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Bach 37


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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:37 am    Post subject: Bach 37 Reply with quote

Hi

I've decided to try to resurrect my 1979 Bach 37 this year, as as much as I like my Xeno II for classical playing, it is just not quite I want for more commercial playing.

This is the same Bach with the same annoying first valve. I've had a chat with Leigh at Eclipse, and when I can get round to taking it, he is going to have a look at the valves.

Anyway, because of the annoying intermittent sticking of the 1st valve once the trumpet warms up, I've spent little time on my Bach 37 in the last three years.

I bought it from Leigh originally, at a time when I was doing predominantly dance band work on trumpet, and although a Bach 37 probably doesn't seem on paper to be the best Bach configuration for big band playing, this is the individual trumpet I liked best out of the used Bachs which he had taken in as trade, and at the time I was looking for a Bach trumpet to double on with Bach cornet.

I took it to my Jazz band yesterday, in which we play mainly American Songbook standards, and it really made me smile.

My lacquered Xeno II with the yellow brass bell is a lovely classical trumpet in my opinion. It has a very even response throughout the registers and responds very easily to changes in dynamics. It however just doesn't seem to have the power of my Bach 37. My Bach doesn't seem to respond particularly easily in quieter dynamics but really lights up when pushed a bit, and feels like a big powerful trumpet, which of course it isn't. I'd forgotten what made me choose this trumpet in the first place.

I'm wondering whether it is this particular Bach 37 or whether they all have more go in them than the Xeno II, as depending on Leigh's assessment of the condition of the valves, I need to decide how to proceed. In 24 years of playing, I don't think I've had anything more than a brief go on any other Bach 37s.

I've decided to keep my Xeno II for my symphony orchestra, and switch to my Bach 37 for my community light orchestra this season, as we are rehearsing for a concert of show tunes, and my jazz band.

Depending on the condition of the valves, I'm considering a new Bach 37, but I'm not sure how the new ones compare. The Anniversary model seems highly regarded, but is rather expensive in the UK, and out of my budget. I know that I need to go somewhere and try a lot of examples to see how they compare to my 1979 one, but at the moment, I would be interested in other people's opinions of how I find my Bach 37 in relation to my Xeno II.

Am I experiencing the general playing characteristics of each, or do I have a particularly classically orientated Xeno II (I don't believe that Xeno II's differ much from one example to another, but is the lacquered version for example more classically orientated than the silver-plated one) or more likely a particularly commercially orientated Bach 37?

I'd be interested in your views.

All the best

Lou

P.S. My Bach 37 had just had a new leadpipe when I bought it. I'm not sure whether Leigh put on a Bach 25, or even a Bach pipe
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
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Flugel:
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Cornets:
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Last edited by Louise Finch on Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ed Kennedy
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had the opportunity yesterday to play a Bach 190-37S and a 190-43S back to back. If you are looking for a commercial horn with classical capability I'd recommend the 43. It was the star of the show along with an Edwards X-13. It was brighter sounding and just felt better to me in a blow and resistance way; and the sound, all Bach but favoring the highs. I owned a 190-37 for a while when they first came out and it is a terrific horn. It was good enough for me to pull the trigger and buy an expensive horn that I didn't really need. If I'd had the choice at the time the 43 would be the one and I suspect that I would have kept it. If you want to go all the way, the Mariachi (190-43RB) really lights it up. The reverse leadpipe plays more open and the LW bronze bell really zings.

Last edited by Ed Kennedy on Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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zaferis
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lou,

I love your posts.. always thoughtful and insightful. Sometime a stretch to my reading skills

If at all possible, save your pennies (pounds) for an Anniversary editon of the 37.. "a 37 on steroids" or "a 37 the way they're meant to be" are the two big quotes that I've heard that I definitley agree with. Over that passed couple years, I've had the chance to play many Bach's at the factory and as demo's are made available for some of my students. As much as I gravitate to the 37's I haven't found a single 18037 that plays anywhere near as well as the 19037 (silver or lacquer).
I add that I have not had the chance to play a 100th Anniversary 19043.. I hear they're pretty fantastic too.
I also find that there is something in the sound of a Bach that holds together in the "hall" - I'm actually a little surprised that you prefer the Xeno for orchestra work. My experience has been to move away from the Xeno's and other Yamaha's as I miss something in the resonance, carry, presence of sound, especially in larger ensembles and recordings.
My setup is the 19037 for 'legit" work and an LT1901B Commercial for big bands and shows. "I'm sure I'd be happy with my 37 in a big band or show setting, but enjoy having the lighter weight for the higher parts and when playing under parts with the true lead-players that I get to work with.

The valve thing sucks. When you can't depend on the instrument, it's so hard to be comfortable and regain any trust.
Have you thought about having the valves overhauled? I'm thinking it may not cost as much as a new horn and you'd get back something you already like and are familiar with.

a quick story about my 19037: I was rendering Taps and the National Anthem at an outdoor ceremony back in November. It was very cold 25 degree F. After the service, for which I thought I played pretty well inspite of the weather, a woman approached me and asked, "is that some special kind of trumpet?" No, I said. "...cause that's the best sounding trumpet I've ever heard, and to do it in the cold.... " Now, I take it for what it was, just a random comment from "average Sally" but still reinforces my love of this trumpet.

Cheers
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Speed
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like Zaferis, I have a 19037 and a Bach Commercial trumpet, although mine is the large bore model. They are both very versatile. If I could have only one, it would be the Commercial, but mainly because of its low resistance. I can put my Bach symphonic 1.5C mouthpiece on it, and it's fine for legit work.

My 19037 has a 25-O leadpipe, which I installed in a successful effort to lower the resistance, along with a "C" shaped tuning slide. I like it, and I could be very happy if it were my only trumpet, but I came upon a very attractive deal on the Commercial trumpet and bought it. I have not been able to bring myself to selling the 19037, but after getting the Commercial Trumpet, I rarely play the 19037. It's not that I dislike the 19037, but I like the Commercial Trumpet better. I agree that the 19037 is a 18037 on steroids.

In the upper register, I find the Commercial Trumpet is simply easier for me to play. To my ears, the two trumpets sound quite similar in the middle register. As you might anticipate, the Commercial lights up a bit more in the upper register, but it's not as bright as, say, a Selmer CG.

I see a fairly large number of the Bach Commercial trumpets for sale second hand, considering that it's not been on the market but a few years. I guess they are not everyone's cup of tea. I bought mine for $2,100, and it did not have a scratch or dent on it. That's about a third less than the price of a brand new one. If you get a chance to play one, you may be surprised at its versatility. I tried both the ML and the LB models, and simply preferred the LB. Your mileage may vary.

The frequent appearance of the Bach Commercial trumpets on the used market might make one of them attractive to you from a budgetary standpoint. You might even find that with it and a couple of different mouthpieces (see my example above of the Bach symphonic mouthpiece), you may be able to have just a single trumpet for all of your playing.

Take care,
Marc Speed
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

About the sticking valve on your Bach.

I had similar problem on my King. A good repair tech suggested that I try a heavier valve oil.
That WORKED!

I use 'drug store / druggist / pharmacy' Mineral Oil on the valves and slides - undiluted on the slides. After applying to the valves, add a drop or 2 of regular light Petroleum valve oil to get good valve action. And re-apply a drop of the the regular valve oil when the valve eventually gets sluggish.

There is likely a variety of special weight valve oil that would work, but I'm very happy with using the MO.

Jay
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laser170323
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know you're in the UK, but you might want to consider ordering a blueprinted horn from Osmun Music. You won't have to worry about selecting a lemon; you'll know the horn is as good as it can be. It brings any ordinary Bach to the next level, whatever model you order.
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KRELL1960
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:55 am    Post subject: Re: Bach 37 Reply with quote

Louise Finch wrote:
Hi

I've decided to try to resurrect my 1979 Bach 37 this year, as as much as I like my Xeno II for classical playing, it is just not quite I want for more commercial playing.

This is the same Bach with the same annoying first valve. I've had a chat with Leigh at Eclipse, and when I can get round to taking it, he is going to have a look at the valves.

Anyway, because of the annoying intermittent sticking of the 1st valve once the trumpet warms up, I've spent little time on my Bach 37 in the last three years.

I bought it from Leigh originally, at a time when I was doing predominantly dance band work on trumpet, and although a Bach 37 probably doesn't seem on paper to be the best Bach configuration for big band playing, this is the individual trumpet I liked best out of the used Bachs which he had taken in as trade, and at the time I was looking for a Bach trumpet to double on with Bach cornet.

I took it to my Jazz band yesterday, in which we play mainly American Songbook standards, and it really made me smile.

My lacquered Xeno II with the yellow brass bell is a lovely classical trumpet in my opinion. It has a very even response throughout the registers and responds very easily to changes in dynamics. It however just doesn't seem to have the power of my Bach 37. My Bach doesn't seem to respond particularly easily in quieter dynamics but really lights up when pushed a bit, and feels like a big powerful trumpet, which of course it isn't. I'd forgotten what made me choose this trumpet in the first place.

I'm wondering whether it is this particular Bach 37 or whether they all have more go in them than the Xeno II, as depending on Leigh's assessment of the condition of the valves, I need to decide how to proceed. In 24 years of playing, I don't think I've had anything more than a brief go on any other Bach 37s.

I've decided to keep my Xeno II for my symphony orchestra, and switch to my Bach 37 for my community light orchestra this season, as we are rehearsing for a concert of show tunes, and my jazz band.

Depending on the condition of the valves, I'm considering a new Bach 37, but I'm not sure how the new ones compare. The Anniversary model seems highly regarded, but is rather expensive in the UK, and out of my budget. I know that I need to go somewhere and try a lot of examples to see how they compare to my 1979 one, but at the moment, I would be interested in other people's opinions of how I find my Bach 37 in relation to my Xeno II.

Am I experiencing the general playing characteristics of each, or do I have a particularly classically orientated Xeno II (I don't believe that Xeno II's differ much from one example to another, but is the lacquered version for example more classically orientated than the silver-plated one) or more likely a particularly commercially orientated Bach 37?

I'd be interested in your views.

All the best

Lou

P.S. My Bach 37 had just had a new leadpipe when I bought it. I'm not sure whether Leigh put on a Bach 25, or even a Bach pipe


Hi Lou,

the most glaring part of your post is the new leadpipe added part.
This could be the reason you feel this horn is better for your "commercial playing". I had a bach 37 in the 80's that was the most all around trumpet i have ever played. Perfect for classical, quintet, big band, whatever. And back then i played just one mouthpiece, a bach 1.5C. All that being said, i sold that horn years ago as it didn't really have the punch i needed for what i eventually play the most, R&B type stuff. Is it the commercial sound your really after? If so get what the pros play in a commercial setting. 1s2 or bach 43. The great commercial players pretty much all play these two horns or a variation of them. Look into a 1s2 from Charlie Davis. Fantastic Horns. But more than anything else i think finding a commercial sound you like comes down to mouthpiece/horn config. I carry at all times 4 to 7 distinctly different pieces. Big V shaped flugel like to tiny 30 drill lasers. find the horn that can handle these types of changes and you've found the right horn, I know i meandered off the idea of your original post a bit, but it's something to think about.

regards,

tom
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Vin DiBona
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Bach 190/37 and 190/43 are the finest Bach horns I have ever played.
I go back to the mid to late 60s when I first tried Bach horns. That era was magnificent for Bachs - at least many of them. I had a Burbank Benge 5X back then and I preferred it to the Bachs of that era.
These new ones are stunning in sound, intonation, response, and ease of playing. The new Yamahas are wonderful, too, but they just don't have that incredible core sound these new Bachs have.

If I had the $$, I would get myself a 190/37 in lacquer because I thought the lacquered one and a little "extra" over the silver plated one.

The 43 was also terrific, but not what I prefer in sound.

R.Tomasek
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks very much everyone. I'll reply gradually as I find the time.

All the best

Lou
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
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- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the exception of the sticking valve (which is most certainly fixable), this is pretty subjective. I personally don’t especially like the 37 for what I do today, but I have owned and played them in the past for big band lead. And as I have mentioned before, the strongest lead player I have ever played (second part) with (RIP Joel Wright) used a basic, lacquered 37, with no tweaks.

What exactly are you hoping to find? More projection? More feedback? Brighter sound? Bigger/brighter sound? More focused?

There are SO many variables, I don’t really think personal horn recommendations are very helpful, YOU need to find what works for you, in whichever genre you use the horn in. I alternate between a Wild Thing and an LA Benge 3x+, they work for me, but you might hate either or both of them.

Brad
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Last edited by Brad361 on Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:50 am; edited 1 time in total
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ed Kennedy wrote:
I had the opportunity yesterday to play a Bach 190-37S and a 190-43S back to back. If you are looking for a commercial horn with classical capability I'd recommend the 43. It was the star of the show along with an Edwards X-13. It was brighter sounding and just felt better to me i a blow and resistance way; and the sound, all Bach but favoring the highs. I owned a 190-37 for a while when they first came out and it is a terrific horn. It was good enough for me to pull the trigger and buy an expensive horn that I didn't really need. If I'd had the choice at the time the 43 would be the one and I suspect that I would have kept it. If you want to go all the way, the Mariachi (190-43RB) really lights it up. The reverse leadpipe plays more open and the LW bronze bell really zings.


Hi Ed

Thanks very much. This is really appreciated.

Take care

Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
- Denis Wick 4B underpart/my 3C rim
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zaferis wrote:
Lou,

I love your posts.. always thoughtful and insightful. Sometime a stretch to my reading skills

Hi zaferis

Thanks very much. Sorry, I can be a little wordy lol. I know what I mean.


If at all possible, save your pennies (pounds) for an Anniversary editon of the 37.. "a 37 on steroids" or "a 37 the way they're meant to be" are the two big quotes that I've heard that I definitley agree with. Over that passed couple years, I've had the chance to play many Bach's at the factory and as demo's are made available for some of my students. As much as I gravitate to the 37's I haven't found a single 18037 that plays anywhere near as well as the 19037 (silver or lacquer).
I add that I have not had the chance to play a 100th Anniversary 19043.. I hear they're pretty fantastic too.

Thanks very much. Yes, I'll definitely try the 19037, as I have heard many good things about it.

I also find that there is something in the sound of a Bach that holds together in the "hall" - I'm actually a little surprised that you prefer the Xeno for orchestra work. My experience has been to move away from the Xeno's and other Yamaha's as I miss something in the resonance, carry, presence of sound, especially in larger ensembles and recordings.

Interesting, thanks. What I like about my Xeno is how even in response it is throughout the registers, and especially its ease of dynamic control. Although a little slotty for my personal taste, even after reducing the mouthpiece gap, I find this advantageous for orchestral playing. I also find my Xeno to have a very nice sound for classical trumpet playing.

I play in a reduced sized symphony orchestra in a comparatively small rehearsal room, and I've had more ssshhh's from the conductor than requests to play louder, so I don't personally find any difficulties with my sound carrying.

Regarding something being missing in the resonance and presence of sound, I personally feel that this is an area in which the Xeno II is an improvement over the Xeno I.


My setup is the 19037 for 'legit" work and an LT1901B Commercial for big bands and shows. "I'm sure I'd be happy with my 37 in a big band or show setting, but enjoy having the lighter weight for the higher parts and when playing under parts with the true lead-players that I get to work with.

Thanks very much. I'm not doing any big band playing at the moment, and although we are doing show tunes for our next concert, my community light orchestra also plays marches and a lot of light classical repertoire. I therefore imagine that the Bach Commercial trumpet will be too commercially orientated, whereas my Bach 37 is more middle of the road.

The valve thing sucks. When you can't depend on the instrument, it's so hard to be comfortable and regain any trust.

I completely agree.

Have you thought about having the valves overhauled? I'm thinking it may not cost as much as a new horn and you'd get back something you already like and are familiar with.

Leigh at Eclipse is going to look at my valves, but he doesn't recommend having them done if they do need a valve job. It is a long story, which I won't go into. I'm hoping that it will be an easy fix, so I have the choice of playing, trading or selling my Bach.

a quick story about my 19037: I was rendering Taps and the National Anthem at an outdoor ceremony back in November. It was very cold 25 degree F. After the service, for which I thought I played pretty well inspite of the weather, a woman approached me and asked, "is that some special kind of trumpet?" No, I said. "...cause that's the best sounding trumpet I've ever heard, and to do it in the cold.... " Now, I take it for what it was, just a random comment from "average Sally" but still reinforces my love of this trumpet.

A lovely story. Thanks very much for sharing. You clearly have a very nice trumpet sound.

Cheers

Cheers to you too.

Lou

_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
- Denis Wick 4B underpart/my 3C rim
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brad361 wrote:

What exactly are you hoping to find? More projection? More feedback? Brighter sound? Bigger/brighter sound? More focused?


Hi Everyone

I'm responding to this sentence of Brad's post out of order, as I think that this will be useful for subsequent posters. I'll reply to the above posts in order when I have a moment, including responding to Brad's in full.

It is hard to put in words, but I think that I am looking for primarily greater flexibility, probably in association with a faster response and bigger rather than brighter sound. I'm looking for a lively trumpet which responds quickly with good projection and a big full sound, and I feel that I have this in my Bach 37. I feel that I am playing a big, powerful, lively and responsive trumpet.

People tell me that it is the wrong word, but clean comes to mind with my Xeno II. It has a beautiful (I'm referring to the inherent sound of the trumpet rather than me personally) clear and clean focused sound. I'm primarily a brass bander, and clean, neat, accurate cornet playing is more my thing, and in my hands, my Xeno II trumpet is clean, accurate and nice sounding. I fully appreciate that this is owing to my strengths as a player, but I have to fight my Xeno II more than I'd like for swing in particular. It is more rigid in terms of flexibility than I'd prefer, even after reducing the mouthpiece gap to where I consider it to be at its optimum, and it doesn't project quite as I'd like.

It is like a nice quiet docile sheep, whereas I want a beast to tame for some of my playing. People are referring to the 19037 as being like a 18037 on steroids and that is the sensation I get when I compare my Bach 37 to Xeno II on more commercial repertoire.

Hopefully this will make sense.

All the best

Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
- Denis Wick 4B underpart/my 3C rim
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Another thing, although I mention wanting greater projection, it is more the feel that I am looking to change than the sound. Ultimately I sound like me on all my trumpets. I want faster response, greater flexibility and something I can push harder. Most probably my Xeno II does all this already, but my Bach 37 does it more easily for me.

All the best

Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
- Denis Wick 4B underpart/my 3C rim
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Ed Kennedy
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RE: 1st valve trouble.

You could have just the 1st valve refitted. That would entail a capable shop honing the piston true, having it plated up dimensionaly oversize. rehoning true, and finally honing out the cylinder to accept the newly larger piston. Bach has had in the past, oversize replacement pistons available. If Eclipse is fitting the pistons on their horns they should be able to accomate you. As long as the #2 and #3 have good compression there is no need to mess with them.

I actually fitted valves to new Schilkes when I worked there in the '70's so I do know what I am talking about. We fitted valves to a tolerance of .0002" and then lapped them in to make functional.
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jadickson
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Louise Finch wrote:
Hi

Another thing, although I mention wanting greater projection, it is more the feel that I am looking to change than the sound. Ultimately I sound like me on all my trumpets. I want faster response, greater flexibility and something I can push harder. Most probably my Xeno II does all this already, but my Bach 37 does it more easily for me.

All the best

Lou


Bach 190-37. No question.

Yamaha is coming out with a new generation of Bobby Shew 8310z trumpets this month. That's another option, but would be a very big change from what you are currently using.
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Louise Finch
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ed Kennedy wrote:
RE: 1st valve trouble.

You could have just the 1st valve refitted. That would entail a capable shop honing the piston true, having it plated up dimensionaly oversize. rehoning true, and finally honing out the cylinder to accept the newly larger piston. Bach has had in the past, oversize replacement pistons available. If Eclipse is fitting the pistons on their horns they should be able to accomate you. As long as the #2 and #3 have good compression there is no need to mess with them.

I actually fitted valves to new Schilkes when I worked there in the '70's so I do know what I am talking about. We fitted valves to a tolerance of .0002" and then lapped them in to make functional.



Hi Ed

Thanks very much for your informed advice, which is really appreciated.

(Sorry, I will reply to everyone else tomorrow. My Bach has just disgraced itself lol. I decided to play some technical repertoire on it. First valve was stick stick stick to an unplayable extent. I had a look at the valves. Valves 2 and 3 don't stick, but there is fair amount of play when you wiggle the valve stems side to side. With the 1st valve, there is no play whatsoever. I took off the bottom valve cap, and could see the piston scraping against the casing. I applied more oil, this time to the bottom of the casing. The more oil, the worse it gets, so the 1st valve casing must have gotten out of round somehow, although it doesn't look like it is. If so, I have no idea how. Hopefully this can be fixed.

Admittedly I wasn't playing technical stuff yesterday, but the valve was hardly a problem. I was alternating trumpet, flugel and flute, which is probably the explanation, as the trumpet gets worse the longer you play it.

With regards to my Bach, I'll let you all know the outcome once Leigh has seen it, which won't be yet, as I am waiting for my Taxi Driver husband to take it to Leigh when he has a job to/from Luton airport, which he does from time to time.

All the best

Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
Kanstul F Besson C
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
- Differing Kanstul Custom 3Cs
- Denis Wick 4B underpart/my 3C rim


Last edited by Louise Finch on Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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falado
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Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 632
Location: Eastern NC

PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:41 pm    Post subject: D Reply with quote

Hi Lou, you 1st valve slide could be out of alignment, especially if it took a slight fall. I know you’re not in the USA, but I would send it to Jim Becker at Osmun Music, tell him the problem and have it blueprinted. Every horn I sent to him comes back a player. It may cost a bit, but it would be like have new life in the horn. Just a thought.

Dave
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FA LA DO (Ab: V/ii)
Stomvi VR II
Benge CG
Kanstul Flugel
Besson Cornet (WWII era)
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Ed Kennedy
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Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 2570

PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:23 pm    Post subject: Re: D Reply with quote

falado wrote:
Hi Lou, you 1st valve slide could be out of alignment, especially if it took a slight fall. I know you’re not in the USA, but I would send it to Jim Becker at Osmun Music, tell him the problem and have it blueprinted. Every horn I sent to him comes back a player. It may cost a bit, but it would be like have new life in the horn. Just a thought.

Dave


A slide misaligned by a fall or other trauma can cause a deflection of the port to the valve casing. This is very common on student horns on the second valve. Very often I can relieve the stress by prying (gently) up on the slide assembly. I hav not encountered this on a 1st slide unless the damage is profound.
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 6054
Location: Houston, TX.

PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Louise Finch wrote:
Hi Ed

(Sorry, I will reply to everyone else tomorrow. My Bach has just disgraced itself lol. I decided to play some technical repertoire on it. First valve was stick stick stick to an unplayable extent. I had a look at the valves. Valves 2 and 3 don't stick, but there is fair amount of play when you wiggle the valve stems side to side. With the 1st valve, there is no play whatsoever. I took off the bottom valve cap, and could see the piston scraping against the casing. I applied more oil, this time to the bottom of the casing. The more oil, the worse it gets, so the 1st valve casing must have gotten out of round somehow, although it doesn't look like it is. If so, I have no idea how. Hopefully this can be fixed.

Admittedly I wasn't playing technical stuff yesterday, but the valve was hardly a problem. I was alternating trumpet, flugel and flute, which is probably the explanation, as the trumpet gets worse the longer you play it.

With regards to my Bach, I'll let you all know the outcome once Leigh has seen it, which won't be yet, as I am waiting for my Taxi Driver husband to take it to Leigh when he has a job to/from Luton airport, which he does from time to time.

All the best

Lou


Hi Lou,

I tend to be persnickety about my equipment, but I would not tolerate that for ten minutes, especially when there are ways to fix it!

Brad
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"I always try but, not always, because the horn is mercy-less, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval
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