I don’t have a consistent embouchure

J0AP23 · New Member Joined: 27 Oct 2021 Posts: 4

I’ve been playing trumpet for about 3-4 years now and I’ve had this same problem. My embouchure is not consistent. When I play it’s like figuring out how to play all over again. I pick up my trumpet mess around for a minute and when a note comes out I’m doing something right. This doesn’t last very long and my chops get really fatigued.

This also started lots of really bad habits. The main ones are breathing and pressure. I cannot last long when I play and it sucks. I have to practice so much because I got to an arts school and I’ve never gotten through a full day without feeling like crap. My band director doesn’t know what to do and I’ve been trying to figure stuff out but nothings working. He says it’s a mental problem which I’m kind of starting to believe.

The pressure problem is starting to go away but I need an embouchure that I can practice on and I feel like starting is the best way to do that. It’s really hard to do because I still have to practice for all of these classes and I can’t find time to focus on both things. It’s especially hard in the beginning of those classes because I want to play in class but I also would like to practice when I get home and improve.

I know I need to develop the embouchure that I didn’t when I first started playing so I can play without having to go through this every single day. I just don’t know how.

JayKosta · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 8:43 am Post subject:

Have you looked at any of the online youtube videos about 'basic trumpet embouchure'?
Are you trying to emulate a method that you've seen - what is the LINK to that video?

Does your mouthpiece seem to 'fit' on your lips and teeth in a consistent position that doesn't cause pain or injury?
Does the mouthpiece seem 'about the right size' - not overly large or small? And what brand and model # mouthpiece are you using?
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Trumpetgas · New Member Joined: 05 Aug 2020 Posts: 2

Check out Greg Spence Mystery to Mastery. Even contacting him for a few online lessons will help or connect with a qualified teacher in your area who understands chop problems and development.
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J0AP23 · New Member Joined: 27 Oct 2021 Posts: 4

I’ve looked at tons of videos and looked at some pictures of trumpet players. My current band director showed me a method for creating a embouchure that’s sort of works but my tone is weird and I can only play in the low register. He also gave me a contact for his band director who told me to buy a 5C mouthpiece (which is what I’m using) and see if that works. It’s helped but I’m still having trouble with figuring this out. I’ve noticed that lots of player have both their lips in the mouthpiece and I haven’t been doing that.

I want to try another mouthpiece but I also want to figure this out on the 5C because compared to the 7C I was using it’s way better. I can’t seem to find anything on developing an embouchure. I know I have to play more but everyone seems to just figure it out on there own. It could just be me being impatient.

JayKosta · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:13 am Post subject:

J0AP23 · New Member Joined: 27 Oct 2021 Posts: 4

My top lip is partially outside of the mouthpiece but I feel more pressure on my bottom lip. When I try putting more of my top lip in it’s either just air or really weird sounds.

kehaulani · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 10:24 am Post subject:

At the risk of being redundant, I have to ask -

Is it really that mystical a thing to find and use a GOOD teacher to help you, first hand and "up close"?

What is so beneficial about looking for answers when you post no video and ask a bunch of internet strangers who are just making this a guessing game?

You have been playing several years and are still having fundamental problems? What's the popular definition of "insanity" - "Doing the same thing over and over expecting different results"?

This may seem blunt, but come on, man. You've got more potential than this. If you tell us where you live, maybe a Forum member knows of a good teacher in your area.

I don't think it was illogical to come here for advice and we welcome you, but I would suggest that advice be more philosophical and not technical. You need in-person help.

Best of luck. We're with you.
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wohlrab · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 11:44 am Post subject:

I hate these threads because we have a struggling player who needs serious help and attention and the only person that can help them is a proper teacher. I know I owe my playing career to my mentor who changed my whole approach to trumpet and gave me the embouchure I never had before. What's your location OP and we can probably recommend someone to reach out to.

J0AP23 · New Member Joined: 27 Oct 2021 Posts: 4

I live in Washington D.C.

kehaulani · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 1:19 pm Post subject:

gwood66 · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 2:46 pm Post subject:

You mentioned that you are attending and arts school so if you are not taking lessons from a trumpet player you should be. I would ask your band director for some suggestions. As mentioned above there probably is an abundance of trumpet teachers in your area. Things that may help you while you are getting a teacher:

Establish a consistent warmup routine if you do not already have one.

Rest frequently. Do not play long stretches without taking the horn off you face. Do not play for more that five or ten minutes with out taking a break. Stop playing before you get tired and your mechanics start to break down. Easy to say and hard to do sometimes.

Rest between each exercise or line with the horn off your face. If you play 8 bars, rest for 8 bars minimum.

As much as you may not want to, you may have set the horn down for a day or two. There are things you can do to practice without playing such as fingering while you are singing the tune.

Excessive mouthpiece pressure is often caused by overblowing. Back off the volume and see if that helps. Practice softly as possible while still getting good tone. Overblowing also causes fatigue because your embouchure muscle have to work hard to hold your embouchure in place.

This problem wasnt caused overnight and it will not be fixed overnight. It may take weeks/months to correct. It will take even longer if you try to do it without proper help.
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Billy B · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 3:03 pm Post subject:

[quote="JayKosta"]Have you looked at any of the online youtube videos about 'basic trumpet embouchure'?

NOOOOO!!

That's the absolute worst thing you could do.
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Billy B · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 3:08 pm Post subject:

Contact Bill Dunn for lessons.

PM me for his contact info.
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Billy B · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 3:11 pm Post subject:

Vin DiBona · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 3:50 pm Post subject:

Billy B.
Well said. All three.
OP, get a teacher!!!
R. Tomasek

mikepodorski · Regular Member Joined: 25 Jul 2020 Posts: 34

Is it possible to take a break from the classes to focus on getting things right? I'm sure the added pressure isn't helping.

I would echo finding help. I'm a comeback player who floundered for quite a while on my own to get my embuocher set.

kehaulani · Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2021 7:07 pm Post subject:

Just a second thought about seeking a teacher. Be completely up front with whoever you speak to. You need someone good at diagnosing and solving problems. Maybe the person you talk to really doesn't want to mess with that but, t the same time, knows somebody that does.
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Dkjcliff · Regular Member Joined: 12 Apr 2020 Posts: 97

An unpopular opinion, but as a high schooler I studied with some very well respected teachers in the Los Angeles area and they did not help me solve what I have discovered in later years was a fundamental problem with my embouchure. None of them even identified it as an issue I needed to fix. They had me go through the normal routines - Schlossberg, Clarke, etc. But it wasn’t helpful because I was struggling to play it on a broken setup. I ended up feeling like they didn’t really care. And these guys are teachers who are regularly lauded on this site and in the trumpet community as great teachers.

This is not to say that all teachers are like this. But you do need to be honest and demanding - define what you want, and determine for yourself what is not working. If you can find a teacher you vibe with and who really wants to help you, jackpot! That’s definitely the way to go. But trust your instincts too. Generally speaking too much pressure and uneven mouthpiece placement are the main culprits of poor endurance, range, and tone. It’s actually not rocket science. Your lips need to vibrate and you need good air flow to support them. The difficulty is in finding the right placement for your facial structure that allows your lips to vibrate freely. Once you’ve identified it, then it’s just a matter of building strength and coordination. It require focus, it requires self analysis, it requires time. It doesn’t require an advanced degree. One of the biggest problems young talented trumpet players face is being required to play too much and too far beyond their abilities when they haven’t yet developed the strength and correct placement. If you can take time off and play 30 minutes a day, but play the right way every time, you’ll see a world of improvement.
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deleted_user_687c31b · New Member Joined: 03 Apr 1996 Posts: 0

Not gonna argue with the 'get a teacher' recommendation: a qualified person who is able to observe and correct you in real life is much more likely to succeed than any advice given through a forum (caveat: I do agree with Kehaulani that you should be picky about finding a teacher that's right for you).

That being said, because I'm neurotic about wanting to help others, there's 2 thoughts I'd like to share with you.

First of all, from what you're describing, you've got a very busy (stressful?) playing schedule, snowballing from assignment to assignment without having a moment inbetween to actually work on your technique. It may be beneficial to take some time off and let your chops (and mind) recover a bit. A well-timed moment of rest can be more helpful than forcibly keep going just because you've got a schedule to keep. Essentially, take a step back, breathe, and evaluate where you are, and what would help you. The world is not gonna end if you take a moment off, or even if you miss a class.

The second thought is that, if you're having a particularly 'bad chops' day, consider putting the trumpet back in its case and call it a day. Trying to beat your chops into submission will only reïnforce bad habits and train the wrong muscles. Muscle memory is a powerful thing so if you can teach your body the 'good chops' day embouchure, you'll start having those days more often.

Anyway, that's just some amateur's thoughts, feel free to discard them if they're not helpful. Good luck, and I hope you find a way to sort out your issues.

Robert P · Heavyweight Member Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Posts: 2595

Post video of yourself playing.
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