Lip Slurs.

Goldenchops55 · Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2002 12:42 pm Post subject:

Hello all,
This summer I am really working on range and endurance. I have been doing Irons every day and have found a great way to build endurance. I stay with a set of groups for a week, or however long it takes me to play them all strain free, and repeat them one more time every day. LIke by the 7th day I play through each fingering set 8 times. My question is, should I do lip slurs every day, or should I do them every other day? Thanks.

_Don Herman · Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2002 11:17 pm Post subject:

Should you do lip slurs everyday? Sure! But, not to the exclusion of other things. If your practice time is limited, you may need to balance things out by working them every other day. This will also gives your chops a day off if you're working endurance hard. Another suggestion is to play the exercises using different tonguing models -- e.g. tongue all notes; slur two tongue two; slur one, tongue two; tongue the first, slur two, tongue two; etc. You can spice it up a bit to keep it interesting this way. And, it takes more air to tongue them, so you'll work breath support a bit harder. Finally, you can vary the tempo -- once you can do it fast, it can be... interesting... to slow waaay down and see how you do. Can be humbling when all of a sudden you have time to think of what each note is. Trust me on this.

HTH - Don
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Don Herman/Monument, CO
"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music." - Aldous Huxley

Schilkewilkie · Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2002 6:04 am Post subject:

LIP SLURS ARE YOUR TICKET FOR RANGE...

But not really endurance...

To build endurance AND range at the same time (great deal, right?), do LLLLONNNGGG and SSSLLLLOOOWWW lip slurs excercises, and then hold the last note until your chops crap out. That way, you truly understand how strong your chops are.

I agree with the previous poster, in his statement regarding doing slow lip slurs. I used to do them fast, and then I started doing them slowly...it is VERY humbling.
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pedaltonekid · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Nov 2001 Posts: 1711

Ok to do them everyday, but don't push to the extreme limits of range everyday on them. Every 3rd day or so do the Irons exercises (or Schossberg) with a tuner. Play them very slow and make sure everynote is right on. This is much harder than it sounds, but it will really help you get a feel for what the interval distances really are.
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Goldenchops55 · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 12:25 pm Post subject:

I have another question. After I do lip slurs, I always feel as if I need to revitalize my lips. I play a low F# for 3 minutes until my lips start to tingle. This seems to help my endurance greatly, since my next practice session is 30 minutes later(30/30). My question is, will playing the low F# counter and negate the effects of lip slurs, which are used to strengthen the lips?

Nicholas Dyson · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 12:45 pm Post subject:

absolutely not! Playing those low notes will relax those muscles that can tend to be tense after a strenous (endurance and range) work out. I would also say that you just need to concentrate on playing with a nice, open sound down there.

I believe it was PedalToneKid or Charly Raymond that spoke of the benefits of playing those notes as quietly as possible. I believe they said that playing in that register at a very soft volume forces (I hate using that word) better aperture control, which would help you out upstairs.

Check out the 'Mouthpiece on Red of Lip' thread. Charly et al, get cracking in a good, gentleman-ly debate about whether or not upper register playing is a matter of strength, balance, or a balance of those.

Also, check out the site: http://www.trumpetteacher.net

Jeff Smiley's site has a wealth of information that can help you to better understand what you're dealing with.

Also, have a look at 'Advanced Lip Flexibilities' by Charles Colin. It's split up into 3 volumes that each work you out a little differently, all while focusing (in different degrees according to the volume #) on range, endurance and flexibility, not neccasariiily (if you're going to spell it wrong, go big!) in that order.

Hope this helps!

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Nick Dyson
Seattle, Washington
"...many recording sessions are 98% boredom, 2% terror. If you were in the trumpet section for these dates, reverse those figures."
-Jeff Haskell, re: the Sept. '56 sessions for MF's 'Birdland Dreamband'

[ This Message was edited by: Nicholas Dyson on 2002-06-23 15:49 ]

dbacon · Heavyweight Member Joined: 11 Nov 2001 Posts: 8592

Goldenchops55 · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 7:42 pm Post subject:

Okay, something new. Instead of increasing my range, I am trying to get better control over it. I think a controlled High F will be PLENTY high enough for high school. I am doing two things to get control over, and strengthen what I have. I am playing simple church hymns up an octave, and playing from low F# to High E five times. THen I do pedal tones to relax my chops. I do this for 15mins., 3 hours after I have finished my last practice session, to make sure my chops are fresh. Will this help me or hurt me?

PH · Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2002 6:08 am Post subject:

That's perfect!

To get control over the notes you already own, there is nothing like playing broad beautiful melodies in the upper register. I like to play jazz ballads beginning in the original key and transpose them up chromatically (resting in between each chorus) until I fold. If I sound good playing "I Can't Get Started" in C then I do it in Db, then D, then Eb...

Also, playing lead means you really need to be able to articulate in the upper register as well as playing long lines and picking off tag notes. I like to take the first 3 or 4 exercises from the Arban's book sections on double and triple tongueing. I play them where they are written as they are written. Then I repeat them using all single tongue. If that goes well for 2 or 3 days in a row I will do them transposed a half step higher for the next week or so until it goes well in that key. As I develop I keep raising the key by a half step. Incidentally, this also improves your knowledge and facility in the "hard" keys.

Goldenchops55 · Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2002 9:11 am Post subject:

Should I do this every day or every other day?

ByroTrumpet · Regular Member Joined: 10 Jul 2002 Posts: 77

Hi,

Lip slurs definately help your high range and can be very beneficial if you want to do tricks up there like shakes or rips or what not. But anyway, slurs can also be helpful if you have a problem with resetting to get to your upper register. can you slur from low C to high C without resetting? You want to be able to be all over the horn w/o having to reset and it can only make trumpet playing easier.

Good thoughts everyone!
Byron

SHS_Trumpet · Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2002 9:24 am Post subject:

I used to do slurs all the time I haven't been practicing alot lately but I do believe that lip slurs have helped my endurance, helped my high register, halped my lip trills and all my jazz tricks so all you need is slurs. do be do be do
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Andrew Fowler
MYNWA
"90% of trumpet music is below high C"

TrainWreckJ · New Member Joined: 16 Jul 2002 Posts: 9

Hey Goldenchops! I used to do a lot of exercises like the ones you mentioned back in my hardcore lead days. They work, and what you mentioned seems to make a good session, but I wouldn't do it everyday.

Like every muscle in the body, your chops get stronger with exercise, but like every other muscle, if you train one too hard, ie, biceps, you won't develop. I'm not saying that the face muscles are all that specified, but if you do nothing buy high notes, you'll burn out, and won't go anywhere. So I'd think practicing something that focuses the opposite end of the spectrum is good.

What I used to do is rotate the high etude/scales (which, tongued and slurred, also give you better slot/placement control) with articulation days. After a high day, pull out the arban double/triple sections, and play them normallly, then softer, and softer, but make sure the notes are full. Eventually, try to play them as "pop tones", where you only hear the note "pop" when you tongue. Anyone else ever do this?

If anyone agrees/disagrees/wants to add/subtract; feel free. I know this routine absolutely DID NOT work for a friend of mine. But it seems to be working for you so far Goldenchops, so.. give it a go

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Goldenchops55 · Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2002 1:17 pm Post subject:

I don't have specific days where I only do speciific things. I do Caruso first thing in the morning. After Lunch I do Irons for 30 mins/rest 60mins/Arbans 30mins/rest 60mins/Clarke, and etudes 30mins/rest 60mins/20mins of long tones every two days before I go to bed/warm down with low soft notes. That is pretty much what I do every day. I make it a point to always feel fresh throughout the day. I practice until my chops are tired, then warm down and do the next session an hour later. I never play past fatigue. Will this routine get me anywhere?
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ByroTrumpet · Regular Member Joined: 10 Jul 2002 Posts: 77

hey man,

I think it sounds like you are on the right track! Sounds like you got a solid routine going. A variation you might want to do is switch some of the parts of your practice like switching up arbans, etudes and clarkes. Keep the pace going and nothing can stop you!

oh yeah how about some solo's in there like the haydn or hummel concerto. Maybe some orchestra exceprts or some jazz playing. All the method stuff is supposed to help you play music better so make sure you keep on playing music. I'm only saying that because you didn't really write a music portion in your routine.

Its like an athlete, a baseball player can work his upperbody to be able to hit the ball out of the park, but if he misses batting practice, then he won't be at the top of his game.

Hope this helps!
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Byron

If there is anything that I stated here that someone doesn't agree with or if it is just plain wrong. Let me know (be professional about it), because I want to learn more. Have a great day everyone!