Next Gen Shew Z Trumpet??

jadickson · Posted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 4:44 pm Post subject:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lmgG2_-3Os&t=16s

Looks like there is no new brace on the main tuning slide after all.

Brent · Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 7:34 am Post subject: Z

Personal preference has so much to do with it.

I recall the discussion on the TH when the 8310z was introduced (2003 or 04?). Half the folks noted they still liked the 6310z better. Someone even mentioned liking the model before the 6310z best.

The most significant change I can see for this model is using a two piece valve block, and I don't know enough to say how much that would really help. Sure seems to be a thing now with horn makers. Even Carol looks like there experimenting with it.
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Brent

intrepidpooch · Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:23 pm Post subject:

djpearlman · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:54 am Post subject:

Ray - Which slide did you get?
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kehaulani · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:04 pm Post subject:

intrepidpooch · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:59 am Post subject:

I got the semi-round SE (braceless) tuning slide in bronze. I highly recommend any custom Z players to contact Mike and Ryan at M/K and have them send you a few to try out, the improvement is pretty amazing IMO.
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ScottA · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:05 am Post subject:

From a previous post I made regarding the new Z:

"We received the new 8310Z-II this morning. I have not had a lot of time with it but will let you know my initial impressions here.

The only real visual difference is the valve buttons and top valve cap. The top cap is more like the caps found on the Artist model horn with a slightly ressesed area when the valve is depressed rather than being flush. The top edges of the valve cap are thin and sharp like the Artist model. Finger buttons also has the knurled sides rather than the formerly smooth. The two models are easy to tell apart by this feature alone.

The venturi measures at .340 rather than .341 for my original Z. I had heard that it would be a hair smaller and measurements bear that out.

The valve block is now a 2 piece and there is a new leadpipe design. I have not played on it much but have liked the few notes a lot! The valve stroke feels much more positive (excuse the expression but one player said more "Bach-like" and I can't disagree.) The 4th space E and Eb are much more in tune than my current Z which tends flat on those notes.

The horn also comes with a new case that looks very similar to the Xeno double case. Leather-ish nice looking and compact.

Response is excellent and the sound seems a bit more contained. Very nice--I am looking forward to playing it more over the weekend."

I have played on it a fair amount since then and can certainly say that I am a fan. The quicker response, tighter core and more positive valve feel are all pluses for me. But with that being said I am not a player the original Z was designed for as I play primarily legit quintet, church, orchestra, etc. but I have found the Z horns to be very versatile instruments that can work in most situations. I have a former student who is a very strong lead/jazz player and he preferred the original 8310Z but thought I sounded better on the new version. I have a M/K sterling slide for the original but the new model did more of what I wanted the slide to do with the other horn.....if that makes any sense!
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Scott Apelgren
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Jerry · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:58 am Post subject:

ScottA · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:10 pm Post subject:

My other Bb is a Yamaha N.Y. and it will certainly light up when pushed but it will not get as edgy, especially in the low register I find I can play loud and blend easier. I think the N.Y also still has more core to the sound but the difference is not as obvious with the new Z.

I had originally started playing the Z middle of last year and found myself using it more and more often. My quintet partner liked mine so much he bought one as well. As I get older the efficiency does not hurt a bit either.
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Scott Apelgren
Indialantic, FL

Ed Kennedy · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187

jazzr69 · Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:38 am Post subject:

I played the new 8310Zii at TMEA in San Antonio last week and was so impressed I am looking at buying one. I have not played the original 8310Z though and no stores near me have either one in stock.

Anyone who has played both, can you give more impressions on how they compare? Scott, can you elaborate on why your student preferred the original version and do you have any other thoughts on how it plays now that you have owned it for a couple more weeks?

ScottA · Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:30 am Post subject:

jazzr69 · Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:54 am Post subject:

Thanks Scott!

ScottA · Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:32 am Post subject:

If I remember correctly he thought it was a touch more open and the slots were just a little looser for him. He preferred the original tuning slide. And again....these were pretty slight differences. Both are outstanding instruments IMHO.
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Louise Finch · Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 9:20 am Post subject:

Hi ScottA

How do you personally feel that the sound in particular + blow and slotting compare to the Xeno II?

I'm asking, because I play my Xeno II in a symphony orchestra, community light orchestra and Jazz band. I really like the Xeno II overall, but more so for classical playing, and I'm wondering about adding a Shew 8310Z II, as a commercial option.

Additionally, how easy do you feel it is to switch between the Xeno II and Shew 8310Z II?

Are there any similarities in blow and response, since they are both Yamaha trumpets, or are they no more alike than the my Xeno II would be to a more commercial offering from another maker?

Many thanks

Lou
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ScottA · Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:15 am Post subject:

There is certainly more resistance on the Z. It does have a smaller bore and considerably smaller venturi size (.340"-.345") . I would not call the slots on my Z loose like they feel on many Martin Committees but they are not as firm as they are on the Xeno and no where near as firm as on the original Chicago Bb that I played for a few years.

I don't think I can answer the question about moving between the two because my whole point in switching to the Z was to only have 1 Bb trumpet! With that being said I don't think you would have too hard a time moving between the two but just as likely you may find that the Z is the only Bb you need.

I find the response quicker on the Z and yes, the sound is somewhat brighter. But, when using a standard mouthpiece (meaning not a shallow lead-style piece) I don't find the sound overly edgy. Many players complain that the Z horns "close down" on them when they are playing in the upper register but obviously players like Bobby Shew and MANY others have no problem with it at all so it is all in how you approach the instrument.

Bottom line--they are different instruments and you really should check one out for yourself to determine if it can work for you. Sorry I could not be more finite!
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Scott Apelgren
Indialantic, FL

JVL · Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:56 pm Post subject:

I should get my 8310Z II selected and tweaked by Bobby in the next 3 weeks, i 'm really looking forward to !
In november, Bobby tweaked my 19 years old 6310, and evrything opened up and get easier. The 8310 II new prototype i tried weeks before, untweaked was already a big improvement.
When he tweaked it, it got even way better !
I'm very happy with my tweaked 6310, but when i get the 8310 II this last one will be my favorite.
I'll let you know

best

Justin_Smith · Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:45 pm Post subject:

I would lie to try on of these. I have an older 6310Z which I preferred over the first generation 8310Z. I generally use this horn for more heavy lead playing/commercial playing then my other trumpets.

Side bar: currently playing It exclusively, as I have a fractured elbow and it is the lightest horn I own.

Justin J. Smith
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Louise Finch · Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:34 pm Post subject:

JVL · Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:45 am Post subject:

hello Lou,
if you permit me, i can give you some personal feelings that may help you, i hope.
I've been playing the 6310Z for 18 years, and to get the right freeblow for me (without overblowing) my custom mpcs (except the lead ones) are made with symphonic bb, and #26 throat for classical Bach A depth cups, and #18 throat for cornet, because conventional 27 throats didn't suit.
The horn had got old, and felt tighter, less accurate mostly in these last 12 months, to a point it became really problematic.
Bobby tweaked it in november, and suddenly the sound got as large as with my old Bach strad 43/72* (but easier than with this Bach ; I'll add i'm a jazz & salsa lead).
And i could feel too that for my deep mpcs, it was like if i played with a 1 step larger throat (let's say my 26 throat feels now like a 25 one).

So, Bobby's tweak can really modify the blow and playing of the horn.
And with the new 8310, things are way evident and better and easier.

I could try in the same time the Bergeron & Miyashiro models. They didn't match with me.

hope this will help

best