myself trying to overblow and just back off a bit and let it do the work for me.
The sound is a crisper, or cleaner sound vs the Fischer (for me).
I'm working on building my 'Momma don't know fund' so I can get the Classic and the flugel pieces so I don't have to go to a 65 rim for flugel or C trumpet/concert band section parts, then back to the Bergeron.
It does feel larger than the specs, but I did notice a difference when I was rehearsing flugel last night, and going back to the trumpet with the Bergeron piece - that is where I could feel the .650 (e65) vs the .631 (Bergeron) on my chops.
I'm playing mine on my Wild Thing Celebration, and just KILLIN' it!!
_________________
Bill Howard - Saginaw, MI
Yamaha 8335LA Gen2
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jiarby · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Jul 2011 Posts: 1188

just got my WB studio model, haven't had a chance to play it... just buzz.

It feels deeper and softer than my 13A4A. the Schilke also has that distinct v-shape while the WB Studio is much smoother in the cup shape.

Watch for updates as I get to play it!

Fun stuff...I haven't had a brand new mouthpiece for 31 years!

markp · Posted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:45 pm Post subject:

I've been reading about the mouthpieces and would like to know what the "FD" backbore is.

The Studio mouthpiece comes with GR's #2 backbore (I think that's the most common all-around backbore that they have)

The Classic uses the #3 backbore (that's their symphonic backbore)

And the FD, the one Mr. Bergeron says he uses to get the diffused "Chet Baker" sound uses the "FD" backbore.

Is this a specially designed backbore just for this mouthpiece? Under the backbore description at the GR website the 2 and 3 are listed, but not the FD.