1921 Holton-Clarke cornet: unusual finger buttons

trumpetp1

As I mentioned in a previous post, I was recently gifted with a 1921 H-C cornet.

I'm interested to know if anyone else has acquired a horn with these particular finger buttons (or something very similar). Anyone?

https://i.postimg.cc/vZJtt2tf/H-Cfingerbuttons.jpg

I'm not completely taken with them, but they certainly do force me to use good finger placement and technique.[/img]
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trumpetp1

LittleRusty · Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:35 pm Post subject:

Interesting. I’ve never seen those before. Are they the equivalent of training wheels?

I look forward to responses from people who know more.

yourbrass · Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:42 pm Post subject:

It looks like a factory job - really interesting. I just sold a Clarke cornet on ebay and they came in many configurations. C, HP Bb, LP Bb, A, you name it.
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trumpetp1 · Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:10 pm Post subject:

trumpetp1 · Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:45 am Post subject:

Anyone...??
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Crazy Finn · Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2019 10:20 am Post subject:

No idea. It's new to me.
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trumpetp1 · Posted: Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:55 pm Post subject:

Anyone have any thoughts regarding to whom I might refer this quandary to??

I'm not a complete newbie, having played for the past 26 years, but I've never come across finger buttons such as those pictured in my initial post of this thread.

Naturally, they pique my curiosity.
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trumpetp1

etc-etc · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 6187

These button baffles seem to enforce the idea of actuating the valves with the right hand only, unless they can be turned.

trumpetp1 · Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 12:13 pm Post subject:

Dayton · Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 12:46 pm Post subject:

It might be worth reaching out to Josh Landress to see if he's ever seen a finger button set-up like that. Good luck!

LittleRusty · Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 12:58 pm Post subject:

Perhaps this was done for someone who wanted to play the trumpet and could not control their fingers horizontal motion. Like someone who had a stroke.

I doubt someone like that would ever be able to play the flight of the bumblebee, but it might allow them to satisfy their desire to continue playing.

bean_counter · Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 5:54 pm Post subject:

I have seen them once before. I was a kid in the mid ‘70s, 8th or 9th grade. Maybe it was some other kid’s grandparents horn, maybe it was in the back of the band storeroom at the American Legion, I can’t recall. I just remember them because they were, well, odd.

I played the horn, they were just a distraction. At the time I thought maybe they were intended to prevent poor finger position? Can’t play on the flat of your fingers, overhanging the button.

Maybe they were just bling for market differentiation, like all the tuning and key change gizmos makers put on horns of the era.
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trumpetp1 · Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 8:03 am Post subject:

jhatpro · Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 1:03 pm Post subject:

I think it’s possible they were a modification to help a one-armed player like Wingy Manone have a more secure grip.

(Wingy lost an arm in an accident involving a streetcar. Joe Venturi used to send him one cuff link every Christmas.)
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Dennis78 · Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 3:47 pm Post subject:

It would definitely force finger tips only
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a few different ones

trumpetp1 · Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:24 am Post subject:

trumpetp1 · Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:26 am Post subject:

I have contacted the HoltonLoyalist.com website to see if they might have any information regarding these unusual finger buttons. There hasn't been any reply yet, but it is still early Monday morning. I'll certainly update this thread if they reply.
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Dennis78 · Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:42 am Post subject:

Holton loyalist has been down for years. Maybe look through all the catalogs available at saxophone.org Look under the museum heading I believe the find the Holton catalogs. There’s a lot of info there. Does your horn have a pinky ring? If not it seems holding with one hand would be very cumbersome
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a few different ones

trumpetp1 · Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:57 am Post subject:

interfx · Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2019 2:33 am Post subject:

https://www.holtonloyalist.com/

HoltonLoyalist.com is still up and running! Although the email is overrun with spam, so I usually just check here on TH when people have questions.

The finger button examples you shared were not from the factory - I've seen an example a few years ago on a stencil (student level) horn. I would guess they were added to teach a student to not let their fingers overlap the valve caps.

Hope that helps, send me a PM here on TH, if you have specific question....
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