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Advice sought in regards to a trade


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adagiotrumpet
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Joined: 31 May 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would definitely keep the Bach and not trade for the Yamaha. First of all, nothing plays and more importantly, nothing sounds like a Mt. Vernon. Even if you are not playing a lot of classical right now, keep the Bach. As far as the Yamaha, I am not a fan. For me, the Bergeron model is one of the better playing and sounding Yamahas for commercial music, but as with all the Yamahas I have played, thee is something lacking in the sound. The Yamahas play well and are extremely consistent, but there is something sterile in the sound I can't shake in every model I have ever played.

As a lead player and Mt. Vernon owner, I understand what you are trying to accomplish. My Mt Vernon LB 25 is one of my favorite horns and I have used it in the past for big band lead. While it does cut through (I assume because of the 25 bell), I find that my Schilke B3 cuts through better without sounding thin or shrill and is much less work than the Mt. Vernon.

There are several inexpensive choices I would consider for big band playing that I think play well, get the right sound for big band, and can be easily had for around $1,000.00. These would include the King Silver Flair and Getzen Eterna (especially from the Severinsen period). An LA Benge 3X or even better, a Burbank Benge 3X could also be a good choice. Keep in mind, when buying older horns, condition is everything.

Personally, I have a great fondness for Mt. Vernon Bach's. The only way I would give one up is if I found one even better, and needed the cash to buy it. I also, obviously, don't have much of a fondness for Yamahas, even though I played several models for years in the past. Clearly my advice is shaded by this.
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jondrowjf@gmail.com
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Joined: 15 Jul 2016
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:26 pm    Post subject: Techs Reply with quote

You might have something there on trying a new mouthpiece. Would be the most cost effective method.

So you don't like how your trumpet responds in playing high notes? Have you tried a V shape throat mouthpiece? Consider playing a Bach megatone or Wick Heavytop mouthpiece. Might be something to try.

Most of my mouthpieces have a V shape and are either Bach megatone or Wick Heavytop trumpet or cornet mouthpieces.
I do see a difference in sound response. The Wick 4 X is a excellent mouthpiece for high notes. Wick are about $69.00 dollars and Bach are about $100.00 dollars.
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Last edited by jondrowjf@gmail.com on Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Yoshinori76
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Joined: 13 Aug 2011
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Techs Reply with quote

jondrowjf@gmail.com wrote:
Is there anyone at work, that could help in you find what you are looking for in a trumpet? Are there any b stock trumpets in their lineup you can buy?
Have you repaired any trumpets that interest you?
Is there any employee discount or payment plan on the trumpets?
Is there a employee plan for trying out, trumpets for awhile at home?
What mouthpieces are you playing on the Mt. Vernon trumpets?

Yes I spent quite a bit of today discussing payment plans and options for getting a Custom.

As for mouthpieces, for everything not lead, I play a Bach 3C. For lead, I have a Yamaha Bobby Shew lead. I've also asked about mouthpieces. I've decided not to trade for the Yamaha. I haven't had a chance to try a Bergeron and it would be a bad idea to trade as I feel like my Mount Vernon will fetch a better price sound I decide to trade up.
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jondrowjf@gmail.com
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Joined: 15 Jul 2016
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:34 pm    Post subject: Trumpet Reply with quote

Happy to see you kept your Bach. It wouldn't have been to your advantage to trade it. Sounds like the Bach is money in the bank.
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blbaumgarn
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Joined: 26 Jul 2017
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:32 pm    Post subject: Advice sought in regards to a trade... Reply with quote

I would probably have opted for the Bach. Not to say anything negative about Yamaha or any other brand of horn, but the Mt. Vernons I have tooted on are pure sound and you can always get another Bergeron Yamie. There were only so many of those magic Mt. Vernon's made, same as with the great Benges.
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there is one that lives to lay waste to woodwinds and strings, leaving them lie blue and lifeless along a swath of destruction that is a
trumpeter's fury-then there is the dark side!" Irving Bush
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OldSchoolEuph
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:25 am    Post subject: Re: Advice sought in regards to a trade... Reply with quote

blbaumgarn wrote:
I would probably have opted for the Bach. Not to say anything negative about Yamaha or any other brand of horn, but the Mt. Vernons I have tooted on are pure sound and you can always get another Bergeron Yamie. There were only so many of those magic Mt. Vernon's made, same as with the great Benges.


The thing is, that "magic Mt. Vernon" is already gone. The leadpipe is an aftermarket, and in replacing it, you can bet the Mt.V 1" pull to A440 was eliminated by lengthening the horn to just be an imitation 180. This alters (tightens) the centering/slotting considerably relative to the flexible intonation of an intact Mt. Vernon with its slide out an inch. So this horn is easily replicated with a 190 body for the mass of the 2-piece casings, a "lightweigt" 180 bell (made from the same gage as the Mt. Vernon bells were, with the radial thickness variation of that era replicated consistently in the modern forming method), and the same aftermarket (more open blowing and intonation altering) leadpipe.

While I think the OP is wise not to give up such a horn for an unknown quantity, the logic of seeking an 8335LA given the specifics of the use the OP intends was sound. Some of the advice on alternatives such as Benge or Schilke B3 fit that goal, while classic Bach sound, however much we may like it, doesn't.

Hopefully the OP can save up some cash, hang on to the Bach for when it is appropriate, and add a more lead oriented horn to the collection in time.
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2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
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khedger
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Joined: 12 Mar 2008
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Location: Cambridge, MA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yoshinori76 wrote:
Um no I'm not. I made this account in my more cringy youth as an avid lover of anime. And I just haven't bothered changing the username as I believe it is translated to mean the same as my actual name. I live in the KC metro area


You might want to talk to Trent Austin at Austin Custom Brass. He handles a BUNCH of used instruments and such. He could probably give you some good advice and would certainly be able to give you a decent appraisal value on your horns so you at least know what they're worth when considering a trade....

keith
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Ed Kennedy
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yoshinori76 wrote:
Um no I'm not. I made this account in my more cringy youth as an avid lover of anime. And I just haven't bothered changing the username as I believe it is translated to mean the same as my actual name. I live in the KC metro area


That would put you in Trent Austin's front yard. He has connections with BAC. Call him. I've seen used Yamahas on his site and as a Adams dealer he may have something that floats your boat.

You might also consider that, if you lean toward Bach The 72* has been a go-to for lead layers since the '60's. Bernie Glow, Al Stewart, Danny Stiles and, later, before Yamaha Allen Vizzuti and Wayne Bergeron. Bach also has their "Commercial" series and the Mariachi is worth a look. It has, to my ear, a bit Calicchio sparkle.
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