From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

Heinz · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 6:23 am Post subject: From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

Hello,

I'm playing trumpet in a 'harmonie' orchestra and in a bigband. For harmonie I use a Yam 5335 trumpet with a Yam 11B4 or Bach 3C mouthpiece.

I like both mouthpieces. The 11B4 plays easy, compact and clean with a clear enough tone. The 3C has a broader and more open sound. I really like that, but I also find the 3C on the large side. It tires me out more quickly than the 11B4. On the other hand is the 11B4 a bit small and restrictive.

Now I am wondering about the Yamaha 13B4. This will be a size in between the 11B4 en 3C. I already tried the 14B4, but with same results as the 3C.

The question: is a 13B4 just a larger version of the 11B4, or are there more differences?

TrpM · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:34 am Post subject: Re: From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

cheiden · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 9:18 am Post subject:

I play all the sizes you mention. 3C rim on the Bb, 14F4 on the flugel, and 11B4 on the picc. For the Bb I do agree that the Yamaha B cup is serviceable but not compelling and that I much prefer the Bach sound whether it be the 3C or the 1.5C. I doubt you'll get much additional satisfaction by changing Yamaha sizes as they're pretty consistent.

I've tried Bach 5-size pieces but really don't like the rim though ACB makes a 5-size piece that feels pretty good. I've had limited success with Bach 6-size pieces. Might be worth a look.
_________________
"I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart

Heinz · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 9:48 am Post subject: Re: From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

cheiden · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 11:27 am Post subject: Re: From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

Trumpjerele · Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:21 pm Post subject:

Recently at a friend's house I tested several mouthpieces blindly.

I was impressed by two, a Yamaha 11 (vintage, with the appearance of a Shilke mouthpiece) and a Bach 6c.

With the Yamaha 11 I could play very easily and comfortably a ballad with subtone, but it also lit up if I put air in it.

It was just a couple of tunes, it's just a first impression, but coming from a Yamaha 11b4, you might do well with it, or not, who knows?

They can usually be found cheap second hand, I have one on the way and I'm looking for a Bach 6c!!!

I did not answer your question!!!sorry!!!
_________________
Notice!!! Amateur musician without formal studies

Trumpet: Yamaha 8310Z
Mouthpiece: the great Yamaha11b4

Sax tenor: Yamaha YTS 23
Mouthpiece: Otto link tone edge

Manuel de los Campos · Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:03 am Post subject: Re: From Yamaha 11B4 to 13B4

Heinz · Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:24 am Post subject:

delano · Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:55 am Post subject:

Though I think I'm talking to a deaf crowd I think buying an A&s 6C (or a Gewa, they are the same) is a good idea. These mouthpieces are great value. They are CNC copies of Bach MtV designs made by the same factory on the same machines as the Bach mouthpieces, Lausmann in Germany. Very well crafted, very good plated. Only C cups and an occasional E cup BTW.
I own now an A&s 12C for trombone, GEWA-cup 6 for alttrumpet and an A&s 10 1/2C for trumpet and they all are very good. For just under 15 euro you have the same quality as the Bach mp's that do 69 euro (at Thomann).
People who still think the Bach mp's are better must be sensitive for the magical dust of the name Bach. Maybe when the name Schrottenbach should be engraved the magical dust would be blown in the wind.

In the Yamaha numbering the last digit in 11B4, 13B4 and 14B4, so the 4, stands for the shape of the rim. I own a 11B4, 14B4 GP, a 14E4 and the rims are the same. So I cannot imagine that the 13B4 should have a complete different rim.
A 13B4 could therefor also be an option. The 14B4 is/feels definitely already smaller than the (average?) Bach 3C, so the 13B4 could have the proper diameter for the OP.
Using the mouthpiece comperator is not very fruitful for diameters: the difference between a 14B4 and a 13B4 is 0.17 mm, a fraction of the lines on your screen. I use the mouthpiece comparator only for the shape of mp's.

N.B. The Josef Klier USA Bach copies are also very good but I think that JK uses its own (quite big!) backbores so they may play differently compared to the Bachies.

Heinz · Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 11:31 pm Post subject:

Hallo Theo en Delano!

I like to try a Warburton setup, but it is a bit expensive to order blindly. If I get the chance I will try it.

But if the 13B4 is just a hair bigger and maybe different than the 11B4, it has no use for me. I keep using the 3C/ 11B4 and I will try the Yam 11 (and maybe the A&S 6C).

Manuel de los Campos · Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2022 8:04 am Post subject:

MisterBighorn · Regular Member Joined: 31 Oct 2022 Posts: 22

I have a 13B4. It has a nice compact sound and is very flexible. Endurance is good because of the semi-tight backbore and semi-flat rim.

Heinz · Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2022 1:59 am Post subject:

Tnx to all!

I have tried the Yamaha 11 for a couple of days. It sounds darker than the 11B4 if you play soft, but it brightens up when you step on the gas. It is not as comfortable, but I think I like the sound more. The 11B4 is just very clean.

Now I'm gonna compare it to the 3C.

MisterBighorn · Regular Member Joined: 31 Oct 2022 Posts: 22

Deleted

Heinz · Posted: Sun Dec 18, 2022 11:22 pm Post subject:

So I tested the whole Yamaha 11 family:

11B4: good mouthpiece with a clean, clear and compact sound.
11C4: sounds somewhat darker than the B, the higher register feels restricted.
11: feels somewhat bigger than the B and C, produces more volume. Tends to sound somewhat fuzzy, not as clean as the other two.
11F4 (flugel): feels thight in comparison to a DW 4BFL, didn't like the sound.

For trumpet the 11B4 is the clear winner for me. For flugel I didn't like the 11 mouthpiece.

Yesterday I played a christmass concert and I wanted to use the 11C4, because the B was in the case of another trumpet. In the warm-up I really felt it would become a nuisance. So just before the concert I swapped to the 3C and it did good.

I gonna play the 3C and 11B4 till I find something that does better for me (and maybe I won't find such a mouthpiece). I think I will even buy a 2nd 11B4 so I have one with both trumpets.

Heinz · Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2023 1:15 am Post subject:

Well, I ordered the A&S 6C for testing.

I am curious.

Edit: I recieved the A&S 6C. The plating is not as good as more expensive brand. The backbore is not even plated all the way. But the rim feels good. It is flatter than the rims on the 3C and 11B4. It also feels a bit smaller than the 3C, but the cup is deeper. In testplaying it feels and sounds good. We shall see how it does in rehearsal.