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sounds7
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 Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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BAC makes their own valve clusters. Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. I haven't played it but I was quite impressed with the B.A.C. horns they had at the JEN conference in New Orleans.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 8:07 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Liberty Lips"] | stephan wrote: | | The valve cluster looks different (less like the original) and there is a first valve thumb throw (also less like the original), but otherwise it looks a lot like the Kanstul. |
Does this mean that, with the new Committee, you need to use these slides for low D and Db? One of the advantages of the original Committees was, for me, that you didn't have to use these slides. Thanks.
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Adam R. Getzen
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| sounds7 wrote: | | Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. |
This is false.
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OldSchoolEuph
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Adam R. Getzen wrote: | | sounds7 wrote: | | Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. |
This is false. |
I cannot dispute that, but please elaborate as to the degree to which you are disputing the "made in America" status of the Martin Brasswind Committee. There are, to my knowledge, no horns that, down to the level of set screws, felt stock, epoxy, etc. can be deemed completely made in a single country.
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Adam R. Getzen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2013
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Location: Elkhorn, WI.
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| OldSchoolEuph wrote: | | Adam R. Getzen wrote: | | sounds7 wrote: | | Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. |
This is false. |
I cannot dispute that, but please elaborate as to the degree to which you are disputing the "made in America" status of the Martin Brasswind Committee. There are, to my knowledge, no horns that, down to the level of set screws, felt stock, epoxy, etc. can be deemed completely made in a single country. |
He didn’t say the committees, he said everything. I don’t expect every component of every horn to be made in the US but none of the apprentice models are made in the US as per BAC’s own website.
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Adam R. Getzen
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Adam R. Getzen
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Location: Elkhorn, WI.
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Adam R. Getzen wrote: | | OldSchoolEuph wrote: | | Adam R. Getzen wrote: | | sounds7 wrote: | | Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. |
This is false. |
I cannot dispute that, but please elaborate as to the degree to which you are disputing the "made in America" status of the Martin Brasswind Committee. There are, to my knowledge, no horns that, down to the level of set screws, felt stock, epoxy, etc. can be deemed completely made in a single country. |
He didn’t say the committees, he said everything. I don’t expect every component of every horn to be made in the US but none of the apprentice models are made in the US as per BAC’s own website. |
After reading his post again it is obvious he meant the Committee.
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Weiton Andinger
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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sooo has anyone seen they actually making the valve blocks or
with this all american made saying
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theslawdawg
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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At almost 5k....I need to try one.
That's a lot of dough when you can find a vintage one for much less.
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TrptSTP
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Weiton Andinger wrote: | sooo has anyone seen they actually making the valve blocks or
with this all american made saying |
I have only seen one in their original shop. They have made one at least. Any more than that is a guess. These horns are a lot of money for the moving parts to not be scratch-made or to be produced by a highly-esteemed company. |
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LittleRusty
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Weiton Andinger wrote: | | sooo has anyone seen they actually making the valve blocks or with this all american made saying |
Nope. No one. Not a single detail a few posts above. 
| sounds7 wrote: | | BAC makes their own valve clusters. Everything is in house and like the original committee 100% American made. |
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JetJaguar
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| Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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I'm curious about whether BAC is doing this out of organic earnings or if investors are backing these new ventures. Those aren't the only two options, of course.
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adagiotrumpet
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| Posted: Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| Liberty Lips wrote: | I think that we should all celebrate the fact that new Martin Committees and new Benge 3x+ trumpets are now available, and that they are authentic and extremely well crafted by B.A.C. The Benge prototypes that were on display had the shorter throw valves, similar to the Kanstul 1001, which means that the sixth partial is now in tune. Other than that, this is the 3x that we know and love.
I’m hoping that in the future B.A.C. will be able to offer the full line of Benge trumpets, including the 3x, 4x, 5x and 6x models. I believe that their version of the Olds Recording will be available as well. Truly exciting things are happening at B.A.C. |
After spending as much time as I did at the BAC booth and playing the new Martin Committee and Benges, I would have to agree that they guys are really on to something special and I really look forward to their future endeavors. I would also like to see them eventually include the Benge 2X and/or 2X+ in their line up. |
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Liberty Lips
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| Posted: Sat Jan 25, 2020 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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| JetJaguar wrote: | | I'm curious about whether BAC is doing this out of organic earnings or if investors are backing these new ventures. Those aren't the only two options, of course. |
I suspect that they're going into debt to do this. Hopefully, however, they have some venture capital funding. It seems unlikely that they can do this kind of expansion with just the earnings from their repair business. |
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Yamahaguy
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Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| theslawdawg wrote: | At almost 5k....I need to try one.
That's a lot of dough when you can find a vintage one for much less. |
Yowza! Is that for both the Committee and Benge models?
Good thing they can provide replacement parts for some of the vintage originals! |
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TrumpetMD
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Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Yamahaguy wrote: | | theslawdawg wrote: | At almost 5k....I need to try one.
That's a lot of dough when you can find a vintage one for much less. |
Yowza! Is that for both the Committee and Benge models?
Good thing they can provide replacement parts for some of the vintage originals! |
Yes, that is a lot. I am happy for BAC, and wish them the best. And next time I have a horn that needs custom work, I'll consider them.
Many people have tried to reproduce the Committee. Even Leblanc tried to, back in 2005, when they owned the brand ... https://web.archive.org/web/20051027073714/http://www.gleblanc.com/bell/winter04/creating.cfm
But for me, these are "copies", not "reproductions". Whatever the Committee was (or wasn't), it will never be reproduced. You can make something like it, but I doubt you can ever recreate it.
Regarding BAC's entry (taking over from Kanstul), the difference is that the Martin family is lending its name. Maybe that's why the price is close to 5k, since they have to be compensated. It isn't clear that the family is offering anything else, other than the implication that offering their name makes this trumpet closer to the original.
Mike
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Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns.
Last edited by TrumpetMD on Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:08 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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shofarguy
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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It makes no sense to me that a company like BAC would "go into debt" to buy the remnants of a factory stocked with old, out of date machinery, then buy a brand name from a large conglomerate in order to produce a horn line that almost no one is really interested in buying new. The prospect of actually being able to make payments on a loan is nil. We all understand that Kanstul struggled for almost two decades to generate enough volume to stay afloat and failed along the way.
Far more likely is that there is an investor, or a group of investors, behind the project with passion in as great a measure as the money they are spending. I hope they are able to make good on their dream.
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adagiotrumpet
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| TrumpetMD wrote: | | Yamahaguy wrote: | | theslawdawg wrote: | At almost 5k....I need to try one.
That's a lot of dough when you can find a vintage one for much less. |
Yowza! Is that for both the Committee and Benge models?
Good thing they can provide replacement parts for some of the vintage originals! |
Yes, that is a lot. I am happy for BAC, and wish them the best. And next time I have a horn that needs custom work, I'll consider them.
Many people have tried to reproduce the Committee. Even Leblanc tried to, back in 2005, when they owned the brand ... https://web.archive.org/web/20051027073714/http://www.gleblanc.com/bell/winter04/creating.cfm
But for me, these are "copies", not "reproductions". Whatever the Committee was (or wasn't), it will never be reproduced. You can make something like it, but I doubt you can ever recreate it.
Regarding BAC's entry (taking over from Kanstul), the difference is that the Martin family is lending its name. Maybe that's why the price is close to 5k, since they have to be compensated. It isn't clear that the family is offering anything else, other than the implication that offering their name makes this trumpet closer to the original.
Mike |
"These are/are not copies." "These are/are not reproductions." I feel like I am in the middle of TrumpetHerald's version of the movie Chinatown where Faye Dunaway exclaims: "She's my sister, she's my daughter."
I don't know if the Committee or the Benges are copies or reproductions and I don't care. I own a large bore vintage Committee and the BAC version reminds me a lot of my horn. And the BAC Committee a great horn in its own right. The same goes for the Benges. They remind me of the Benges I currently own or have owned in the past and are also great horns in their own right.
Are they expensive? Yes, but so are a half dozen or more other makes. So what. I would gladly play these BAC horns, especially the Committee and the Chicago Benge, as opposed to any number of extremely expensive boat anchors that are also available. And for the record, I do not own a BAC horn nor am I in any way affiliated with them.
As I said before, as far as whether or not these are copies or reproductions, I really don't know and I really don't care. I guess there will always be the nitpickers here on the forum that will continue to argue about the authenticity or legitimacy of certain horns. So for those of you who it seems have a little too much time on your hands, while you battle it out over whether these new horns from BAC are copies or reproductions, I might suggest that you also debate with each other as to whether these horns should be considered "continuation horns". That should keep you busy for a while. |
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theslawdawg
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 843
Location: Waikiki, Hawaii
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| adagiotrumpet wrote: | | TrumpetMD wrote: | | Yamahaguy wrote: | | theslawdawg wrote: | At almost 5k....I need to try one.
That's a lot of dough when you can find a vintage one for much less. |
Yowza! Is that for both the Committee and Benge models?
Good thing they can provide replacement parts for some of the vintage originals! |
Yes, that is a lot. I am happy for BAC, and wish them the best. And next time I have a horn that needs custom work, I'll consider them.
Many people have tried to reproduce the Committee. Even Leblanc tried to, back in 2005, when they owned the brand ... https://web.archive.org/web/20051027073714/http://www.gleblanc.com/bell/winter04/creating.cfm
But for me, these are "copies", not "reproductions". Whatever the Committee was (or wasn't), it will never be reproduced. You can make something like it, but I doubt you can ever recreate it.
Regarding BAC's entry (taking over from Kanstul), the difference is that the Martin family is lending its name. Maybe that's why the price is close to 5k, since they have to be compensated. It isn't clear that the family is offering anything else, other than the implication that offering their name makes this trumpet closer to the original.
Mike |
"These are/are not copies." "These are/are not reproductions." I feel like I am in the middle of TrumpetHerald's version of the movie Chinatown where Faye Dunaway exclaims: "She's my sister, she's my daughter."
I don't know if the Committee or the Benges are copies or reproductions and I don't care. I own a large bore vintage Committee and the BAC version reminds me a lot of my horn. And the BAC Committee a great horn in its own right. The same goes for the Benges. They remind me of the Benges I currently own or have owned in the past and are also great horns in their own right.
Are they expensive? Yes, but so are a half dozen or more other makes. So what. I would gladly play these BAC horns, especially the Committee and the Chicago Benge, as opposed to any number of extremely expensive boat anchors that are also available. And for the record, I do not own a BAC horn nor am I in any way affiliated with them.
As I said before, as far as whether or not these are copies or reproductions, I really don't know and I really don't care. I guess there will always be the nitpickers here on the forum that will continue to argue about the authenticity or legitimacy of certain horns. So for those of you who it seems have a little too much time on your hands, while you battle it out over whether these new horns from BAC are copies or reproductions, I might suggest that you also debate with each other as to whether these horns should be considered "continuation horns". That should keep you busy for a while. |
Appreciate your comments. I am in sticker shock, but that has never stopped me from spending my money. I do like the fact it's in collab with the Martin family, and also dig the fact it's really the next generation of Committee.
My only concern, which is starting to go away, is how it plays compared to the originals, and if it might even be an improvement. Something I will try to look more into.
In comparison, as a guitar player, a Fender strat, and/or Gibson Les Paul has a set standard. If another company took the name and decided to make them, and slap a large price-tag on them, I would like to know what I'm getting compared to the real thing.
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TrumpetMD
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Oct 2008
Posts: 2412
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| adagiotrumpet wrote: | | As I said before, as far as whether or not these are copies or reproductions, I really don't know and I really don't care. I guess there will always be the nitpickers here on the forum that will continue to argue about the authenticity or legitimacy of certain horns. So for those of you who it seems have a little too much time on your hands, while you battle it out over whether these new horns from BAC are copies or reproductions, I might suggest that you also debate with each other as to whether these horns should be considered "continuation horns". That should keep you busy for a while. |
Sounds like I struck a nerve, adagiotrumpet. That wasn't my intention. I was just adding my observation to the conversation. No one is "nitpicking", or "arguing", or "battling".
Now, to figure out what to do with all this free "time on my hands".
Mike
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Bach Stradivarius 43* Trumpet (1974), Bach 6C Mouthpiece.
Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns. |
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LittleRusty
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 12658
Location: Gardena, Ca
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| Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| TrumpetMD wrote: | Now, to figure out what to do with all this free "time on my hands".
Mike |
Physician, heal thyself!
(Joke: just suggesting what to do with the free time on your hands, not commenting on your posts.) |
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