A mouthpiece confession

[delano]

Sorry that I kept it for so long private but I finally have to make a confession about mouthpieces for trumpet, cornet and flügelhorn.

I own a whole cupboard full of mouthpieces, Warburton, Curry, Kanstul Monette copies, lots of Bachies, Josef Klier, Bruno Tilz, Denis Wick (standard and Heritage), French Selmer, La Tromba and some less known ones.
Are they any good?
Mwah, some of them.

But my confession is:
the best stock mouthpieces available are the Yamaha's.
Surprise: they are the best and as a bonus they are quite cheap.

Are there any better mouthpieces available in the world?
Possibly, but that's missing neccesity or urgency.

Do they have any competition?
Yes: I think Warburton is good, especially the flügelhorn mp's.
And there is one better brand, probably the number 1 mouthpiece maker and mouthpiece creator of the world: Breslmair.

My standard setup is mostly the 14C4 on piston trumpet (though the 14D4 is a better mouthpiece, but the 14C4 gives more drama), the 14D4 may be one of the best stock mouthpieces available.

Breslmair G2 on rotary trumpet
14E on cornet (Getzen Eterna 800)
14F4 on flügel but I sold all my flügelhorns so now I use this one on an old (Belgium) cornet with the old Olds receiver and via an adapter on my CB pocket trumpet.

So no need anymore for Monette, Lotus, AR and the other 'cheapies'.
You're welcome.

[stuartissimo]

Good to read that you’ve found a mouthpiece that you like. It’s not an easy search, as shown by your own collection, as no mouthpiece or even moutpiece brand is a good fit for everyone.
_________________
1975 Olds Recording trumpet
1997 Getzen 700SP trumpet
1955 Olds Super cornet
1939 Buescher 280 flugelhorn
AR Resonance mouthpieces

[GeorgeB]

Wow, that's a lot of mouthpieces. I always follow your posts with interest, delano, and somehow I just didn't think of you as a man who would collect so many different mouthpieces. But it seems you have found what works for you now and that is a good thing. I am not sure I have found the right one for me as yet and I better hurry up because I am 86 very years old.

George
_________________
GeorgeB
1960s King Super 20 Silversonic
2016 Manchester Brass Custom
1938-39 Olds Recording
1942 Buescher 400 Bb trumpet
1952 Selmer Paris 21 B
1999 Conn Vintage One B flat trumpet
2020 Getzen 490 Bb
1962 Conn Victor 5A cornet

[ek1986]

I find the Yamahas very out of tune when used on C trumpets especially on loud dynamics and above the staff (even and sometimes especially when throat and backbore are modified).

This problem isn't as noticeable on the Yamaha 16 and smaller rims. However, I was never able to settle for the sound any of those rims produce in the orchestra.

[chef8489]

[Irving]

I like Yamahas as well, and have played on them for extended periods. They are very similar to Bachs, and if you are sort of happy with your Bach, then you could try the equivalent Yamaha. I probably have as many mouthpieces as Delano, so when I pull out a mouthpiece that I haven't used for years, then it is like getting a new one. Since our bodies change with age, and the mouthpieces stay the same, sometimes a mouthpiece that didn't suit us when we were younger might work 20, 30 or 40 years later. I have mouthpieces that I used as a student happily, but can no longer use them. So think twice before you sell a mouthpiece, unless you are sure that you will never want to use it again.

[kehaulani]

Maybe I'm reading more into delano's post, but I don't see it as a dogmatic statement regarding the exclusivity of the quality of a Yamaha, as much as a left-handed comment on the trap of chasing a lot of boutique vs. mass production mouthpieces.

We're often too swayed by marketing and internet-speak. We somehow, in the recesses of our psyches, can't admit that a mass-produced item isn't superior to one costing double or triple and carrying a botique reputation.

I've surprised myself as of late by enjoying just a stock Bach 6C. That may not be my only mouthpiece but almost. And there's a closet of expensive broken tears left behind. Boutique when I could have bought stock.

p.s. the mentality that something that costs more equals higher quality/effectiveness is characteristic of our society's psyche.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[chef8489]

[delano]

Irving is spot on here. Mouthpieces come and go... and come again.
Of course I took a little freedom here to explain my love for Yamaha mouthpieces.
They are indeed constructed out of the same 'philosophy' as Bach mouthpieces but are definitely different.

I love the Yamaha 4 rim above all Bach rims (in my diameter of course).
Tried a lot, lots of 7C's from all brands, Curry B, C and BC cups, JK's with different throats, Bach 3C, 5B and 5MV, a lot of Warburton cups and backbores and some more I forgot. Tried especially the Bach (and Curry) 3c with intervals for years but could not get that right.
In fact I decided to abandon all C cups.

Played the Yamaha 14B4GP for some time (very good allround mp) and then bought a 14D4 for a different, deeper sound.. Though this last mp seems to be extremely impopular it is great, really great. Easy to play, big (orchestral) sound, intonation good, comfortable and so on. In fact the first mouthpiece that gave me a relaxed broad and rich trumpet sound. And I was able to let all the tension go, also higher up.
Changed recently to a 14C4 (yes, back to the C cup!) because this mp sounds more vocal, it has more drama in it so to say but the 14D4 is IMO still a better mp.

The 14E for cornet is flawless, fantastic mp. IMO you can play everything on this one.

The 14F4 for flügel is the weirdest mouthpiece I've ever seen. I played Warburton on flügelhorn and also different depth of DW 4 pieces, (later alsoBruno Tilz).
I have to admit that the Warburton for flügel is IMO one of their best creations, really good!! (I also own several W cups and backbores for trumpet and cornet).
But because of the Yamaha 4 rim I bought a 14F4.
Total disaster.
It was the first mp I could not play on at all! Airballs, broken sound, intonation false arabic....
So I put it aside. Some time later after reading some of Rowuk's great advice about how to handle new mouthpieces I started again on it.
And then it happened, over days the playing improved, the sound came first, the intonation last. Now I think it's the best flügelhorn mouthpiece around for jazz playing. It has exactly the right lightness for that. It has a certain nice core but is still breathing.
I would recommend it to everybody who wants to play the jazz flügel without wanting to sound as a trombone.
Why I at first struggled with it I have no idea. It may be only me or it's the only traditional mouthpiece that may need an acclimation period.

N.B. I tried lots of Curry mouthpieces but I failed with them completely. I still own several of them especially for cornet but the DC is too bright for me, the VC plays not as good as the very old cookie-cutter mp's I own, the only one I use (and then not too often) is a BBC with the Conn short shank on my 1942 80A.
Stock mouthpieces are in my world mouthpieces that are in the catalogue without special throats or backbores or other custom adjustments.
I have zero experience with C trumpets. I think about a 14D4 having the throat opened to a #24 or #25 and the bb reamed a bit for my rotary trumpet.
For George: you are right, I am not a person for a lot of mouthpieces but on the other side, so now and then I was caught by curiosity and the stupid-me found it justified to be pampered with some new mouthpiece to experiment with. I really tried most of them seriously for quite some time. Others failed immediately, the Curry B and BC cups, the Bach MV and some more. And I was so dumb to collect all kinds of 7C's and equals, I had almost thirty of them, just for fun.

[Just_Another_Hack]

You can still get a Yamaha mouthpiece for $50 here in the US. Probably the best value out there. 80% of trumpet players will never truly outplay a plane jane Yamaha mouthpiece, despite their best efforts.
_________________
Professional lower-split 3rd clarinet player.

[Jerry]

[Richard III]

Based on this thread, I pulled out a few of my Yamaha mouthpieces. I haven't tried any in years. They just sat in my box of mouthpieces. I really like the rim feel on these. I always thought of them as too common. Nothing special there. Yet, I'm still playing one of them and liking the sound. Maybe I'll be common today.
_________________
Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

[tptptp]

[Shifty]

And it all depends on the horn and the player.

I use Curry and Stork on my flugel.

Curry on my trumpet.

Curry, Stork or Wick on my Getzen cornet.

But on my Conn 28A, I've tried Curry, Stork, Getzen, Wick, and Bach 3, 9 and 10.5, but I keep coming back to my Bach 6 no letter. I call it "Joes" because I keep going back to it.
_________________
Getzen Eterna 700, Eterna 800
Conn Connstellation 28A, Victor 80A, Connqueror (1903)
ACB Doubler Flugelhorn

[Heinz]

Delano, did you also tried the Yam 13B4?

I'm playing a plain simple 11B4 for quite some time now and I'm pretty happy with it.

[jvf1095]

[jvf1095]

Discussing whether a mouthpiece is considered "stock" or not; I guess one might categorize some Bach's as stock. A 7C comes to mind as it probably came with many trumpets sold as a stock item. Even a 5C or 3C. Along those lines, would one consider a "C" cup type mouthpiece stock, say as opposed to Parduba double cups which are not so stock; along with E & F cups, not so stock either. (Or a Bobby Shrew Lead or Jazz)?

[ek1986]

In my experience, when someone says “stock”, what they mean is that the mouthpiece throat and backbore have not been altered.

For example a “stock” Bach 7C, 3C and 1-1/4C all come with a 27 throat and a 10 backbore from the factory. The throat can be opened with a reamer by a repairman or at home. If you open the throat one drill bit size from the “stock” default, you would be taking the mouthpiece to a 26 throat. Making it a 26 throat and 10 backbore (not a “stock” mouthpiece anymore).

Backbores can also be altered but that’s best done by a repairman. Backbore possibilities don’t necessarily go by size but also by shape (eg. 10, 24, 76, 117).

These modifications can have an impact on intonation, sound color and response. Classical/orchestral players do this often in order to compensate for intonation challenges on the C trumpet.

I hope this helps!

[jvf1095]

Ok, I get it. Conceptually, it's like a car is "showroom stock" compared to one that has been modified.

[enrico]

I ask Delano what he thinks of the Yamaha Bobby Shew Jazz (no lead), in general and also compared to other similar mouthpieces.