• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

Mics & Recording


Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Comeback Players
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
50YrComeback
Regular Member


Joined: 05 Nov 2018
Posts: 70
Location: St. Louis

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:38 am    Post subject: Mics & Recording Reply with quote

Looking for affordable but decent quality starting set-up to do in home recording. Initially, I just plan to use to listen, critique & improve my playing but graduating to do some of the play along stuff for my own entertainment.

Even just doing some recording on my i-phone mic app, its amazing to me at the things you hear (some not so pleasant) that you just don't pick up on when you are playing.

An suggestions for budget of $500-$750.
_________________
GaryF
"I'm probably not as good as I used to think that I was"

50 year layoff
Giardenelli 812S (a/k/a Amati ATR-604HS)
CarolBrass CPT-1000 Mini Trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Richard A
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 661
Location: Rhode Island, USA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 9:32 am    Post subject: Recording yourself Reply with quote

I use a Zoom H6. The only downside is that it faithfully reproduced what I sound like.
_________________
Richard Ashmore
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
50YrComeback
Regular Member


Joined: 05 Nov 2018
Posts: 70
Location: St. Louis

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Recording yourself Reply with quote

Richard A wrote:
The only downside is that it faithfully reproduced what I sound like.




_________________
GaryF
"I'm probably not as good as I used to think that I was"

50 year layoff
Giardenelli 812S (a/k/a Amati ATR-604HS)
CarolBrass CPT-1000 Mini Trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Kumara999
New Member


Joined: 11 Mar 2019
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:49 am    Post subject: Recording Reply with quote

I also use a zoom H6 - great sound, easy to use controls. Would also recommend.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
etc-etc
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 5557

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sony PCM-D10 (just about to be released). A pair of built-in condensers in stereo XY configuration and can be connected directly to XLR microphone of your choice. Looks like PCM-D50 with XLR option built-in.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dfcoleman
Regular Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2015
Posts: 60
Location: Xenia, OH

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:15 am    Post subject: ZoomH6 Reply with quote

Plus 1 on the Zoom H6.

Convenient and flexible, can plug in 4 mics, phantom power, comes with an xy pair, small form factor. Price is quite reasonable. Sounds great.
_________________
Dave
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TrentAustin
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 06 Nov 2002
Posts: 5443
Location: KC MO

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The H6 is a fantastic unit and worth every penny!

-T
_________________
http://austincustombrass.com
http://trentaustinmusic.com
http://instagram.com/austincustombrass
Taking a forum break email me to chat anytime (info@austincustombrass.com)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
50YrComeback
Regular Member


Joined: 05 Nov 2018
Posts: 70
Location: St. Louis

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:11 am    Post subject: H6 Reply with quote

Novice Here - What else do I need? - At this point, I have nothing except a trumpet and a set of lips. I see some bundled kits, etc. What kind of Microphone? Again, wanting to do some recording for quality playback and then add some CD's to play along, recording and playback.


Thx
_________________
GaryF
"I'm probably not as good as I used to think that I was"

50 year layoff
Giardenelli 812S (a/k/a Amati ATR-604HS)
CarolBrass CPT-1000 Mini Trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Richard A
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 661
Location: Rhode Island, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:37 am    Post subject: Re: H6 Reply with quote

50YrComeback wrote:
Novice Here - What else do I need? - At this point, I have nothing except a trumpet and a set of lips. I see some bundled kits, etc. What kind of Microphone? Again, wanting to do some recording for quality playback and then add some CD's to play along, recording and playback.


Thx

The Zoom H6 comes with two stereo microphones. You’ll want a mic stand and, when you want to play along and overdub, headphones.
_________________
Richard Ashmore
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Richard A
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 661
Location: Rhode Island, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:51 am    Post subject: Re: H6 Reply with quote

deleted duplicate post
_________________
Richard Ashmore


Last edited by Richard A on Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
etc-etc
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 5557

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want to get the best sound possible, you will have to go through an array of microphones, preamps and mic/room configurations. There is no shortcut. Only you know what sound you want.

If you want to hear yourself as if on stage, get a Shure SM57 with the optional sponge foam windscreen, to protect the bell:

tom turner wrote:
Hi John,

I once managed a music store, and my Shure rep confirmed my suspicions, both mics are identical except for the windscreens.

As you know, the 58 has a big metal grill ball, and the 57 a sort of squared off end.

When I used 'em for my horn, I much prefered the 57 WITH the optional Shure foam windscreen for the 57.

Using a 57 w/ foam windscreen will REALLY protect the bell on your Callet Jazz.


TWO OTHER RECOMENDATIONS:

1. If you love the 57/58 sound, try a Beyer 500C ribbon mic. It has virtually the same sound as the 57/58, yet much smoother and warmer. They are wonderful mics, albiet more fragile due to the ribbon.

2. If you want a very pure sound that's very natural and realistic, try an Audio-Technica ATM-33a (or the earlier generation ATM-11). After having quite a few mics (including all those mentioned above), I discovered the ATM-11 waaaay back in the early 80's. The design is so good that it is still going strong as the model 33a!

I use 'em for close mic'ing trumpet AND for distant mic'ing of ensembles. I've never, ever had a moment's problem out of either of mine and the frequency response curve is "flat," as it should be for mics used to pick up instruments.

I'll be using one tomorrow night, as a matter of fact.

You can sometimes find ATM-11 and ATM-11a (the phantom-powered one that's otherwise the same) mics on e-bay and they typically go for less than most harmon mutes!

If you get a chance up there in NYC, contact a few studios and see if someone will let you try one. They don't cost an arm or a leg . . . and you'll sound great!!!

Sincerely,

Tom
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mpsjazz
New Member


Joined: 30 Apr 2019
Posts: 7
Location: Costa Blanca, Spain

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 6:26 am    Post subject: Re: Recording yourself Reply with quote

Richard A wrote:
I use a Zoom H6. The only downside is that it faithfully reproduced what I sound like.


I don't quite agree. I don't believe any recorder or microphone is all that true to the original, and it will only record within its special field of capture. When we play, our ears make allowances for the acoustics of the room and we adjust our playing to it. We visualise a complete picture, which is really like a jigsaw puzzle. If for some reason, those acoustics are not captured or the mic hears them differently, then only a part of the jigsaw puzzle is made, thus our sound seems incomplete and possibly distasteful. In a very dry studio there are no acoustics, so maybe then we know what we should produce for ourselves and for the microphone, and the "true" sound is captured this way.

But we train to perform not just to record, so in a way, the acoustics of a venue are really a part of our instruments' natural sound, even though they are fickle and may be better or worse, and sometimes leave us unable to adjust. What we need to do is stop blaming our playing and get smarter at using compensating technology, because the venue acoustics are getting worse for us, that is unless you're lucky enough to play in the best concert halls all the time.

There is another factor. Our "ears" compensate for missing sounds, imagining what it is meant to be, with just one exception, and that is when we are listening to ourselves. We do not hear ourselves as others do, not even on recordings. So take heart! When I hear a "bad" recording of myself (which is nearly always IMO) I try to learn from it, but I remind myself too that (in effect) I'm really better than that. Think of all the actors who can't bear to watch their own performances. They can see through themselves in a way that the public can't. But it's not fair on them really, beause they may be great actors.

The H6 seems to be a great audio recorder. If you are clever with your deployment of it, you should get some pleasing results, so long as you can be a bit understanding/forgiving with yourself.
_________________
Brass musician & pianist. Main horns: Bach Strad ML37 tpt with 3c & Yamaha long model cornet with 3c. Fun horns: 1926 Conn Victor with A-change system & 1926 King tenor/baritone horn, forward-facing. Tubas: Eb Besson & Eb Hawkes.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
mpsjazz
New Member


Joined: 30 Apr 2019
Posts: 7
Location: Costa Blanca, Spain

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am looking for some new mics, now that I've decided to be more assertive with the technology and not be defeated by third-rate acoustics and recordings. I don't have much to spend right now (gotta buy a video-audio camera too) so maybe I'll start with a trumpet mic worth around €150.

I'm considering getting a Sennheiser E602 II or a Shure 57A Beta or a Heil PR2OUT. Any opinions about these mics, or others? Must I spend more, so as not to be disappointed. Currently I'm using my vocal mic which is a Sennheiser e845S.

Answers much appreciated.
_________________
Brass musician & pianist. Main horns: Bach Strad ML37 tpt with 3c & Yamaha long model cornet with 3c. Fun horns: 1926 Conn Victor with A-change system & 1926 King tenor/baritone horn, forward-facing. Tubas: Eb Besson & Eb Hawkes.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Richard A
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 661
Location: Rhode Island, USA

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 7:11 am    Post subject: Recording Yourself Reply with quote

mpsjazz wrote:
I am looking for some new mics, now that I've decided to be more assertive with the technology and not be defeated by third-rate acoustics and recordings. I don't have much to spend right now (gotta buy a video-audio camera too) so maybe I'll start with a trumpet mic worth around €150.

I'm considering getting a Sennheiser E602 II or a Shure 57A Beta or a Heil PR2OUT. Any opinions about these mics, or others? Must I spend more, so as not to be disappointed. Currently I'm using my vocal mic which is a Sennheiser e845S.

Answers much appreciated.


I have gotten good results using the MXL 990/991 with a Presonus interface. Another option is the Zoom Q8- it’s basically a Zoom H5 with a camcorder grafted on. It also has two XLR inputs and will provide phantom power.
_________________
Richard Ashmore
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
aTrumpetdude
Regular Member


Joined: 20 Jun 2016
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For home recording I use a budget ribbon mic APEX 210. To my ears it records a more natural trumpet sound than the budget condenser mics I used previously.
_________________
2012 Shires Bb
90's Bach Strad MLV 65GH
1926 Conn 2b
1950 Bach Strad 38
1969 Conn 8b Artist
1980 238 CL
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCm1qCev_sfof-Bfj5MAMLrQ
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kalijah
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 2495
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 8:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
For home recording I use a budget ribbon mic APEX 210. To my ears it records a more natural trumpet sound than the budget condenser mics I used previously.


This. These Apex ribbons have good sound for the price but the quality of the pre-amp matters. I replaced the stock transformer with a Lundahl transformer. I was surprised at the improvement in sound.
_________________
Darryl Jones

Callicchio 1s2
Benge 3x+ (Burbank)
Yamaha YHF631 Flugelhorn
MP: stock Marcinkiewicz 5, 9
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
yipDog
New Member


Joined: 04 May 2019
Posts: 8
Location: Arizona

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 4:30 pm    Post subject: Mics Reply with quote

I have been a recording engineer for almost 29 years. (Went that path rather than performer)
Now that I picked up trumpet again I wanted a decent mic. I ended up with a Golden Age Projects R1 Tube Ribbon mic. I run it to a Focusrite Scarlet 2i2
All in it’s about $500 in gear and works on my laptop or desktop with a variety of software.
The biggest reason I recommend the R1 tube mic is the sound. Thick! And still has all the details. No mud. It also has ridiculous side rejection meaning even in less than perfect acoustic environments it sounds great!
I am posting this link with the caveat that I had started playing about 6 weeks before this after a 25 year hiatus from trumpet. Be kind but listen to the sound. All I did was add some reverb. Rest is the mic! And yes, I am aware there is a sync issue as I fixed a portion of audio without fixing the video. My lips only had so many takes in them!🤣
https://vimeo.com/306055799
_________________
The older I get the better I was.
1985 Bach 37
1956 Getzen Superdeluxe
2019 Bach C190SL229 C
Jean Baptiste Flugel with copper bell
Schiller rotary Bb/A piccolo
Getzen Superdeluxe valve trombone
No name rotary Bb trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
mrhappy
Veteran Member


Joined: 03 Dec 2018
Posts: 305
Location: Port Jackson, NY

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice job yipDog!
_________________
MH
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
etc-etc
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 5557

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Mics Reply with quote

yipDog wrote:
I have been a recording engineer for almost 29 years. (Went that path rather than performer)
Now that I picked up trumpet again I wanted a decent mic. I ended up with a Golden Age Projects R1 Tube Ribbon mic. I run it to a Focusrite Scarlet 2i2
All in it’s about $500 in gear and works on my laptop or desktop with a variety of software.
The biggest reason I recommend the R1 tube mic is the sound. Thick! And still has all the details. No mud. It also has ridiculous side rejection meaning even in less than perfect acoustic environments it sounds great!
I am posting this link with the caveat that I had started playing about 6 weeks before this after a 25 year hiatus from trumpet. Be kind but listen to the sound. All I did was add some reverb. Rest is the mic! And yes, I am aware there is a sync issue as I fixed a portion of audio without fixing the video. My lips only had so many takes in them!🤣
https://vimeo.com/306055799


WELL done!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mm55
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 01 Jul 2013
Posts: 1259

PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 4:22 am    Post subject: Re: Mics Reply with quote

yipDog wrote:
It also has ridiculous side rejection meaning even in less than perfect acoustic environments it sounds great!


But the side facing away from your trumpet has no rejection at all. That could be a problem in less-than-perfect acoustic environments.

Neither the excellent side rejection nor the completely absent back rejection is "ridiculous". It's an ordinary ribbon-mic "figure 8" polar pattern, like pretty much any ribbon. Which means it picks up sound from the back just as well as it does from the front.
_________________
'75 Bach Strad 180ML/37
'79 King Silver Flair
'07 Flip Oakes Wild Thing
'42 Selmer US
'90 Yamaha YTR6450S(C)
'10 Carol CPT-300LR pkt
'89 Yamaha YCR2330S crnt
'89 Rudy Mck Conductor crnt
'13 CarolBrass CFL-6200-GSS-BG flg
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Comeback Players All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group