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Blueblue
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 Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:10 am Post subject: Tuning problem with this Chet number.. |
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With my Getzen and Van Laar Trumpet I have the problem to get in tune with: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQD1wJtkkU8
Is it me.. 
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HERMOKIWI
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:41 am Post subject: Re: Tuning problem with this Chet number.. |
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It sounds like Chet is having a lot of difficulty playing in tune on the recording.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:45 am Post subject: |
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Do you mean that you can't play along in tune with Chet?
(Not a critique, just looking for what you are asking.)
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Last edited by kehaulani on Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total |
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lipshurt
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:48 am Post subject: |
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hmmmmm.... analyzing with a strobe, it shows that (at least for the first full minute or so) CHET is stunningly accurate, being dead on with every note. Including those low notes. He stops the strobe, and I' not surprised. One of the things that made chet great (just one of many many any) was his great sense of pitch, and really fine detailed control of it. Even when you can hear maybe his chops having some issues, his pitch was good. This recording is not running the wrong speed or anything like that either. Sometimes that does happen especially when there might be a turntable involved. Chet:)
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:11 am Post subject: |
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I also see it differently from HERMOKIWI, which I almost never do. I don't know about checking it with technology, but to my ears, stylistically, he's right on.
As HERMOKIWI surely knows, (I am speaking to other readers here), part of one's style often depends on how one treats pitches. They may be humoured differently, not exactly direct ly on pitch. It gives a certain colour and ambiance. I don't hear Chet playing out of tune.
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Blueblue
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:24 am Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | Do you mean that you can't play along in tune with Chet?
(Not a critique, just looking for what you are asking.) |
Thank you,
yes indeed, exactly
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:34 am Post subject: |
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Well, it depends on how you see things. If, on purely listening, Chet has some pitch "problems", then this doesn't apply. Look to others.
If, however, you can listen to it and find it stylistically sound, then I would listen to it until you've memorized it, then sing along, no horn, getting all the phrasing, intonation, and inflections. And only then, I would add the trumpet, playing it the way you sang it.
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lipshurt
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:49 am Post subject: |
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in the head, he is exactly right on. His vibratoe even goes equally above an below the zero.
in his improvised solo, there is one upper G# that he is 14 cents flat, which is his most noticable out of tune note. About 8 bars after that he plays a little bit sharp (10 cents) on middle B, but in context it sounds less out than that. a little later he comes in on an upper F# and pushes it it sharp 17 cents, but only momentarily. Then he winds up the solo with a long phrase in which all of the notes are within 2 or three cents, and his vibrato is equally above and below.
The recording is a great example of a trumpet player playing with great intonation, and by the way, the content of his solo is impeccable as well. It kind of does not get better than this.
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HERMOKIWI
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | I also see it differently from HERMOKIWI, which I almost never do. I don't know about checking it with technology, but to my ears, stylistically, he's right on.
As HERMOKIWI surely knows, (I am speaking to other readers here), part of one's style often depends on how one treats pitches. They may be humoured differently, not exactly direct ly on pitch. It gives a certain colour and ambiance. I don't hear Chet playing out of tune. |
Yes, that's a better description of what I meant. It can be very difficult to follow along on trumpet trying to match nuances which came naturally to the player you're trying to match.
The same goes for trying to match phrasing. Even Wynton, in talking about Louis Armstrong's solo on West End Blues, said that he could play it 100 times and still not get the phrasing exactly the same as how Louis played it.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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You might enjoy this version of Chet:
https://youtu.be/IzpfZaZfsZg
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Jaw04
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| HERMOKIWI wrote: | | kehaulani wrote: | I also see it differently from HERMOKIWI, which I almost never do. I don't know about checking it with technology, but to my ears, stylistically, he's right on.
As HERMOKIWI surely knows, (I am speaking to other readers here), part of one's style often depends on how one treats pitches. They may be humoured differently, not exactly direct ly on pitch. It gives a certain colour and ambiance. I don't hear Chet playing out of tune. |
Yes, that's a better description of what I meant. It can be very difficult to follow along on trumpet trying to match nuances which came naturally to the player you're trying to match.
The same goes for trying to match phrasing. Even Wynton, in talking about Louis Armstrong's solo on West End Blues, said that he could play it 100 times and still not get the phrasing exactly the same as how Louis played it. |
I respectfully disagree. Style is one thing, bends and all that, but we know if somebody is playing in tune or not. Chet sounds in tune to me on this recording and if you are transcribing it there's no reason you can't match his intonation, phrasing, bends, articulation, vibrato, etc. That is kind of the point of transcribing. There's a lot of benefit to copying a player at the microscopic level. So to the OP, I think you can get there it just might take more practice and turning up the volume on the track more. There's not a lot of overtones in Chet's sound and if you aren't exactly locked in with it, you will sound off. |
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lipshurt
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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If you can’t play in tune with that recording it’s a problem. Chets pitch is textbook here. What’s the temperature where you are playing?
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michael_bxl
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:21 am Post subject: |
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There is an app for Android phones named Intonia. After installing it, I was shocked to see how out of tune I was. Then I checked great players on Youtube, and saw they were way better than me but not enough in tune according to the app. I then stopped to use it.
All this to say I have checked Chet solo, and he is incredible in tune ! Like I have rarely seen. Here is a screenshot of one of his phrase.
(when other players play, it is all red and blue on the app)
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Richard III
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:02 am Post subject: |
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Chet is playing in tune on a trumpet not tuned correctly. That causes the alteration in resonance and the stylistic effect. It bugs me listening to it. He is still amazing, but I want to grab the trumpet and fix it.
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lipshurt
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