Yamaha 8310Z vs. 6310Z

[davo]

Hi gang,

Would anyone know the differences in inside diameter of the upper and lower legs of the main tuning slides of the 6310Z and the 8310Z?

The reason I am asking is because at the end of a long gig, I tire on the 8310Z. I think the main tuning slide of the 6310Z is a bit smaller and would provide a bit more resistance. I want to confirm this before I order one to try.

Thanks in advance,
Dave

[Trptbenge]

Dave,

The 8310Z has a large bore tuning slide which the 6310Z does not. Though, the 6310Z is not made anymore you can find some deals on used ones. The sound and feedback are very different on the two horns. the 8310Z has a warmer sound with better player feedback. You may need only to change you mouthpiece backbore or work to get used to the larger feel.

Mike
_________________
It's the sound that makes the difference!

[davo]

Thanks, Mike.

I had a 6310Z and sold that to buy the 8310Z which I prefer for the features you mentioned. It plays quite open as compared to the 6310Z.

Thanks for your response.

Dave

[Pete]

Hi Mike and Dave,

I respectfully disagree with the info on the tuning slide. I have info on both horns, and both have .463 tuning slides. I've owned both horns, and presently still have and play the 8310Z. There is more of a difference in the leadpipe between horns, as well as the bell being slightly different. Both are step bore horns, like the Schilke B6/B7. The Yamaha having a .445 valve section, and the Schilke B6 having a .450 valve section.

I've used a Curry heavy bottom cap on the third valve in the past which seems to tighten up the slots a bit. I now use the Harrelson 3/8" bottom caps. They don't weigh as much, so you can use all three.

Pete

[davo]

Pete.

Thanks for your input. I'll have to try a different mouthpiece with a tighter backbore to give me a bit more resistance.

Thanks again,
Dave

[JonathanM]

Dave; Great thread; I've read and discussed the difference in the 6310Z and the 8310Z previously but only have experience with the 8310Z.

For me, I can't get used to a small backbore mouthpiece with my Z. I've successfully used a shallow with other horns but seem to get backed up when I try it with the Z - let me know how you do if you can.

I've gone to a medium or deep mouthpiece and a medium to large backbore and love the sound...But the larger mouthpiece and backbore does have it's limitations. I recall a thread with a recent comeback player that took a lesson not long ago with Bobby Shew. When he did I think I recall him writing (here on a TH thread) that an 8310Z and a 6310Z were both present, he played them both and preferred the 6310Z for his situation.

Best of luck and keep us informed...
_________________
Jonathan Milam
Trumpets: 18043B, 18043*, 18043 Sterling Silver +, 18037 SterlingSilver+, Benge 4x, Olds: '34 Symphony, '47 Super, '52 Recording
Flugle: Strad 182
Puje: American Belle
Cornet: Olds Recording & Super

[supportlivejazz]

When the 8310Z came out there were several lengthy threads about the differences. If you do a search you can probably pull up those old posts and include the links in this thread. good luck. As I remember the consensus was that the 8310 was more open and less likely to back up when pushed... but there was more.
_________________
Conn 6B
1940s Blessing Artist
Olds LA Special Model Cornet






"I'm not apologizing, I am what I am. There'll be no compromising, I don't give a damn."

[trpt.com]

All I know is that the tuning slide is completely interchangeable between the 6310Z, the 8310Z, and the 8340EM (I know because I tried).

I also have an M/K aftermarket tuning slide that fits each of these horns perfectly.

I can't imagine that the 'bore' or inside diameter of these slides is any different among the three. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

PS - I have an extra tuning slide that came from a 6310Z. PM me if interested.
_________________
--Jim
www.trpt.com

[hilgenboogie]

I've owned both, and I currently play the 8310Z. Although they feel different, they both have medium bores and large bore tuning slides (hence the "step bore" name.)
For me, I could never get the 6310Z to "open up" in the upper register, but with the 8310 it's easy. The bell bead is different, giving more feedback to the player, and I believe Bob Malone redesigned the leadpipe when he came on board. This might be what you're feeling at the end of the gig, Davo.
Jonathan, if you're having trouble with smaller backbores on yours, you might need to back off the air more as you ascend. The horn doesn't need to be "forced" to do anything, like a Bach or other larger horn would. Backing off, especially with a smaller mouthpiece can really help you stay up in the higher register of the 8310.
FWIW,
Matt

[davo]

Thanks to all for your opinions and inputs.

I've tried more air support in the upper register and it seems to work fine. I'll have to remember that when I tire. I think I'm just more used to a bit tighter horn. I'm switching between a Reeves Raptor and the 8310Z. I thought the Raptor was open, but the Z horn is even more so, especially above the staff.

I just tried some of my Warburton rims with various backbores and I was surprised to find that the timbre changes more than the blow changes.

I'll just have to use a different approach with each horn.

Thanks for all the responses.

Dave

[jhaysom]

I've reported previously that, when I got my 8310Z, I was somewhat disappointed in its ease of playing compared to my 6310Z. That disappointment went away when I had a precision valve alignment done on the 8310Z. They were quite badly mis-aligned according to Ron Partch, Toronto's valve alignment guru.
_________________
John Haysom
Ottawa, Ontario
Canada
Yamaha 8310ZS trumpet
Yamaha 6310ZS trumpet
Courtois flugel
1941 King Silvertone cornet
1941 King 2B valve trombone
Kanstul 920 piccolo
etc.

[Nathan Hatcher]

trpt.com,

I had no idea that M/K made tuning slides for the 6310Z. How did you choose the replacement slide? What characteristics did it change?

I have a 6310Z that I used as my main horn from 2001-2004. I love the fast, fast response and the ease of play- truly amazing. I do find, like many others have written before, that I have a hard time in the upper register beyond C as the horn seems to close down (compared to my other horns). I would love to remedy this issue as I have not been able to figure out the upper register by experimenting with my playing alone.

Nate

[patdublc]

I really liked my 6310Z when I bought it. Then, I bought an 8310Z on a whim and liked it even better. Then, I bought a couple of the M/K tuning slides for the 8310Z and liked it better still. I have the bronze and nickel silver versions of the tuning slide.
I sold the 6310Z and use the 8310Z more than any other horn.
_________________
Pat Shaner
Play Wedge Mouthpieces by Dr. Dave exclusively.
Experiment with LOTS of horn makes and models.

[KPC517]

Give the 8335LA a try. Some of the same components, but the feel is very different, at least to me. I get compliments on the "fatness" of the sound and it really sizzles in the upper register.
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1963 Conn Connstellation 36B
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[Mikester]

I have owned a 6310Z and 8335LA (was with Wayne at Bob's shop when they built second prototype).

Played a few 8310Zs and bought a new one yesterday.

Below link has short video describing some change from 6310Z to 8310Z.

http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/CDA/ContentDetail/ModelSeriesDetail/0,,CNTID%25253D26667%252526CTID%25253D551176,00.html

[trpt.com]

[John Miconi]

Jim,

How does using the M/K slide on your 8340EM effect the playability of the horn?

I picked up the 8340EM last month. Great horn!!! It only took me a year after buying your EM1 mpc to finally pick up the horn!!!

John
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John Miconi

[dbacon]

6310Z is a better soloists trumpet, 8310's better for Lead Players....

[fraserhutch]

[dbacon]