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bnbechtel
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Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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 Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 7:57 am Post subject: Conn 80A family - the 6A |
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Somewhat unrelated: I'm a comeback player with a seriously injured lip, and things are getting better day by day.
I really like the character of the sound produced by the Conn 80A from video clips on YouTube. I went looking for one on eBay and Reverb, and couldn't find one in the right condition for what I can afford right now, so I started digging deeper.
My search led me to a Conn 6A in silver plate, of all things, on eBay. Conn loyalist says it's in the 80A family, and in it looks similar to the later 38A.
It should arrive in the mail next week, and I'm sure I'll have a good time fixing it up and cleaning it. But does anyone have experience with the old 6A? It may be similar to the 4A.
Seems like it's just another smaller bore 80A. I wasn't sure if it was a rarer horn or if it was unpopular for some reason. At any rate, I also ordered a Curry 3VC mouthpiece, which won't be an exact fit, but I think this will get me headed in the right direction.
As you can tell, I'm currently interested in all things Conn, so since I can't find much on the internet regarding this model, I'll reply to this thread with good photos and information on the horn.
My hope is that it will be in the ballpark of an 80A. I'm just hoping that the quality is good and that I didn't buy a horn that was unusual because of some flaw or incompatibility with modern pitch.
Whew, I wrote an essay. I tend to do that.
Thanks, friends. |
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Richard III
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Location: Anacortes, WA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 8:27 am Post subject: |
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What year? How about a link to the Ebay listing?
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Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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bixtone
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Joined: 04 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 8:43 am Post subject: |
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It's been called a "small bore Victor" but it's actually a .462. I have one and it's a great player. To me it feels like a more efficient 80a. Doug Meeuwsen made me a backbore to fit it that works great.
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Besson MEHA
NY Bach
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bnbechtel
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Location: US
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bnbechtel
Regular Member
Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| bixtone wrote: | | It's been called a "small bore Victor" but it's actually a .462. I have one and it's a great player. To me it feels like a more efficient 80a. Doug Meeuwsen made me a backbore to fit it that works great. |
Oh! Wonderful, then. I'm glad you like it -- that means I probably will, too.
Since I've just started playing again after years off (mostly off for about 15 years) it will take some time. My last horn, that I played on for about ten years, was a Bach 180SLR 37, and I didn't like my tone on it -- far too bright and brittle in the upper register (then again, I wasn't a pro) but I think an 80A-like horn will make me happy.
Best,
Brent |
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Richard III
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Joined: 22 May 2007
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Location: Anacortes, WA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:47 am Post subject: |
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Yup. Looks like just what it says it is. Hopefully the valves still have some compression. I have an old one like that but it needs a valve job.
They are a blast to play. Don't get caught up in what mouthpiece to use. If it fits and plays, it's fine.
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Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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bnbechtel
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Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| Richard III wrote: | Yup. Looks like just what it says it is. Hopefully the valves still have some compression. I have an old one like that but it needs a valve job.
They are a blast to play. Don't get caught up in what mouthpiece to use. If it fits and plays, it's fine. |
A blast to play! I am so excited waiting for it to arrive. I had to play a Bach Strad for years, and I didn't have fun with it. I liked my Olds Ambassador cornet that I started on more. Now that I'm older and don't have to spend hours a day on technique, I say -- I want to have a bond with the instrument. I love how these horns look and sound. I'm surprised that they sell for such a low price. (Thinking of the high prices for high-end vintage Olds trumpets.) |
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bnbechtel
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Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2021 2:01 pm Post subject: Horn arrived ... Probably not a 6A |
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| Richard III wrote: | | What year? How about a link to the Ebay listing? |
Ah! The horn arrived. By serial number, it's a 1923-1924 model, but I have looked all over at the receiver for the horn, and I cannot find a model number.
It once had "the mechanism" but from the tarnish, it was removed long ago, and the tab on the first valve where the mechanism would attach has been sawn off. Oh well.
The valves are top sprung. Had a star after the serial number, so maybe a gold brass bell.
My guess is it's an 80A, as it doesn't say have any model number where they are supposed to be found. I think it's really cool that there is mother of pearl on the bottom valve caps. Never seen that before.
 [/img] |
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Dale Proctor
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2021 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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The earlier Conn instruments didn’t have the model # stamped on the underside of the receiver. Measure the inside diameter of the 2nd valve slide - that should give you a clue as to which model it is.
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OldSchoolEuph
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 5:17 am Post subject: |
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In December 1923, a 6A was becoming an 80A - same thing.
A TIMELINE OF TRUMPETS page 114:
As the Victor cornets predated Conn’s numbering scheme, the original .484”-bore models became the 6A and 7A in 1921 (LP-only and HP/LP respectively). In 1922, 4A and 5A .422”-bore versions were added. By 1924, 6A and 7A became 80A and 81A, while 4A and 5A became 90A and 91A. Small bore versions without the slide mechanism, dubbed 92A and 93A, and a full set of .438” bore 84/85/86/87-A versions were similarly offered. In mid-1926, the 90A became 4A again with 91A discontinued, while 92A and 93A became 6A and 7A. With the deepening of the Great Depression, this shrank to just the 80A and the 4A in 1931. By 1941, only the 80A remained, and the slide mechanism was no longer a part of the design.
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Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com
2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
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bnbechtel
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Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 7:05 am Post subject: |
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| OldSchoolEuph wrote: | In December 1923, a 6A was becoming an 80A - same thing.
A TIMELINE OF TRUMPETS page 114:
As the Victor cornets predated Conn’s numbering scheme, the original .484”-bore models became the 6A and 7A in 1921 (LP-only and HP/LP respectively). In 1922, 4A and 5A .422”-bore versions were added. By 1924, 6A and 7A became 80A and 81A, while 4A and 5A became 90A and 91A. Small bore versions without the slide mechanism, dubbed 92A and 93A, and a full set of .438” bore 84/85/86/87-A versions were similarly offered. In mid-1926, the 90A became 4A again with 91A discontinued, while 92A and 93A became 6A and 7A. With the deepening of the Great Depression, this shrank to just the 80A and the 4A in 1931. By 1941, only the 80A remained, and the slide mechanism was no longer a part of the design. |
AH! Okay. Thanks! I couldn't find this information through Google. I measured the instrument, and it's 16 and 7/8 inches. The closet I could come on bore size at the second valve, bottom (of the slide itself, measured across the center) was ~7.9 / 16, so .493, which is close to .484
Obviously I would need something better than a ruler to measure the bore.
It would appear I have a '23/24 large bore 6A/80A, definitely no model number, but it has the * so it has the gold brass bell. Maybe.
More importantly, I really like it. I guess if I ever go to sell it, which won't be any time soon, I'll be able to explain what it is.
And thank you again.
Sincerely,
Brent |
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bnbechtel
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Joined: 26 Oct 2021
Posts: 66
Location: US
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| Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 5:35 am Post subject: |
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Update: I cleaned up the Conn 80A and I've been playing again for two weeks.
Here's a sound check this morning, I thought it might be interesting for other comeback players or players with lip injuries -- kind of tracking my progress.
The horn is very nice indeed. I think it might be my favorite of any I've played so far, and I did have substantial playing experience before I quit playing years ago, but I'm without a teacher right now, but with two weeks of practice, what can be said other than that I need to practice more?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D62v4gggghI |
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