The greatest of them all!

[khedger]

Crouch was an overblown moron who rode to fame on Wynton's coattails by embracing the early 80s 'back to the tradition' sham that Wynton and Columbia records (and Crouch) were largely responsible for.
Crouch was a hypocrite, a failed avante garde drummer who was never hesitant to lambast any music or musician who tried to push the music past 1945.
How he ended up as a 'social critic' (or whatever he was) for the Village Voice is a total mystery to me. There's nothing good to say about him as far as I'm concerned.....as my grandad used to say "if he was on fire, I wouldn't pee on him to put him out....."


keith

[HaveTrumpetWillTravel]

I don't get the people who are bagging on Miles's technical ability. He was the top of the top. He was admitted to Julliard. The story is that he his rhythm was so good he leave the room and come back and still be on beat. He re-invented himself multiple times (I've been listening to his remake of Cindy Lauper's Time after Time, which is pretty awesome). I'm reading the Gavin "Life in a Dream" biography of Chet Baker and he talks about how indebted Chet was to Miles early on and how often recordings had to re-spliced to make them playable. Miles was just *good*. People he played with said he could make their bad chords good (see the story here: https://excellentjourney.net/2018/04/08/miles-davis-so-what-and-being-in-accord-no-matter-the-chord/. Listen a little more before you talk down Miles.

[delano]

Better not get upset by nonsense posts. Those posts speak for themselves. All the people here, even with only basic knowledge of trumpet playing, know, no need to make things clear to anybody.

[PH]

Maybe not the greatest "trumpet player" whatever that means to anyone. But by far the most influential jazz artist on any instrument in the entire history of the music. Maybe Armstrong and Charlie Parker come close...and possibly Ellington, but Armstrong and Bird pretty much did one thing and played in a singlular style (admittedly brilliantly) throughout their careers. Miles was the most influential artist in at least 5 different style genres of jazz...most of them invented by him and his bands. His peers in this are Stravinsky and Picasso, not mere trumpet manipulators.
_________________
Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Clinical Professor of Jazz Trumpet, University of Illinois
Professor Emeritus of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops 1976-2019
JazzRetreats.com

[rothman]

Maybe it's in his autobiography, but there doesn't seem to be much written, or said about his audition to Juilliard. What, exactly he might have played for them(?) whether it was jazz or legit.. is anyone's guess, but he certainly did not have classical motivations to enter the school. What he really wanted more than anything else was to reside in NY in order to meet Charlie Parker, which took him a little while, but was achieved.

[spitvalve]

Having been raised on a steady diet of Doc, Maynard, and Chase, I admit I didn't reallly comprehend Miles in my youth. Now that I'm old(er) I'm starting to understand and it will take me the rest of my life to digest all of his work. I have at least one book of transcribed Miles Davis solos and in some ways they are harder to play authentically than transcriptions of Clifford Brown (and I've just about given up on ever pulling off a Clark Terry solo). Technically, they're more playable but I'll never come close to nailing the musicality, and I've been playing for over fifty years. Miles was a genius and what be did can't be duplicated.
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Bryan Fields
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1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1979 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
Eastlake Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces

[HERMOKIWI]

[HERMOKIWI]

About the recording of "Ko-Ko":

"Rumors persist to this day about precisely who played trumpet and piano on this piece; some claim it's young Miles Davis who plays trumpet and Gillespie comping at piano, on both takes; most claim Gillespie plays trumpet and, or instead of, piano; some claim Hakim is the pianist on all or part of one or both of the takes. However, Miles Davis confirms in his autobiography that he did not play trumpet on "Ko Ko":

"I remember Bird wanting me to play "Ko-Ko," a tune that was based on the changes of "Cherokee." Now Bird knew I was having trouble playing "Cherokee" back then. So when he said that that was the tune he wanted me to play, I just said no, I wasn't going to do it. That's why Dizzy's playing trumpet on "Ko-Ko," "Warmin' up a Riff," and "Meandering" on Charlie Parker’s Reboppers, because I wasn't going to get out there and embarrass myself. I didn't really think I was ready to play tunes at the tempo of "Cherokee" and I didn't make no bones about it."

Miles was an excellent player but (in his own words) not equal to the technical ability of Dizzy. Of course there was also Clifford who, in my view, surpassed Dizzy.

Miles was the greatest in terms of reinventing himself and in terms of his persona. There is no cult in jazz like the cult surrounding Miles.
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HERMOKIWI

[Rod Haney]

One could almost compare him to the biblical Gabriel.

[khedger]

[Richard III]

Please post your favorite Miles video. Thanks.
_________________
Richard

Conn 22B Trumpet
York Eminence Model 4028 Cornet
1903 Conn The Wonder Cornet

[HaveTrumpetWillTravel]

[rothman]

[cheiden]

[ChriZZ83]

First of all: I'm not very much into Miles. Most recordings I can barely listen to the end.

But!

In my opinion Miles isn't a trumpeter in the first place. He was an artist. For example: There are many, many excellent painters and illustrators out there who can draw photorealistic portraits with only a simple pen. But mostly they have nothing to say. On the other hand there is a painter who draws three thick, uneven and asymetric, black lines on a gigantic canvas and to many people this means the world. They see or at least interprete what the artis felt during the process of creation.
This is what I think about miles. There are uncountable trumpeters out there whose technical abilities are just way, way above Miles', but they have nothing to say. Or at least the tell a different story.

Personally I hope once the world of Miles and Jazz overall will open to me. It hasn't yet. I still listen to Bitches Brew and think: If I you take a group of musicians, shut their eyes and ears and tell them to just play what comes into their minds you'll receive something like bitches brew. ... Plz don't hang me for that

Greetings

[Rod Haney]

[StevenE]

When one says, "the greatest," it is helpful to ask him to define his terms more specifically.
Without realizing it, when many people say, "the greatest," they mean one of two things: (1. who had the most significant career, or (2. who resonates with them personally the most.
I never have shared others' enthusiasm for Miles Davis. I agree that he was responsible either in whole or in part for many new styles and directions of jazz - the "cool" period back in the Fifties to so-called "modal" improvisation to fusion, etc. - but in terms of mastery of trumpet technique he is strictly an also-ran in my view. I just don't think he was a very good trumpet player.

[StevenE]

As far as Stanley Crouch, it is interesting to read the last chapter of Gene Lees' book Cats Of Any Color. It goes into some detail about Crouch, Marsalis and Davis. Davis didn't like Marsalis.

[khedger]

[Robert P]