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bm New Member
Joined: 15 Oct 2019 Posts: 4
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 1:28 am Post subject: Score Reading |
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Hi All ...
Here is my problem: counting bars and getting to know the band music so that I come in on time. My guess is that getting hold of recordings of pieces and the scores would help. But are there any books or courses that would enable me to learn to read a score efficiently?
I have in mind that orchestral scores occasionally have lead in notes for horn, violin or timpani so reading a score would enable a player to choose his/her own lead instrument. Also, I am mindful of the notion that jazz musicians have that 'if you have to count then you are lost' ... and too frequently I am just that.
Hope someone can assist. |
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JGulyas Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Apr 2002 Posts: 726 Location: Roanoke, VA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:09 am Post subject: Re: Score Reading |
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bm wrote: | Hi All ...
Here is my problem: counting bars and getting to know the band music so that I come in on time. My guess is that getting hold of recordings of pieces and the scores would help. But are there any books or courses that would enable me to learn to read a score efficiently?
I have in mind that orchestral scores occasionally have lead in notes for horn, violin or timpani so reading a score would enable a player to choose his/her own lead instrument. Also, I am mindful of the notion that jazz musicians have that 'if you have to count then you are lost' ... and too frequently I am just that.
Hope someone can assist. |
I've always marked cues in my part regarding other instruments and when they come in. For example, if you're sitting in an orchestra and playing the 3rd chair part, you're going to have LOTS of time to rest, just play a quarter note, and then rest the remainder of the movement.
Instead of trying to count umpteen million bars of rests, pay attention to what other sections are doing while you're counting, make a note of that section entrance after how many bars, then continue counting until the next section entrance. Yes, you're going to have to count those umpteen million bars first, but once you mark your sections, you won't have to count again.
As far as score reading, condensed scores are pretty good for that... _________________ All the Best,
John
US Navy Bandsman 1996-2010 (Trumpet; Audio Engineer)
Mpc - Kanstul/Monette B6, Hammond Design custom "JG"
Bb - Yamaha 6335HGSII
C - Eastman ETR530
Picc - NoName Chinese |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8910 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:38 am Post subject: |
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You're not alone. Counting is a skill that must be developed. Some pieces are easy with rests being divided into easily identified phrases. Other pieces are much harder with the rests having no discernable relation to the phrases. While you're learning I'd recommend penciling in as many notes as you need to help keep your place. When the ensemble takes a break it's reasonable to check out other player's parts or the conductor's score to tease out tricky parts. This doesn't require any particular skill. Just look for any part that stands out and mark it in your part. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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bm New Member
Joined: 15 Oct 2019 Posts: 4
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:55 am Post subject: |
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Hi John and Charles ...
Many thanks for the words of advice. I will try making notes and take a peek at the conductors score at some point.
One thing, though. I don't know what a condensed score is. Can you explain a bit more? Thank you ...
Regards
Ben |
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JGulyas Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Apr 2002 Posts: 726 Location: Roanoke, VA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:03 am Post subject: |
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bm wrote: | Hi John and Charles ...
Many thanks for the words of advice. I will try making notes and take a peek at the conductors score at some point.
One thing, though. I don't know what a condensed score is. Can you explain a bit more? Thank you ...
Regards
Ben |
Condensed score is one where the only instruments in the score are just the ones that have something of "importance" in relation to the music. It's more in-depth than a piano score, but far less so than a complete score. For instance, Mahler 5... The opening trumpet stuff is there, but once that part is over, the trumpet parts pretty much disappear from the score pages until another part of importance comes back. _________________ All the Best,
John
US Navy Bandsman 1996-2010 (Trumpet; Audio Engineer)
Mpc - Kanstul/Monette B6, Hammond Design custom "JG"
Bb - Yamaha 6335HGSII
C - Eastman ETR530
Picc - NoName Chinese |
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Andy Del Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 2660 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:04 pm Post subject: Re: Score Reading |
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bm wrote: | Hi All ...
Here is my problem: counting bars and getting to know the band music so that I come in on time. My guess is that getting hold of recordings of pieces and the scores would help. |
This is the only bit you need to worry about.
1. Count. If you find it hard, then work on it, there is ZERO shortcut to this. count every beat of every bar of every piece. No if’s or but’s.
2. Listen. Listen to the pieces you are playing. You could follow a score as well, but your part is a better bet. Your ears and eyes on the part will teach you a lot more than a full score, unless your musical literacy is up to it.
Cheers
Andy _________________ so many horns, so few good notes... |
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dstdenis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 May 2013 Posts: 2123 Location: Atlanta GA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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Studying the score and listening to recordings is helpful. But a musician really needs to develop the focus and concentration to count carefully. There will be times when you are reading through a new piece that you haven't studied yet. Only careful counting will get you through. Learn how to do that. _________________ Bb Yamaha Xeno 8335IIS
Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
Flugelhorn Courtois 155R
Piccolo Stomvi |
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OldHorn Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2017 Posts: 90
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, counting is crucial. Especially when sight reading. If you are able to view the score and add textual cues, fine. But I wouldn't count on that luxury to always be available.
The music should have rehearsal numbers or letters displayed at logical places in the music. Whether they're displayed at the beginning of a verse or chorus, a key change, etc. Pay attention to those rehearsal numbers, they're your friend. |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8910 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:18 am Post subject: |
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In agreement with more recent posts. Yes, count every beat (or every bar depending on the tune). Sit on the edge of your chair make sure you understand how the conductor is dividing the bar. Don't be afraid to use fingers, but be subtle as to not distract others. Often I'll put my counting hand on my thigh and just gently press each finger in order so I can feel it. I doubt anyone can tell I'm doing it. Alternately you can press finders into your palm. I find using finger allows me to shift my eyes between the music and conductor better without losing my count. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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