• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

B.A.C. company and Martin Committees


Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Horns
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Bogey Factory
Regular Member


Joined: 09 Jan 2019
Posts: 56
Location: Springfield, MO

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The new BAC Benge bell stamp/logo looks really cool.
_________________
Justin Shaw
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
OldSchoolEuph
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 2426

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bogey Factory wrote:
The new BAC Benge bell stamp/logo looks really cool.


I was just texted a couple pics from NAMM. Wow, the Martin bell is an amazing match to the historic Martin patterns (even if not cut as deep and thus being less disruptive to the bell's characteristics - which Martin often messed with by overdoing it on the art). The Benge bell is clearly a hand-done mock-up (I have been assured production will be refined and standardized) but they are perfectly matching the historic Benge bell crest - down to the font!

Please tell me they sound as good as they look!
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
EdMann
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 31 Mar 2007
Posts: 2481
Location: The Big Valley

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just back from NAMM and spent a great amount of time with this horn in the presence of Charles Hargett and others at BAC. I've owned three Committees over the years, all medium bores, but have played a large selection of large bores. This is essentially a dual large bore horn, chokes at the top of the leadpipe at 462, I believe, and .468 the rest of the way... someone should confirm that; in the Fog of Horns, I may have lost details. None of the nickel highlights that I feel make the old Martins too bright. Yellow brass all the way.

Beautiful in every respect. Great scale, easy to blow-- and I'm not a fan of larger bores. I got upstairs with great ease, and the sound was something to behold. It certainly rivals the best of the Committees I've played. And yes, the engraving is spectacular and nearly identical to the iconic work on the "40s and '50s Deluxe models.

ed
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Drklobz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 29 Dec 2005
Posts: 526
Location: Denver, CO

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We must have passed each other multiple times over the last few days Ed - If you're coming Saturday stop by the Denis Wick booth and say hi!

I had a great experience with both the Benge and Committee made by BAC. Beautiful sound on both, comfortable to play, and excellent craftsmanship. That's the order of what I find important in a horn and these had them.

Some excellent stuff around various manufacturers.
_________________
Improvisation Masterclass info: https://bit.ly/2U6im2V
My band's latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duYv018mrxs
All other info on me is at http://jasonklobnak.com or http://jazztargeting.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
adagiotrumpet
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 901

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spent the last two days at NAMM. There were several standout horns. Among them were the BAC Martin Committee and the BAC Benges. I currently own a vintage Martin Committee #3 and after playing the BAC Martin Committee, which was a .468 large bore, I would have to say that this is the closest of any of the Martin copies in sound to the original Committee. Playability was also quite similar.

As far as the Benges were concerned, one was patterned after the Chicago Benge, and even though it was a .464 bore, (the 3X+ I believe came about during the Burbank period), it was a knockout. It played great and sounded great. the other Benge in the booth was patterned after the Burbank Benges and it, too, was a .464. Also a great horn but personally, I preferred the Chicago version.

Keep an eye on these horns. BAC is really on to something.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kehaulani
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 8964
Location: Hawai`i - Texas

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adagio, you wrote that the BAC Committee sounded very close to the original Martin Committees but how was the playability and intonation? Improved or no difference?

And I'm just a little confused. Is this Committee the same as the one made by the new Martin? https://www.martinbrasswind.com/ or is the BAC different and is it also called Committee or something else?

Thanks. K--
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Getzen Capri Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
OldSchoolEuph
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 2426

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although nothing regarding the relationship is posted to either website for some reason, the bell of the Committee displayed by BAC at NAMM was engraved "The Martin Brasswind Committee" - so the secret is out.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
adagiotrumpet
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 901

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kehaulani wrote:
Adagio, you wrote that the BAC Committee sounded very close to the original Martin Committees but how was the playability and intonation? Improved or no difference?

And I'm just a little confused. Is this Committee the same as the one made by the new Martin? https://www.martinbrasswind.com/ or is the BAC different and is it also called Committee or something else?

Thanks. K--


As far as the blow, it is different from the original, not any better, not any worse. After a Dr. Valve precision valve alignment, the intonation on my original Committee is really good. The BAC Committee is at least as good.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kehaulani
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 8964
Location: Hawai`i - Texas

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks guys.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Getzen Capri Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Liberty Lips
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 972

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The committee that B.A.C. showed at NAMM was made for the new Martin Brasswinds company. I was told that Martin requested a first valve throw ring, which is the biggest difference visually from the original Martins. If B.A.C. makes a version to sell as their own model, as Kanstul did when they made committees for Martin, they might exclude the first valve throw.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yamahaguy
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 3992

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

adagiotrumpet wrote:
As far as the Benges were concerned, one was patterned after the Chicago Benge, and even though it was a .464 bore, (the 3X+ I believe came about during the Burbank period), it was a knockout. It played great and sounded great. the other Benge in the booth was patterned after the Burbank Benges and it, too, was a .464. Also a great horn but personally, I preferred the Chicago version.
Thanks for the update, very exciting! What were the specific differences
in the Chicago and Burbank versions? Style, weight, or design maybe?
Thanks so much...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
theslawdawg
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 843
Location: Waikiki, Hawaii

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

adagiotrumpet wrote:
kehaulani wrote:
Adagio, you wrote that the BAC Committee sounded very close to the original Martin Committees but how was the playability and intonation? Improved or no difference?

And I'm just a little confused. Is this Committee the same as the one made by the new Martin? https://www.martinbrasswind.com/ or is the BAC different and is it also called Committee or something else?

Thanks. K--


As far as the blow, it is different from the original, not any better, not any worse. After a Dr. Valve precision valve alignment, the intonation on my original Committee is really good. The BAC Committee is at least as good.


Thank you for this update.

Do you know if there is a wait time when you order?
_________________
My go-to Trumpet and Flugel: Thane.
Greg Black MPs
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Drklobz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 29 Dec 2005
Posts: 526
Location: Denver, CO

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[/quote]Thanks for the update, very exciting! What were the specific differences
in the Chicago and Burbank versions? Style, weight, or design maybe?
Thanks so much...[/quote]

The only difference between the two BAC Benge was a different lead pipe, otherwise they were the exact same. I forgot what they said and, of course, didn't write it down.

I have a video demo of the Martin Committee that I was going to do. I was getting ready when Rashawn Ross came up to play it, so I got a video of him. I'll post it when I get chance.
_________________
Improvisation Masterclass info: https://bit.ly/2U6im2V
My band's latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duYv018mrxs
All other info on me is at http://jasonklobnak.com or http://jazztargeting.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Speed
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 May 2015
Posts: 295
Location: Mississippi

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

adagiotrumpet wrote:
kehaulani wrote:
Adagio, you wrote that the BAC Committee sounded very close to the original Martin Committees but how was the playability and intonation? Improved or no difference?

And I'm just a little confused. Is this Committee the same as the one made by the new Martin? https://www.martinbrasswind.com/ or is the BAC different and is it also called Committee or something else?

Thanks. K--


As far as the blow, it is different from the original, not any better, not any worse. After a Dr. Valve precision valve alignment, the intonation on my original Committee is really good. The BAC Committee is at least as good.


You mentioned the blow was different. Is the blow of the BAC more open, or less open, than the original Martins?

Thanks,
Marc Speed
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
OldSchoolEuph
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 2426

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theslawdawg wrote:
Do you know if there is a wait time when you order?


You can order through the "Buy Now" links at www.martinbrasswind.com . I don't know if Mr. Martin is carrying any inventory, but there was a rumor out of Kanstul that he did not, so I imagine that between that and the newness of the horn, you will be waiting while it is built.

Let's also keep in mind that they only started designing the horn in August as they were installing the machinery that arrived in June into a space reconstructed in July! Were it not for the incredible experience and knowledge of the people (who's names you haven't heard) behind these BAC horns, there is no way this would have been possible in January.

I don't know if BAC Music Center will become a dealer for Martin Brasswind, but it would not surprise me. They are a dealer for the rest of the BAC Musical Instruments line-up, and the logistics would certainly be easy.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
OldSchoolEuph
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 2426

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing I find most remarkable is the incredible marketing draw of the Martin name. This horn could stand on its own easily, but the affiliation of a Martin family member is going to do wonders for drawing attention to it.

This is surprising because the Martin family has been in the instrument business sporadically for 148 years, but only 54 of those years operating as "makers". Even counting the 35 years that members of the first and second generation worked for Detroit, Conn & Buescher as craftsmen, it is still only 60% of the 148 year window. The Martins were essentially out of the loop from 1922 to 2017 (while the Imperials, Committees, Deluxe and Magna were designed and produced) but the Martin name eclipses BAC in an instant as far as recognition and subliminal associations.

Makes you wonder what other great horns there are out there that we don't know about because the name didn't capture anyone's attention. . . .

This lesson was not lost on BAC, as evidenced by the clever acquisition of the Benge trademark.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Yamahaguy
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 3992

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drklobz wrote:
The only difference between the two BAC Benge was a different lead pipe, otherwise they were the exact same. I forgot what they said and, of course, didn't write it down.
Aha! That would make sense, as the early Chicagos were copies of Bessons and would likely have that pipe. I've read the Burbanks began offering the different bells but not sure about leadpipes.
The LA 4x and 5x had the same bell but different pipes, the 4x having the Besson pipe.
Thanks for the info!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
OldSchoolEuph
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 2426

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yamahaguy wrote:
Drklobz wrote:
The only difference between the two BAC Benge was a different lead pipe, otherwise they were the exact same. I forgot what they said and, of course, didn't write it down.
Aha! That would make sense, as the early Chicagos were copies of Bessons and would likely have that pipe. I've read the Burbanks began offering the different bells but not sure about leadpipes.
The LA 4x and 5x had the same bell but different pipes, the 4x having the Besson pipe.
Thanks for the info!


It is not quite that simple. BAC has a mind-blowing number of leadpipes available to them, mostly Byron Autrey's work but including Besson clones from the Olds Custom project, that they obtained from Kanstul and from the Autrey estate. Benge saw his mission as continuing and building on the work of Besson, and Byron was committed to continuing Benge's work. So they are all Besson and Benge pipes to an extent, and yet more advanced - it's a continuum.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Drklobz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 29 Dec 2005
Posts: 526
Location: Denver, CO

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BAC has a wide range of lead pipe options, that's true. The only difference between the two horns at NAMM, though, were a different lead pipe. I just forgot which lead pipes they were.

But, for those interested: Here's a short video overview of my trip to NAMM this year and there's about a minute clip of Rashawn Ross trying out the new BAC made Martin Committee.

I was about to make a video of myself playing it and do a quick review when Rashawn walked over and said he wanted to try it. I figured more people would be interested in his thoughts over mine. (He tried the Benge's too, but preferred the Committee)


Link

_________________
Improvisation Masterclass info: https://bit.ly/2U6im2V
My band's latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duYv018mrxs
All other info on me is at http://jasonklobnak.com or http://jazztargeting.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Liberty Lips
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 972

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that we should all celebrate the fact that new Martin Committees and new Benge 3x+ trumpets are now available, and that they are authentic and extremely well crafted by B.A.C. The Benge prototypes that were on display had the shorter throw valves, similar to the Kanstul 1001, which means that the fifth partial is now in tune. Other than that, this is the 3x that we know and love.

I’m hoping that in the future B.A.C. will be able to offer the full line of Benge trumpets, including the 3x, 4x, 5x and 6x models. I believe that their version of the Olds Recording will be available as well. Truly exciting things are happening at B.A.C.


Last edited by Liberty Lips on Sat Jan 25, 2020 2:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Horns All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Page 2 of 5

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group