Flugelhorn Selection

Mikee · Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:50 pm Post subject: Flugelhorn Selection

I am a newbie to this site. Comeback player - off for 35+ years back for 5 years now in earnest - but still a long way to go! I play in local Pops band and in church every Sunday.

I would like to buy a Flugelhorn for the more mellow sound to play in church - mostly melodies and some descants for standard hymns. Recently had a french horn join me in church for a month or so - was beautiful - trying to get closer to that sound.

There are no music stores near me that have any Flugelhorns in stock - therefore hard to try any out. I probably have more $ than sense - what should I buy (new)? Bach 183 and complete the lineup? Who stocks (in South East) many types of Flugels where I could try some out?

Any advise appreciated...
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Newell Post · Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 8:57 pm Post subject:

Hard to go wrong with Bach, unless you have some very specific requirements. I have a Kanstul and a Yamaha flugel. They are quite different in terms of tone and response. The Kanstul has a copper bell which further mellows the tone. I love copper bells on flugel, although they are more fragile.

Here's something I tried at a small church recently: Flugelhorn mouthpiece on my Schilke cornet. The sound was vaguely "flumpetish" -- more mellow than trumpet or cornet, but not really flugelhorn, either. In a small space, it worked quite well for congregational sign-along.

Tobylou8 · Veteran Member Joined: 23 Feb 2019 Posts: 157

Brassnose · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:36 am Post subject:

I know I am proposing an offbeat choice ... Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15. Can be had for about 400 eur used and is very easy to play. Valves are good and the company has a reputation for producing good horns at reasonable prices. Sort of the German Carol Brass but they go back to 1948 at least. Hard to find in the US I presume.
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1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

scottfsmith · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:53 am Post subject:

.. you could also actually get a Carol Brass 620/6200, they can be picked up used in great shape for around $600. They are very similar to the Yamaha they are based on. Thats what I bought and I have been very happy.

Here is one now on eBay for example:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carol-CFL-620R-L-FLUGELHORN-with-Gold-Brass-Bell/132967973588
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maynard-46 · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:25 am Post subject: Flugelhorn Selection

IMO the best "bang for your buck" is a Yamaha 631G in lacquer. I play professionally and have 3 flugels...2 "boutique" horns and the 631G and the Yamaha gets 90% of my playing time. Gorgeous sound...impeccable intonation...valves are nice...and it has the best upper register out of all of them (which I use in my playing). It can be nice and mellow or can cut thru a big band depending on the mouthpiece. Hands down you should order and try one of these 631G's. Good luck in ur search!

Butch
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FLUGELHORN: ADAMS Custom "F1" / Legends .585 "CatMaster FL.

adc · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:55 am Post subject:

I am a comeback player after a 50+ year layoff. Played a cornet in my younger days. When I started up again. I got a Used Strad 37 and then an Eterna Trumpet. Just didn't care for a trumpet.

Went through dozens of Cornets. Giving many away to schools. My two favorites now are a 1910 Conn Perfected wonder and a 1914 York & Sons Improved Perfect. Both very mellow. And with a deep MP even more so.

I would like to get a Flugelhorn. But for now I will cool my heels bc I want to buy a Circa 1906 Conn Wonderphone or maybe a New York Wonder. But since I want one in superb condition, that may be a while.

The Flugel will have to wait..lol.
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pinstriper · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:14 am Post subject:

If you want to drop a ton of money on a horn way above you there are plenty of options including Adams, Scodwell (oh, how I wish), Getzen and Yamaha 83xx to add into the mix plus the aforementioned Kanstul etc.

For comeback amateur hacks like us, the ACB, Dillon etc. also play better than we can, and cost a fraction.

I have the Dillon in rose brass, for no particular reason over the ACB than it was available and ACB was backordered at the time. It does everything and more that I could ever ask of it.

I also have a flumpet mouthpiece that I put in my trumpet on occasion where I want to split the difference between trumpet and flugel.
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Brassnose · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:16 am Post subject:

@ pinstriper: interesting statement about the level of instruments for amateur hacks like us

I picked up my brand new Martin Schmidt trumpet on Saturday - while the instrument is certainly overkill for my qualities of playing I am amazed at how much easier it is to play than any other instrument I have played before.

I can color the sound, intonation is great (the notes just sit where they have to be, even low c# can almost be lipped down), etc etc. This instrument makes my (amateur) playing so much easier - I can focus so much more on the actual music going on. I am blown away, really.

So here’s the question: shouldn’t amateurs ESPECIALLY focus on having really good horns to save their energy and concentration for the musical action? I am leaning in this direction and jokingly said to my wife that I was considering selling everything but the new horn. Really considering it, actually.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

zaferis · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:42 am Post subject:

I'll +1 what Brassnose wrote -- and yes, you should focus on a really good horn. Not only will it help you, both musically and improving your technique(s), but will make you more compelling to the "pro's" and the experienced players when you work with them. It makes things more difficult when trying to play lead or a section where one player is playing some Chinese trumpet/cornet/flugelhorn that neither plays in tune nor has a sound that has any color to it. Showing up to the car rallye with your Yugo won't do.

The Yamaha 631G, lacquer, is a solid, easy to pick up and play Flugel
Bach 183's have a wonderful tone, tend to be a bit "pitchy" in the low register and do play differently than many others as the bore is small and of the "straight through" design. IMO have to play it frequently to keep the feel and comfort.
XO makes a worthy flugel too.. curious to see how they stand up over time.
Kanstul Flugels sound great - except for the clunky valves (I couldn't get passed that aspect)
Adams and Van Laar are on top of my wish list - if you've got the bucks.

Then I like the suggestion of a deep mouthpiece for your trumpet. Curry's are excellent - #TF. or #CF
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Brassnose · Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:48 am Post subject:

Zaferis, I like your statement about the Curry mps. That is what I play on my new horn and it just matches the rotary sound perfectly while still allowing me to play high (as high as I can play, that is) without losing sound.

Oh, and if you don't like clunky valves, go rotary

_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

Mikee · Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:26 am Post subject:

Thanks for all the replies! I 'm glad to be a part of this site.

Is there a music shop someone could suggest that stocks several brands of Flugels? I travel around the SE fairly regularly and sometimes venture farther.

I like the thought of taking the equipment out of the equation as with Brassnote and Zaferis comments. Within reason of course - but If I'm not playing very well - it's not the horn I'm playing - it's all me.

Mike
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shofarguy · Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:08 am Post subject:

Mike,

I'd like to throw in two possibilities that exist right now, but may not for very long.

Flip Oakes Wild Thing flugelhorn
Michael Thomas Music Burbank flugelhorn

These are both extremely high-rated horns made for each by Kanstul, which is not producing instruments at this time.

I know that Flip was promised two flugelhorn from Kanstul, but I don't know if he has received them or not.

I spoke with Michael last Saturday and he has what is probably the last new Burbank flugelhorn, available at a negotiable price.

If I were not buying a house at this time, I would buy as many of these horns as I could afford, simply because they are tremendous instruments, may very well become collector's items, and because these two men are dear friends of mine.

You will see very few if any of these flugelhorn for sale on the used market, because those of us who buy them simply will not part with them.
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Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper

There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.

cheiden · Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:26 am Post subject:

Hard to go wrong with Yamaha, any model. Used ones can usually be found if you want a less expensive option.
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RobBari · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:08 am Post subject:

jhatpro · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 7:18 am Post subject:

I’e played Paris LeBlanc, Yamaha Shew and Scodwell.

All good but Scodwell the best!
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2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
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1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

cheiden · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 9:56 am Post subject:

Dale Proctor · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 12:39 pm Post subject:

TrumpetMD · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: Flugelhorn Selection

TKSop · Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 2:36 pm Post subject:

Try a few and see what you like.

Nothing I've played quite matches the Eclipse but I'm not sure how easily you'd be able to find one in the flesh to try out.

Bach's are underrated when it comes to flugels, they're unpopular in some circles but a really good horn.