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Lets talk King Liberty Models..



 
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chef8489
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Joined: 16 Aug 2011
Posts: 850
Location: Johnson City Tn

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2022 7:40 pm    Post subject: Lets talk King Liberty Models.. Reply with quote

I know we touched briefly on this in some of my other threads, but I would like to delve deeper into it. Im still trying to learn the differences between the different King Liberty models through the H.N. White era.
There was the original King Liberty model from 1920-1932 that looks like this


then we have the Liberty #2


Next we have the 2b


next we have this model and I m not sure what it is, but seems to be the last iteration.


Now how do the sounds compare between the different models? My cornet restoration should finish at the end of the month and I can start looking for my next horn and I am thinking of the Liberty. I think it would add a different sound to my current H.N. White horns as well as add to my collection.
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Mac Gollehon
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Joined: 27 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2022 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Liberty 2B is the most pronounced difference in Liberty models. So much so that I don’t understand why they used the Liberty model name. It is so different from the other Liberty models. My personal opinion is that the Liberty from 1926-1932 are some of the most outstanding trumpets ever built if you find them in excellent condition. Only problem is most tend to overblow them because of the effortless response and try to add more which defeats the purpose.
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Halflip
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Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 1862
Location: WI

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2022 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mac Gollehon wrote:
The Liberty 2B is the most pronounced difference in Liberty models. So much so that I don’t understand why they used the Liberty model name. It is so different from the other Liberty models.

+1

If you refer to this link:
http://www.hnwhite.com/Trumpet%20Page.htm
you will see that the one you refer to as the "last iteration" is considered "#3" in the Liberty evolutionary lineage (they call it the "Balanced" model, even though the valve block does not appear to be offset), while the 2B is treated as a completely separate design with its own heading. Furthermore, the Liberty #1/#2/Balanced series appears to have settled on a bore size of .448" (after the first iteration), while the 2B was always .458" (there was also a "3B" for a while with a bore size of .468").
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"He that plays the King shall be welcome . . . " (Hamlet Act II, Scene 2, Line 1416)

"He had no concept of the instrument. He was blowing into it." -- Virgil Starkwell's cello teacher in "Take the Money and Run"
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edfitzvb
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010
Posts: 19
Location: Woodlawn, VA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2022 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was gifted a Liberty Balanced (#3) trumpet when I lived in Virginia Beach. On that trumpet the valves were moved toward the bell as compared to other trumpets I owned. It was built like a tank... thick brass, fairly narrow wrap when compared to other horns I owned at the time. It had a GREAT sound and was an excellent choice for playing in church with the choir because, although the brilliance cut through nicely, the .445 bore kept it from overpowering as much as my ML or L bore horns did. When I moved away I gifted it to a promising young player in the church who also played trumpet. I would love to have another. It was a very fine horn. The old H.N. White horns really were well made
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Halflip
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Joined: 09 Jan 2003
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Location: WI

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2022 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

edfitzvb wrote:
On that trumpet the valves were moved toward the bell as compared to other trumpets I owned.

Good to know! In pictures I've seen, the offset doesn't look as pronounced as what I see on a Selmer Balanced Model or an Olds Recording.
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"He that plays the King shall be welcome . . . " (Hamlet Act II, Scene 2, Line 1416)

"He had no concept of the instrument. He was blowing into it." -- Virgil Starkwell's cello teacher in "Take the Money and Run"
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jon_norstog
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Joined: 07 Feb 2012
Posts: 171
Location: Portland OR

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2022 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a near-mint Art Deco "silvertone" Liberty. Last time I played it regularly was when my Silver Sonic was in the shop. It has more resitance than the free-blowing Sonic, but is a lot easier to get around above the staff.

I had a regular Liberty, also an art deco model that I played full time, before I got the Sonic. It was kind of ratted out - when I got it it was so full of snoose it would hardly blow. Sold that one.

The sterling silver Liberty has a sound like no other IMHO.

jn
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EdMann
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Joined: 31 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2022 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had my 1928 King Lib for over a decade, shared with the late Billy Lamb (Buddy Rich, TOP) and we both love it. The response, intonation, sound, incredible. Hard to beat with any set up. And they're the best bargain in brass.

ed
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RETrumpet
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Joined: 26 Jan 2021
Posts: 210

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a 1924ish Liberty (SN 64xxx) that I don't play much, but I do enjoy it when I do. The .445 bore and small bell really give it a compact sound and delivers a vintage dance band character.

It seems to like a mouthpiece with a smaller throat, so I don't usually use my Monettes, although a Silver 2 is passable. Instead I go with a Curry 2BC, or even just a Bach 3C.

I definitely agree with Mac Gollehon. Being used to larger equipment, it's really easy to overblow my Liberty. I find that if I approach it a little more like a high horn and blow a bit more "at it" and less "through it" then it really sings.
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