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SLC3271
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Joined: 27 Jan 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:29 pm    Post subject: GR Mouthpieces Reply with quote

I crrently use a Bach 7c mouthpiece on my Burbank 900 trumpet. I have heard a lot of good things about GR mouthpieces but am not sure what model to use. Any suggestions out there?
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silverhorn
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:46 pm    Post subject: Re: GR Mouthpieces Reply with quote

SLC3271 wrote:
I crrently use a Bach 7c mouthpiece on my Burbank 900 trumpet. I have heard a lot of good things about GR mouthpieces but am not sure what model to use. Any suggestions out there?


GR 64M would be the closest to your 7C but you may benefit from a GR consultant or contacting Brian Scriver, Gary Radtke, and the rest of the staff at GR. They are very helpful and can direct you to the equipment that works best for you.
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tommy t.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:16 pm    Post subject: Re: GR Mouthpieces Reply with quote

SLC3271 wrote:
I crrently use a Bach 7c mouthpiece on my Burbank 900 trumpet. I have heard a lot of good things about GR mouthpieces but am not sure what model to use. Any suggestions out there?


Generally, you would invest in an expensive mouthpiece because you need to solve a problem, not because you want to duplicate what you have.

Why are you considering a change? That's the first question the GR consultant is going to ask.

Tommy T.
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ScottA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tommy: BINGO!

"What are you trying to accomplish by changing mouthpieces?"

That or some form of it is always my first question.

SLC3271--please feel free to contact me or any of the GR trained folks. We would be happy to answer your questions!
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Trptbenge
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GR mouthpieces are great mouthpieces! In order to get the true benefit from then you need the right size and they are too expensive to buy, try and resale. A consultant like, Scott, can help you find the correct size for you. I can speak from experience on Scott's expertise. I would think that any consultant that has been put through the intense training GR puts then through would be very good. GR is a very intense and passionate person about his mouthpieces.

His first question is very telling because it easy to get into just switching mouthpieces without a true picture of why you want to switch. I have probably had dozens and dozens of mouthpieces before finding GR. If you live close to a consultant, like Scott, I would encourage you to contact them. There is a playing test they can put you through - along with questions that can help you determine the best fit for you.

Good Luck!

Mike
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Mark Bradley
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A GR 64M (should that be the size you decide on) will play so much better than your old 7C you'll be STUPIFIED!
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butxifxnot
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 6:24 am    Post subject: Re: GR Mouthpieces Reply with quote

SLC3271 wrote:
I crrently use a Bach 7c mouthpiece on my Burbank 900 trumpet. I have heard a lot of good things about GR mouthpieces but am not sure what model to use. Any suggestions out there?


I second the comment about having a specific problem in mind. A teacher can help you out with this, to give you an idea whether or not a problem you have can be aided by a mouthpiece change.

Be wary! Although GRs are very good, going to a salesman/GR consultant with no idea of what's going on and nothing in mind is like going to a mechanic when you have no car troubles and asking him to examine your car. He WILL recommend a GR for you to use, rest assured. This is only good if you are changing for a reason defined by you, not him. The mechanic may give you a better engine...if you have the $$$ for it, you'll probably be better off simply because it's a great product. But with the total amount of money that you're probably going to dish out on your safari, it's best to avoid unnecessary changes, IMHO.
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B. Scriver
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 6:40 am    Post subject: Re: GR Mouthpieces Reply with quote

butxifxnot wrote:
SLC3271 wrote:
I crrently use a Bach 7c mouthpiece on my Burbank 900 trumpet. I have heard a lot of good things about GR mouthpieces but am not sure what model to use. Any suggestions out there?


Be wary! Although GRs are very good, going to a salesman/GR consultant with no idea of what's going on and nothing in mind is like going to a mechanic when you have no car troubles and asking him to examine your car. He WILL recommend a GR for you to use, rest assured. This is only good if you are changing for a reason defined by you, not him.


This is not true. I have had players in for a consultation and for one reason or another I would NOT sell them a mouthpiece. It may have been because their present mouthpiece was a good match for them, or they had some serious chop work to take care of before buying another mouthpiece. I have even had GR players in for a second consult and leave with the same mouthpiece they came in with.

No GR Consultant has to sell you a mouthpiece. The GR Playing Tests and Consultation process does all of the work. When the correct match is found, there is no comparison between the proper GR and any other mouthpiece - including an improperly matched GR!

So, WILL a GR consultant recommend a mouthpiece to you? Only if it is the correct match to YOU and YOUR horn.

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com
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ScottA
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can absolutely second Brian's comments. One of the most memorable things I took away from my training with GR was how many times he said something to the effect of:

"Not selling someone a mouthpiece is better than selling them the wrong mouthpiece."

I have certainly had players leave without a new GR after a consult. Not very often but it does happen. Sometimes there is an issue with a horn that needs to be resolved, sometimes the players quite simply need more time under their belt. For instance if they can't get through the playing tests chances are a new mouthpiece is not going to help them at that particular stage in their development. And sometimes the piece they are used to just works better for them.

I also allow a 2 week return/re-evaluate period if the piece does not work well for them. I am happy to say that in the many years I have been doing the consults that has happened just one time.

I don't believe any players need to be worried about being "sold" a piece. The results of the playing tests will speak for themselves.
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AYates
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have on several occasions recommended a person stay on their non-GR mouthpiece when it is already a good match for them. It is ludicrous to assume a consultant would push something on someone for the purposes of peddling merchandise. The consultation process serves to guide and help someone make a good match and therefore have a more homogeneous experience with their instruments. We understand the alphabet soup and the GR system and help guide players to the correct match through listening both to what is coming out of the bell and what the player is feeling/thinking. The consultation process is really not subject to the opinion of the consultant. The player and his/her ears decide in the end every time in my experience.

And agreeing with Scott's GR quote - selling someone the wrong mouthpiece is a never-ending headache. Who would WANT that? I do everything in my power to make sure it isn't the wrong piece. I care about each individual that requests my advice equally and want nothing less than success and happiness for them and their instruments.
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tommy t.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My most successful mouthpiece change, producing the piece that I have been using for the last two years and which seems to me to be the ideal for me, was the result of an email exchange with GR consultant Bruce Lee. I selected Bruce to contact because I knew that he was personally familiar with my trumpet model and with the BE method.

I described my equipment (mouthpiece and horn) and my playing style and limits as honestly as I could. I mentioned the two, related, specific tone production problems that were bothering me (flubbed attacks on low notes and breathiness in low notes at low volume) that might be mouthpiece related. I mentioned that I was about to begin using the Balanced Embochure method to address a pair of chop problems (tension in the face and corners and rather small engagement of the upper lip) that were undoubtedly contributing to the same thing.

Bruce took a day and then responded with a GR recommendation. I asked if his answer would be different if he knew that I had previously been unhappy with a GR piece that Brian had (somewhat reluctantly because I had not had a consultation) sold me. Bruce responded that it would not make difference but that it would have eased his decision making because that piece was one of the alternatives he was considering for me. The fact that I was about to try some BE practices had made the difference in his final recommendation. (This is no criticism of Brian -- he urged me to do a consultation and I declined.) The point is that the more information your advisors, whoever they may be, have, the more likely they will do a good job for you.

Tommy T.
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AYates
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce Lee was the person to first put a GR in my hands in 2006 and he was very helpful in helping me choose one that worked for me as well (this all done via telephone and emails). Still, I was not properly fitted until I had a consult with Gary Radtke later that year. Even though I do this for other people, I would still need the guidance of Bri, Gary or any other consultant to help me make the best choice possible if I were making a drastic change of some kind in equipment or approach. It is along the same lines as a lawyer not representing himself in a court case. Another set of objective ears is a HUGE help in this scenario.
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Last edited by AYates on Fri Jan 29, 2010 11:56 am; edited 2 times in total
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tommy t.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AYates wrote:
It is along the same lines of a lawyer not representing himself in a court case.


I keep telling people that I wasn't that kind of a lawyer!!

Tommy T.
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AYates
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tommy t. wrote:
AYates wrote:
It is along the same lines of a lawyer not representing himself in a court case.


I keep telling people that I wasn't that kind of a lawyer!!

Tommy T.


LOLOLOL
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Ellsworth
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I currently play a SPARX 3MX, which is a wonderful fit for me. It has, according to Ted Sparks, a rim of his own design with a GR cup, throat and backbore. It's made by GR on a GR blank. Whatever the design, it gives me marvelous results. The more I play it, the less effort I expend. The slotting is particularly amazing and adds to the sense of effortlessness.

I was telling Ted just today that the rim reminds me somewhat of my Mount Vernon 3C. Years ago, I had that rim copied by Giardinelli. I still have both the Giardinelli rim, mounted on a 5M cup, and the original 3C. I like the SPARX much better than either.
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TrumpetFunk
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark Bradley wrote:
A GR 64M (should that be the size you decide on) will play so much better than your old 7C you'll be STUPIFIED!


Don't expect that the GR 'piece which best matches your current 'piece is the best one for you.

I found that after my consultation, I was suited to a much smaller mouthpiece than I expected. I wasn't seeking a small 'piece.

Though I still pull pieces out my drawer once in a while to re-try, I always fall back on my GR.

Thanks Brian
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B. Scriver
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ellsworth wrote:
I currently play a SPARX 3MX, which is a wonderful fit for me. It has, according to Ted Sparks, a rim of his own design with a GR cup, throat and backbore. It's made by GR on a GR blank. Whatever the design, it gives me marvelous results. The more I play it, the less effort I expend. The slotting is particularly amazing and adds to the sense of effortlessness.

I was telling Ted just today that the rim reminds me somewhat of my Mount Vernon 3C. Years ago, I had that rim copied by Giardinelli. I still have both the Giardinelli rim, mounted on a 5M cup, and the original 3C. I like the SPARX much better than either.


The Sparx, as all projects with Steve Haefner, Dennis Najoom and others were a team effort with GR. Many months to years went into some of these efforts.

Ted is the "cornet guy" and was looking for something to improve the cornet, GR is the "mouthpiece guy". There were specific goals in mind to develop the "Sparx rim", one goal was to bridge the gap of endurance vs vibrating surface so many "cornet players" have suffered with over the years. The description of the rim came from Ted, the Sparks rim was designed by GR using the GR Design Parameters and Ted's verbal descriptions. GR and Ted spent a lot of time talking about the cornet mouthpiece design. The goal was to break from the traditional while keeping the sound properties, furthermore, adding improved articulation, intonation, and efficiency GR's math provides. GR used his parameters to design the rim and it has the same bite as the standard GR. The rim is a little flatter, with a wider highpoint, sharper outer radius and a little wider. It is similar to other rims GR has previously designed and the parameters suited for Ted's needs keeping the GR standard bite.

All mouthpieces made by GR were designed by GR. Most projects were joints efforts but all the matching and math was done by GR. The process is similar to making a custom mouthpiece for someone and requires a lot of communication, time, play testing, and careful thought.

Ted is the "cornet guy". If you have cornet questions see the GR website or Sparx website.

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com
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Ellsworth
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

B. Scriver wrote:
The Sparx, as all projects with Steve Haefner, Dennis Najoom and others were a team effort with GR. Many months to years went into some of these efforts.

Ted is the "cornet guy" and was looking for something to improve the cornet, GR is the "mouthpiece guy"...


Brian,

Thanks for the clarification. BTW, I guess that I neglected to mention that my SPARX is a trumpet mouthpiece. I'm not sure if any others have been made, but, after my experience with this one, I certainly hope so.

I'm planning to have lunch with Ted sometime this week. I'm sure that we'll chat about the mouthpiece as well as many other things.

I'm sure that you're aware that Ted isn't just a "cornet guy." He plays trumpet as well, currently with the Ontario Philharmonic.

I'd like to get a modern mouthpiece for my Conn 85A cornet. As I'm sure you're aware, those antique Conns require a mouthpiece with a shorter shank and slightly different outside taper. I've discovered that Kanstull has made a few custom pieces for players of the old Conns. I'd love to be able to try one of Ted's pieces with the old ax, but having one custom built to fit the instrument would definitely be outside my tax bracket.
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interfx
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AYates wrote:
I have on several occasions recommended a person stay on their non-GR mouthpiece when it is already a good match for them. It is ludicrous to assume a consultant would push something on someone for the purposes of peddling merchandise. The consultation process serves to guide and help someone make a good match and therefore have a more homogeneous experience with their instruments. We understand the alphabet soup and the GR system and help guide players to the correct match through listening both to what is coming out of the bell and what the player is feeling/thinking. The consultation process is really not subject to the opinion of the consultant. The player and his/her ears decide in the end every time in my experience.

And agreeing with Scott's GR quote - selling someone the wrong mouthpiece is a never-ending headache. Who would WANT that? I do everything in my power to make sure it isn't the wrong piece. I care about each individual that requests my advice equally and want nothing less than success and happiness for them and their instruments.


I did a consult with Alex last fall, and can confirm there was no pressure at all... I was really surprised how small changes in a mouthpiece can make so much difference. I was surpirised by how some of the GR mouthpeices were easy to play, some models not good at all... The best part is the ability to play through 25+ different combinations all at the same sessopm. I was trying the "buy on Marketplace, eBay, and MPiece Express" only to realize that I was spending a lot of money - basically shooting in the dark, from others experiences...

I've been playing my 65 series mouthpieces and have adjusted now to them. I found I was overblowing my previous mouthpieces, and now have found it more efficient to play (and boosted my range a few steps up to High A-B).

Not sure if the GR did it by itself, but the consult with Alex was worth every $.

Good luck
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MarcusH
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What if someone is a comeback player who is working on building a new and more efficient embouchure? Is it best to wait or is it better to get a quality mouthpiece that will aid or otherwise speed up development? I had settled on a Yamaha Shew Jazz but I think it's actually been terrible for me, so I recently switched to a Bach 7C. The 7C isn't totally comfortable but it still feels much better than the Shew and my playing has improved.

I have a million questions but I haven't contacted anyone from GR yet. I figured I would start here for now.

Thanks!

Marcus
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