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Bach Stradivarius 72


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tajmozach1898
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:21 am    Post subject: Bach Stradivarius 72 Reply with quote

Can anyone venture a guess as to why so many people play a 37 or 43 bell strad over the 72? I have a 43* and 72 that I got through trading with a fellow TH member and I'm digging both of them...but I've never played a 37 I was fond of.
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trumpetlane
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 37 is easier to play than the 72. It is also seems to blend better with others in more situations. I had a 72 for about 18 year. I loved it. But, I finally realized that I was working too hard playing it and blending with others. I think it is an awesome solo instrument! It can also get a pretty big sound with a lot of different colors.

Just my 2 cents.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:41 am    Post subject: Re: Bach Stradivarius 72 Reply with quote

tajmozach1898 wrote:
Can anyone venture a guess as to why so many people play a 37 or 43 bell strad over the 72? I have a 43* and 72 that I got through trading with a fellow TH member and I'm digging both of them...but I've never played a 37 I was fond of.


I personally found "my" Bb when I acquired a large bore 72 bell trumpet about 10 years ago. I am in the process of getting Bach to make a set of new ones that I can choose from in a visit to the plant soon.

I know many used 72* bell Bach Bbs in the studios in New York in the 70s. I am not sure if that is still the case. I also know that Allen Vizzutti used a 72* bell on an album of his that I own.

Personally, the color pallet I can create on my 72 is one of the huge reason I use it. I also like the response characteristics of the horn in my hands, and the relaxed approach I can use with this horn makes it a joy to play.

I own a 43*, but have it loaned to a student currently. It was a little tight for me, but on the other hand, I have played a standard 43 with the XL bore and found that resistance helpful and of great value.

Hope this helps,

AL
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rockford
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Bach Stradivarius 72 Reply with quote

tajmozach1898 wrote:
Can anyone venture a guess as to why so many people play a 37 or 43 bell strad over the 72? I have a 43* and 72 that I got through trading with a fellow TH member and I'm digging both of them...but I've never played a 37 I was fond of.
I have instruments with all three bells. The 72 sounds great but is a lot more work to play than either the 43 or 37.
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Crazy Finn
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some factors:

- Lots of people who buy Bach Strads don't even know there are options for bells.
- There are way more Bach 37's out there to try and play and buy (aside from the internet) than there are 43's or 72's.
- The 72 takes a bit more to play, perhaps - as has been mentioned above
- Many Band Directors simply recommend the 37. Some of these know that there are other choices, or what those are, or how they are different, but many do not.
- Many trumpet teachers along with many internet folks recommend the 37 (as evidenced on this thread, and many others).

I like both the 43 and the 72 better than the 37, but that's just me. I also like my Benge, Radial, and Yamaha better than most 37's, which is why I own them and not a 37.
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OldSchoolEuph
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I too have horns with 72, 43, 37 & even 25 bells. The 37 is at the bottom of the preference list for me too, but there are those times when you just have to use it to fit in (tonally). I think this is one of those things that just relies on its own momentum to keep going: because the 37 is so common (in Bach and other brands made to sound like one), blending in easily typically means playing a 37. So since everyone keeps doing that, the cycle never ends. I wonder how many ensembles have had a whole section of trumpeters on 37s who would rather have used a different bell?
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Danbassin
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing that has yet to be mentioned is that the 72 allegedly has a large bore bell choke, coming out of the 1st valve. I suspect this has something to do with comments about this bell 'taking more work' to play than a 37 or 43. Also, if we compare one set of resistance preferences: the CG model where a (very) large bore horn shrinks down at the start of the bell, a ML bore Bach 72 would continue to 'open up' where others might be seeking out the opposite feel.

Also anecdotal, I recall once hearing that the 72 was an original bell for the Vindabona configuration, which gives further credence to the large bore bell-start, if you think of that design's ideal beginning with a M bore tuning slide, progressing to ML bore valve section, then L bore bell.

I've always found what Dr. Lilly, above, stated - there's simply more color available with this bell than other popular Bach options. Further, since so many people play on 37 bells, I have also found that the 72 can get you closer to that sound than a 43...or a Benge, etc.

Happy practicing!

-DB
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tajmozach1898
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are all excellent replies! I have a 72 and a 43* that I received as trade for my Adams A4LT. One day I decided to take them both to the music company I work for and compare them with the 37. The difference was night and day. I've played beginner/intermediate yamaha horns that felt and sounded better to me than new 37 strads.
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maynard-46
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:03 am    Post subject: Bach Stradivarious 72 Reply with quote

Quote:
I'm digging both of them


Yet you have BOTH for sale in the Marketplace?????

Butch
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B_Starry
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good catch, Butch!

"Busted", as they used to say ...
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tptptp
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yet you have BOTH for sale in the Marketplace?????

Butch, how did you know that?
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Crazy Finn
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OldSchoolEuph wrote:
I too have horns with 72, 43, 37 & even 25 bells. The 37 is at the bottom of the preference list for me too, but there are those times when you just have to use it to fit in (tonally).

Number of times I've needed a 37 to fit in tonally..... zero. I guess I've only been playing 30 some years, though.

Most all around horns (my Yamaha, Benge, Selmer, and Kanstul-Besson all qualify) work fine if you have the right sound concept and approach. Put 4 guys on 37's and they'll all sound different enough, anyway. Put 4 guys who are listening and working to sound like a section, the horn and mouthpiece don't matter - it'll work.
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maynard-46
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:08 am    Post subject: Bach Stradivarius 72 Reply with quote

Quote:
Butch, how did you know that?


After I read thru this thread I went to the MarketPlace and...voila....there they were...BOTH horns listed for sale!!! Guess he figured if he talked them up in the thread as to how good they were he'd have a better chance selling them! Hey...different strokes for...!!!

Butch
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Andy Del
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy Finn wrote:
Number of times I've needed a 37 to fit in tonally..... zero. I guess I've only been playing 30 some years, though.

This is the truth of the matter. To think that we al have to play the same instrument, when we all create a slightly different sound is just so much cool-aide drinking!

The reason a Bach 37 is so 'popular' (or call it common) is that they MAKE more of them, and have advertised them as the standard we all have to be at. So people take it in, repeat it, and then we get teachers telling kids this is the horn to buy. And all the kids repeat it. The parents repeat it. Then all customers are after is a Bach 37. So the stores stock more.

And the cycle goes on and on...

Playing with a colleague I have not gigged with on almost 40 years, he commented on the fact I wasn't using a Bach trumpet. (I can't as I don't own one) He muttered about sound. The conductor, who has a professional position with a full time orchestra also commented on the trumpet sound - a great blend and example of sectional playing. Just what the Bach addicts say is impossible / less likely / too much like hard work / etc!

Know what? The audience, conductor and others in the ensemble will not notice a thing and couldn't give a fig about what brand/model of trumpet you play.

cheers

Andy
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tajmozach1898
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Bach Stradivarius 72 Reply with quote

maynard-46 wrote:
Quote:
Butch, how did you know that?


After I read thru this thread I went to the MarketPlace and...voila....there they were...BOTH horns listed for sale!!! Guess he figured if he talked them up in the thread as to how good they were he'd have a better chance selling them! Hey...different strokes for...!!!

Butch


I'm selling them because I have horns that suit me better. They're good horns, but I need the money more than I need the horns.

Also, I am getting married with every intention of paying for the entire ceremony/reception/etc...myself.
SO, I'm selling because I need the money.


But, in all honesty, I don't feel that I have to explain my reasoning to anyone.
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LSOfanboy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Bach Stradivarious 72 Reply with quote

maynard-46 wrote:
Quote:
I'm digging both of them


Yet you have BOTH for sale in the Marketplace?????

Butch


Great work Butch.

Maybe I'm cynical but to me this was clearly a ploy to generate some interest for the instruments being sold via the marketplace. Shame.
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Andy Del
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and I reckon they'd go really well with a Monette mouthpiece or two...

Oooops!
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tajmozach1898
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ALSO, I am trying to cull the herd to help fund my travels to and from DMA campus visits and auditions.

How preposterous of me to even post on here. It seems like half the community are genuine and helpful and the rest of you just take the holier than thou approach.

But hey, different strokes for different folks.
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LSOfanboy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tajmozach1898 wrote:
ALSO, I am trying to cull the herd to help fund my travels to and from DMA campus visits and auditions.

How preposterous of me to even post on here. It seems like half the community are genuine and helpful and the rest of you just take the holier than thou approach.

But hey, different strokes for different folks.


People aren't taking issue with you posting.

They are taking issue with the fact that you have started a new thread to sing the praises (literally 'I'm digging both of them') of two trumpets that you are currently trying to sell on the marketplace.

I dare you to try and justify that position with a straight face.

Edit: oh and you've made 12 posts on this site, 4 of which have been on this thread. Sounds like just enough to access the marketplace and then start some threads to advertise your products...
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tajmozach1898
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LSOfanboy wrote:
tajmozach1898 wrote:
ALSO, I am trying to cull the herd to help fund my travels to and from DMA campus visits and auditions.

How preposterous of me to even post on here. It seems like half the community are genuine and helpful and the rest of you just take the holier than thou approach.

But hey, different strokes for different folks.


People aren't taking issue with you posting.

They are taking issue with the fact that you have started a new thread to sing the praises (literally 'I'm digging both of them') of two trumpets that you are currently trying to sell on the marketplace.

I dare you to try and justify that position with a straight face.


Here's my straight face justification. Though I don't owe one.
"I'm digging the horns" and "singing praises" are vastly different things, but I won't argue semantics.
I'm selling two horns that I would RATHER KEEP than sell, but my situation doesn't allow it.
Am I only allowed to sell things I hate? With that approach, how would anyone sell anything?

Also the original post didn't mention that I was selling the horns. I asked a question to receive an answer. I've gotten maybe three answers and the rest is just full of "OOOOHHH YOU CAUGHT HIM."
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