Schilke X4 and X3 players

[Peck Time]

Hi, are there any Schilke X3 or X4 aficionados out there?

How well do these large-bore horns work for small group jazz?

How do they compare to other large-bores (eg the Selmer 25)?

Is the X4B (with the copper bell) comparable to the HC2?

Cheers!

[Ed Kennedy]

Two Schilke artists, Bobby Lewis, Chicago jazz and studio man and Mark Zauss, Orlando lead and noted high note player play the X4.

https://www.markzauss.net/

[huntman10]

First, I am not much of a jazz player, more of a concert band and brass band player, but I just finished my summer concert season on Eb (I feel like a monk, since I only allow myself to play Eb for about 10 weeks out of the year, to keep my Eb chops "unconfused") and am ready to play my Bb's, and happen to have a nice early 80's X3 (factory reconditioned in 2018) and very nice '60's Selmer 25, so I got them out and tried to "contrast and compare".

I tried them out with a Schilke 16C4 mouthpiece with a factory 20 orifice, and 6.5 Reeves sleeve, and a Wick 3E trumpet mouthpiece with standard shank (maybe a bit more "lead-ish" for contrast). I tried some standard ballad and some old Al Hirt licks just for fun.

I don't think of the Selmer 25 and Schilke X3 as being especially close in playing character. The X3 is only 0.463" while the Selmer 25 mics at 0.468", and just gives me the impression of being a heavier horn (my Schilke X3 weighs 2 lb 2.3 oz. and the Selmer 25 weighs 2 lb 7 oz.) From the player perspective to my ear, the Selmer feels more "out front", and a bit rich, while the Schilke seems clean and broad in tone. I felt the X3 may have been a bit easier, due to the weight.

I tried a few other horns, including a Severinsen Eterna LB that mics at 0.468" as well as a Taylor Chicago II heavyweight (almost a pound heavier and 0.470" bore) but by then I was a bit dizzy from trying to find common ground.

I think this just shows that we too often get hung up on a few thousandths of an inch bore size, when the bell tapers, leadpipes, and weight distribution may make a lot more difference to response and effort. They all have great sound potential, but may not be every player's idea of trumpet paradise.
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huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc.

[shofarguy]

I owned a Schilke X4 for about a year, but I haven't played the Selmer you mention or the X3, other than a few notes the Schilke table in Anaheim at ITG back in 2016.

The X4 was no harder to control than my Wild Thing. It wasn't especially open like one or two Schilkes I've tried. It had a dark core sound, but with a very aggressive, hot fringe to the timbre. I felt it would be a killer big band, salsa or rock band horn. If I were to look for a trumpet for small jazz combo music, I don't think I would choose an X4, or any other Schilke. They all seem to have a brilliance to them that is beyond what, say, Chet Baker would have chosen.

I really liked my X4. It had fantastic intonation and nice slotting. The workmanship of Schilke's horns is second to none, IMO. I sold it at a time when I needed cash.

Though I never compared my X4 to a Hand Craft, side-by-side, I think the HC2 has a timbre that is a little lighter at its core. The brilliance is similar, but I remember the X4 having a heavier, darker core. I know there are many who might dispute that notion, but that's how I remember the two horns. I have not ever played the brass belled HC1, but comments I've read may indicate it has a darker tone than the copper HC2, which makes sense to me. I expect that a copper bell X4 would also have a lighter, brighter tone. The X3 has a much narrower bell taper and even lighter core.

If I ever needed to replace my Wild Thing, I would strongly consider buying another X4.
_________________
Brian A. Douglas

Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.

[yourbrass]

"Is the X4B (with the copper bell) comparable to the HC2?"

Not really. The X4 has a large bell but the HC2 has an even larger bell throat. The one HC2 I played felt too large and cornet-like.

I have an X4B and have played it in big and small bands. Great horn. Wouldn't see any limitations.
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"Strive for tone." -John Coppola
Edwards X-13
ACB MV3C /ACB A1/26 backbore
https://yourbrass.com/

[dershem]

One of my backup horns is an X3, and I find it very useful for small group stuff. Back off, and it can be a very mellow horn. Some like to combine that with a deeper mouthpiece, but my sound is pretty round already (The Miyashiro is not as good for that).
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BKA! Mic Gillette was my mentor and friend.
Marcinkiewicz Mic G. trumpet, Custom Marcinkiewicz mpc. (Among others)
Marcinkiewicz Rembrandt flugel, Benge 8Z cornet, King 2B, Bach 36, Benge 190, Getzen 3062... many more. All Marc. mouthpieces.

[Peck Time]

Thanks for the informative replies!

I have recently picked up an X4B, and was interested in peoples thoughts while I waited for it to arrive.

It's very different to my Selmer 25 (another really large-bore horn), and a Yamaha 6345 (slightly larger than normal bore) I've been borrowing.

I was slightly worried about the X4, there's not a lot of information online, and some people liken it to playing a vacuum cleaner!

However, I've found it a joy to play. It's like a normal trumpet but everything is bigger- it's the Clifford The Big Red Dog of the trumpet world!

very addictive actually- it's a bit like a cartoon trumpet- everything is in bold colours.

[Type3B]

Hi All -- I play an X3 with a Faddis heavyweight mouthpiece. I play big-band lead almost exclusively, so I can't say much about other playing applications. What I can say is that the horn has a huge, fat sound, is easy blowing, very much in tune, has great valves, and is fun to play. Some people say that Schilke horns are bright and hard to blend with other horns in a section. That's not my experience. I play in two big bands, in which guys are using Bachs, Yammies, and Benges, and I have no problem blending. I think that Schilkes respond really well to mouthpieces. If you play a lead piece, you'll get a laser; if you play something bigger and deeper, you'll get a nice legit sound. As far am I'm concerned, Schilkes are exceptional instruments.
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2006 Buick Lucerne

[RussellDDixon]