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kimisan
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 15, 2005 8:26 am    Post subject: Getting Started Question Reply with quote

I am playing the trumpet again after about a 27 years. (I'm 51). I'm in the first week of MCFB and using the six notes as a warm up a couple of times a day. Recently, a teacher had given me a mouthpiece buzzing routine to do as a warmup. Is the mouthpiece buzzing routine still a good thing to do after the MCFB routines? I'm also playing etudes from the Clarke and Arbans books. Thanks.
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_bugleboy
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 15, 2005 9:16 am    Post subject: Re: Getting Started Question Reply with quote

kimisan wrote:
I'm in the first week of MCFB and using the six notes as a warm up a couple of times a day.


Be aware that you might want to view the "weekly" lesson assignments in MCFB as 2 weeks or 3 weeks. As you progress further into the book you may want to wait a month before moving on.

kimisan wrote:
Recently, a teacher had given me a mouthpiece buzzing routine to do as a warmup.


Mpc buzzing is great. You should always follow the mpc drill with the same exercise on the trumpet. It could be the first thing you play every day. I do a few minutes on the leadpipe and then the Six Notes as the first thing that I play.

kimisan wrote:
I'm also playing etudes from the Clarke and Arbans books.


Both good books when combined with Caruso exercises.
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kimisan
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 15, 2005 1:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Getting Started Question Reply with quote

Quote:
I do a few minutes on the leadpipe and then the Six Notes as the first thing that I play.


What does "on the leadpipe" mean?
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_bugleboy
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2005 6:46 am    Post subject: Re: Getting Started Question Reply with quote

kimisan wrote:

What does "on the leadpipe" mean?


Long tones on the trumpet with the tuning slide removed so the only thing your blowing through is the mpc in the lead pipe. Depending on the length of your leadpipe, you will get a low F or E (trumpet notes). I play a Yamaha and get an E ... most trumpets get an F, I think. Anyway, just hold some long tones for a few minutes on the note you get.

There has been quite a bit written about the leadpipe by me and others on this forum and others on the TH. It's a good way to get the lips vibrating.
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someone
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea, MCFB came today, and I'm starting the routine.
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Junior Vega
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 2:51 pm    Post subject: He did.it's just that intervals were involve later on. Reply with quote

brnt99 wrote:
I am a newbie checking things out. I have been doing the six notes exercise and I am seeing results.It seems logical to me that as one strengthens the lips that he should expand the six notes exercise upwards.So why didn't Caruso suggest this.

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flugaler
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 9:29 pm    Post subject: Carmine Caruso Reply with quote

I had the fortunate oppportunity to be instructed in the Carmine Caruso method by Dick Hammergren. I studied for approximatly a year, about once a month, as he would come out from Vegas to San Diego to give lessons. What an awesome experience, and so much pshychology behind the teaching.
I'm wondering, I haven't seen any postings about light pressure of the mouthpeice on the lips. Of coarse this is my first posting on this site.
Another thing that was huge for me was the realization that many players think they can't play past a certain high note, and give up. (those players including me) The seconds and thirds helped me get through that mental block. Trying to play the note that isn't there, as though it is. Later on, you'll discover your actually playing it, then gradually working through the next.
I often wondered of the possibility of someone producing a video instruction series of this method. I beleive it would pay off huge. I'd sure buy it.
I really appreciated Dicks ability to make you feel good about yourself, even if you hadn't done the excersizes completely. I always walked away excited about the method.
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PH
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not certain what you mean in your comment about "light pressure".

Carmine always said that when doing his exercises there was no such thing as too much pressure. He said you should use all the pressure you need and all the pressure you want.

Pressure is a symptom of trouble and not a cause for problems. In trying to play with little or no pressure people are focusing on curing the symptoms rather than the underlying malady. This would be like taking something for a headache when you had a brain tumor.

People only use mouthpiece pressure as a compensating device for an inefficient playing system. If you follow the Four Rules when practicing Caruso calisthenics you will not hurt your chops, regardless of how much pressure you use. If you are someone who currently uses "too much pressure" you will find that as you practice these calisthenics properly the inefficiencies in your playing mechanics will gradually go away. At that point you will only use as much pressure as you are required to use in a given circumstance and never "too much". Voila!
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dbacon
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"I had the fortunate oppportunity to be instructed in the Carmine Caruso method by Dick Hammergren."

I know Dick, worked with him in Denver, and I'd recomend you take some lessons from Bob Findley if you'd like exposer to Caruso.
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mateo
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

can someone suggest something to help relaxation, particularly in the throat, while doing the caruso stuff. I really like these exercises but I dont do them everyday because I start to play really tight, that is, when I do them every day, my tuning slide comes out further every day. relaxing the emboucher helps but I hear that is not the best thing for these particular studies. (?) any ideas?

mateo
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PH
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you do them correctly (following the Four Rules) you will find that the tension gradually goes away...maybe not so much when you are doing calisthenic practice, but there will be less tension when you do other playing. The whole point of calisthenic practice is to prepare you for playing music.
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LeeC
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some words I copied and pasted from Charly Raymond's original post. These are valuable valuable words for anyone trying to work out chop issues:


Caruso exercises are calisthenic. This means that they are muscle training and conditioning activities that have one goal in mind: to prepare the muscles to play music. They usually don't sound like music nor are they supposed to, necessarily. This is not always an easy mind set for a lot of players who have been exposed to most teaching methods that insist on using the sound of the student as a yardstick of success and correctness of embouchure. Not so with the Caruso method.


Whoa boy does that ever hit home!!!

I'm sure that some of my ideas wouldn't coincide with standard Caruso studies but I believe in the above words more than any other statement written in trumpet pedagogy technique.

Check this out: I'm a person who has learned the trumpet three times over. Not a comeback player per se but one who has put his chops together three different ways. OK now disregard for a minute the fact that the previous concept is definitely NOT a part of Caruso studies. The more important concept is that at the beginning of these three chop set up endeavors I sounded terrible. This ratty tone continued for sometime in each case.

But what happened? Eventually I came through and out the other side with at least a three and a half octave register (one has four & a half) and the tone did eventually follow technique. But not vice versa.

How many players do you know who followed tone and ended up with a mere two and a half octave range without much endurance? Probably most of your peers coming up. Of course there were always exceptions. People who seemed a bit naturally inclined to have an easier go of the whole matter.

The sports equivalent was Jack Nicklaus who broke 80 the first time he ever played golf.

So those people who "follow tone" successfully may very well be from among those players more physiologically predisposed to play efficiently. For them good tone was the main direction they had to go in. So they naturally assume the rest of us should follow their direction. However they had a much shorter path to follow than the average player.

If you've struggled (like the great majority of us) there is something very important for you in Charly's words. Lemme repeat them again just because they are so worthy:


Caruso exercises are calisthenic. This means that they are muscle training and conditioning activities that have one goal in mind: to prepare the muscles to play music. They usually don't sound like music nor are they supposed to, necessarily. This is not always an easy mind set for a lot of players who have been exposed to most teaching methods that insist on using the sound of the student as a yardstick of success and correctness of embouchure. Not so with the Caruso method.
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PH
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just one comment.

The Caruso procedures are for calisthenic practice only. This obviously applies to the Four Rules. However, it also applies to other things such as whether or not to pursue a beautiful tone.

When playing CC exercises the discipline to adhere to is mechanical, procedural, and rhythmic. Over time, practicing clinically in this way will create an efficient approach to the instrument. This efficient approach eventual becomes part of all that you play.

CC practice should probably take anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour a day for most people using this approach. That means that at least 50% of the practice one does each day should NOT be calisthenic exercises in my opinion.

CC calisthenic practice frees one to focus on playing beautifully when playing music.

When working on music in the practice room, rehearsing, or performing one's total focus should be on beauty. This includes pursuing the most gorgeous tone one can possibly get on every single phrase.
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craigtrumpet
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 7:00 am    Post subject: Question for Pat Reply with quote

PH wrote:
Carmine had me do six notes and seconds first thing every day, too. Even though the schedule in MCFB for review of all the intervals (which was virtually identical in the earlier "Caruso On Breath Control" book) has seconds on Monday (or whatever), I always did six notes, seconds, then one regular interval du jour (3rds on Monday, 4ths on Tuesdacy, etc.). this kept me from having to double up on major 7ths and octaves at week's end.


Hey Pat, I also recently got MCFB and Flexus and would like to incororate them into my practice but as an Adam student am not sure how to go about this even after reading the stickys. You mentioned above that while you were with Caruso you did "6 notes and seconds first thing everyday" so I am asuming you wern't blowing the pipe first. Should I do some of the MCFB stuff mentioned in these posts first then take a break and then blow pipe and routine? Or should I do Routine and MCFB stuff in a second set? Or is there anywhere in The Routine that I could incorporate some MCFB stuff and if so where? How did you get these two teaching styles to work hand-in-hand?
I hope I didn't open a can of worms here Looking forward to seeing you next week at the Aebersold Camp.
Craig
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Jerry Freedman
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

our original moderator, Charly Raymond advocated doing leap pipe buzzing before the 6 notes. YMMV
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piston
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*** My questions begin with ex. 1 which I believe you call the six notes. Charley states;
<1.) Do the Six Notes for a week. Once or twice a day is sufficient.>

It is written with a repeat. Do I do the repeat? ***

Yes. The exercise is the six notes with one repeat. You should read and follow the instructions exactly, absolutely as written. In this particular example a repeat is marked instead of physically rewriting the six notes and therefore having an additional eleven bars on the page. One student told Carmine he had done 25 repeats. Carmine's response was that it wasn't necessary. He didn't tell him NOT to do it; just that it wasn't necessary.

*** What does "once" mean? This is not clear to me. ***

"Once" means one exercise in its entirety. In its entirety (one complete playing) The Six Notes exercise is actually a 12 note exercise.

*** I am to breath in through the nose only. But do I have to keep my corners firm throughout the entire exercise. I can relax my corners while keeping the mpc in contact and breath in through my nose. ***

Carmine states at the end of Rule #2,

"While breathing, maintain the same mouthpiece pressure and tension used for the previous notes. Do not be concerned with sound or pitch."

So the answer is, "Yes." Think of doing his exercises as if breathing was unnecessary. If you could exhale somehow for 4-5 minutes then nose breathing would be an unnecessary part of the modus operandi (my term, not Carmine's). Because breathing IS necessary, Carmine made nose breathing a part of his method to keep the original setting in place throughout a given exercise and to maintain the lip tension and mouthpiece pressure throughout the exercise. The reason for this is to reduce the moving parts in sound production (for calisthenic practise purposes) to a minimum of one, the blow. Tension is not movement, but going from a relaxed state to a tensed state is. A lot of people mistakenly think that Carmine Caruso was preoccupied with the lips. His whole teaching method was aimed at isolating the air stream, which he called the blow, and developing it. In the grand scheme of sound production, the blow came second only to timing. In private lessons, Carmine had a great deal to say about the lips and what they should be doing. He had extensive lip building exercises and routines to develop the lips to be efficient in sound production. None of this is in his book, but will be presented, over time, in this forum by me and the other knowledgeable posters like Pat Harbison and Wayne Trager.

BY THE WAY, IF I MAKE NO COMMENT ON THE POSTS OF PAT AND WAYNE, IT SHOULD BE INTERPRETED TO MEAN THAT I AM IN COMPLETE AGREEMENT WITH WHAT THEY HAVE SAID. Both teachers should be applauded for taking the time to share their knowledge and experiences and I, for one, am grateful that they are willing to post in this forum. I'm also happy to be gaining new insights from their posts.

*** Somebody was talking a bit about the volumne level that should be played. Suppose you can play the exercise softly. Should it be played softly? Should it be played loud?
Thanks for the insights. ***

The exercises should be played at your most comfortable volume level. This, of course, does not apply to the SLS and LSL exercises. But for all others, play at YOUR comfort level. This will likely be different than someone else's and so different students may have different absolute volume levels. It is unnecessary to introduce any kind of dynamics into the exercises. Dynamics are addressed in the SLS and LSL routines.

I am unable to find any statement in Carmine's book that addresses the volume level of non SLS/LSL exercises. So a good point has been raised. If this is an oversight by Carmine then hopefully this thread has clarified that shortcoming.

Regards,
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tomba51
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

piston wrote:


The exercises should be played at your most comfortable volume level. This, of course, does not apply to the SLS and LSL exercises. But for all others, play at YOUR comfort level. This will likely be different than someone else's and so different students may have different absolute volume levels. It is unnecessary to introduce any kind of dynamics into the exercises. Dynamics are addressed in the SLS and LSL routines.

I am unable to find any statement in Carmine's book that addresses the volume level of non SLS/LSL exercises. So a good point has been raised. If this is an oversight by Carmine then hopefully this thread has clarified that shortcoming.

Regards,


Just to add a little bit to the above discussion about dynamics. Carmine often talked about playing the exercises at "room temperature". By that he meant to play them at your most comfortable dynamic. In other words, do not try to play loud, and do not try to play soft. Just play whatever comes out naturally.

Tom
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piknrol
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I started Caruso, my playing was in such a mess that second space A was the top of my range! Now I am playing better than I have ever thought I would and playing is fun again. It saved me.
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dorganu36
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am a newbie checking things out. I have been doing the six notes exercise and I am seeing results.It seems logical to me that as one strengthens the lips that he should expand the six notes exercise upwards.So why didn't Caruso suggest this.
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tomba51
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dorganu36 wrote:
I am a newbie checking things out. I have been doing the six notes exercise and I am seeing results.It seems logical to me that as one strengthens the lips that he should expand the six notes exercise upwards.So why didn't Caruso suggest this.


That's an advanced exercise that Carmine only gave to experienced students. You can find some advanced variations on the 6 note exercise, as well as many other exercises, in the book "Flexus" by Laurie Frink and John McNeil.

Tom
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